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Tripleskull



Joined: Oct 12, 2003

Post   Posted: Apr 22, 2018 - 22:57 Reply with quote Back to top

bghandras wrote:
Strider84 wrote:
bghandras wrote:

Based on the looks of it the complexity is on the high side, and would have probably preferred a slightly less balance as a trade off for less complexity.


We tried more or less this for the World Cup rules. I guess they are though a bit more on the less complexity side due to having a lot of not so used players participating.

I think there is a lot of room for simplification in a way that it leaves room for different builds. Let me take an example, what i would explore:
1. Getting tiers with 6,7,8,9, etc skills.
2. Allow the roster to buy an extra skill for a fixed TW amount (most likely 40k), or sell a skill for the same amount.
3. Allow teams to convert a single normal skill to a special skill for a fixed cost (most likely 20k).

I think the message would be much more simple, so much less complexity, but the strategic depth is almost as deep as now.


We thought a lot about introducing a coin worth some 20k/40k to do something around the lines you mention. I don't remember the full reason for not going in that direction but at least partly it was about limiting the access to loads of cash and star players. but with a limited number of "trades" it might have been a simpler system?
juck101



Joined: Nov 16, 2003

Post   Posted: Apr 22, 2018 - 23:59 Reply with quote Back to top

I like the rules pack. Plenty of tiers which is fair they way each has its own level which I can sense in. Goodluck
Tripleskull



Joined: Oct 12, 2003

Post   Posted: Apr 23, 2018 - 18:13 Reply with quote Back to top

Have you chosen to not play lizardmen because you consider them to be too weak?

How about pact, slann and vampire? Are they competitive in your opinion?
Tripleskull



Joined: Oct 12, 2003

Post   Posted: Apr 23, 2018 - 18:22 Reply with quote Back to top

juck101 wrote:
I like the rules pack. Plenty of tiers which is fair they way each has its own level which I can sense in. Goodluck


Thank you
Jokaero



Joined: Dec 24, 2004

Post 14 Posted: Apr 24, 2018 - 07:09 Reply with quote Back to top

I love this rule pack. Probably not very beginner friendly, but people could get used to it after a while. I never liked the idea that certain teams have to be weaker than others because of fluff or whatever. With these rules, all teams seem to get a chance of winning tourneys and even competitive players can look into all of the races and don't need to restrict themselves to the top 10. It's nice to play against so many different new builds. I always liked the roster building aspect of the game and this opens up so many new possibilities. Maybe it needs some more iterations to be completely balanced but IMO this is the way to go. Good job.
mawph



Joined: Jul 02, 2013

Post   Posted: Apr 24, 2018 - 10:15 Reply with quote Back to top

Tripleskull wrote:

Only loners are allowed a 2nd skill with a strength skill. Both skills most be strength skills.

Other players may pick a 2nd skill together with a general, agility or passing skill.

The 2nd skill is always a normal skill and always costs a special. The first skill is a normal or special (any table) depending on the players talents.

Hope this helps

I'm now a touch confused and think I may have done something wrong the DDO link in the NAF site describes it differently to the above quote (the Danish open rules for the tabletop version more closely match Tripleskull's quote).
Danish Open online rules @NAF website wrote:

A special skill is either a double skill or a normal skill on a player who has already taken 1 normal skill (in which case neither skill may be Piling On)

I've selected two Centaurs, one with Block/Surehands (seems legit under all quotes) and one with Block/Break Tackle. This seems legit under the rules I've just quoted from the NAF website, but not under the rules quoted by Tripleskulls (or the Tabletop Danish Open rules).

Is a block/break tackle bull centaur allowed?
mawph



Joined: Jul 02, 2013

Post   Posted: Apr 24, 2018 - 10:19 Reply with quote Back to top

for reference the Danish Open tabletop rules state:

Danish open tabletop rules @bloodbowl.dk wrote:

A special skill is either b) a normal skill on any player who has already taken a G, A or P skill

Which is different wording to the Danish Open Online rules.
mawph



Joined: Jul 02, 2013

Post   Posted: Apr 24, 2018 - 10:21 Reply with quote Back to top

I also enjoy talking to myself and creating quotes, it would appear Wink
PeteW



Joined: Aug 05, 2005

Post   Posted: Apr 24, 2018 - 11:14 Reply with quote Back to top

Jokaero has a dodge+BT ogre, so he is cheating too. Confused

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Tripleskull



Joined: Oct 12, 2003

Post   Posted: Apr 24, 2018 - 11:29 Reply with quote Back to top

The correct rules are here: http://bloodbowl.dk/onewebmedia/ATV2018-final.pdf

I will elaborate later. Block, break tackle and dodge, break tackle are both ok.

Sorry for the confusion
Strider84



Joined: Jun 03, 2009

Post   Posted: Apr 24, 2018 - 11:35 Reply with quote Back to top

The difference is me referencing an old ruleset in the original rulepack. That was my bad, the Danish open rules apply.

As to having a bc with block bt is fine and costs 1 special skill as bt is a normal skill as second skill to block( a g skill.)

A dodge Bt ogre is also ok, but costs 2 dpecial skills one for a double for dodge and one for a normal skill bt as second skill to dodge (an agility skill.)
Strider84



Joined: Jun 03, 2009

Post   Posted: Apr 24, 2018 - 11:41 Reply with quote Back to top

I guess the main reason for this rule is to avoid the feard clawpomb or just pomb combo except on big guys who then have loner and no block coming with it.
ArrestedDevelopment



Joined: Sep 14, 2015

Post   Posted: Apr 24, 2018 - 11:44 Reply with quote Back to top

I think the online "cannot combine mb and PO" rule probably has the same effect/desired outcome as the original rule.

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Strider84



Joined: Jun 03, 2009

Post   Posted: Apr 24, 2018 - 11:52 Reply with quote Back to top

But was not approved by the NAF as there should not be restrictions on specific skills which i think is a reasonable point.
mawph



Joined: Jul 02, 2013

Post   Posted: Apr 24, 2018 - 12:03 Reply with quote Back to top

So what you're intending to outlaw is two strength skills on a non-loner player. From what I'm now understanding, the rule is:

A special skill is the following:
1. An any table skill
2. A second skill on a player who already has a skill, where only players with "Loner" may chose two "S" skills.
NB: A player may chose one any table skill and a second normal skill, costing two "special skills".


Qn: Can a player use 3 special skills to get two anytable skills?
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