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FinnDiesel



Joined: Mar 07, 2018

Post   Posted: Jan 27, 2019 - 23:29 Reply with quote Back to top

Can’t wait for a Gloomspite Gitz roster Smile

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Roto



Joined: Oct 12, 2018

Post   Posted: Jan 28, 2019 - 18:57 Reply with quote Back to top

FinnDiesel wrote:
Can’t wait for a Gloomspite Gitz roster Smile


I'll admit that the Gloomspite Gitz are giving me a little bit of trouble. As they aren't just Moonclan, but also Spiderfang, Troggoths, normal gobbos, and a few special things all rolled into one. I'm trying to find that sweet balance and not just make them too much like any one other goblin team.

About the only thing I am sure of, is that I want to make a special fanatic to represent the sporesplatta fanatic a part of the roster. Sill trying to think of how to make this difference both thematically and also rules wise.
Roto



Joined: Oct 12, 2018

Post   Posted: Feb 04, 2019 - 01:03 Reply with quote Back to top

So it's been a couple of days and I've managed to hammer out the Gloomsspite Gitz. This team was a pain to figure out. Not because I didn't have ideas, but because I had so many and wanted to keep them unique from the other Goblin teams. The Gloomspite Gitz are made up of many Goblin groups under the Bad Moon such as the Moonclan and Spiderfang. This was a headache since Night Goblins and Forest Goblins already exist.

Gloomspite Gitz have rallied under the light of the Bad Moon. I wanted to show the influence this has on Goblins by giving some of them Mutation access on doubles. I reserved this for the gobbos fluffy wise dealing with copious amounts of mushrooms (Gobbapalooza and Fanatics and Troggoths) or leading the goblin horde under the light of the Bad Moon (Loonboss). I like how this works fluff wise, but I'm not sure if it'll imbalance things play wise. I'll have to see as games are played.

I spent a fair bit reading and rereading the Gloomspite Gitz battletome trying to figure out how I wanted to approach the team. In the end, I stumbled upon the epiphiny of making the Gobbapalooza a main focus of the team roster. In fluff, they are a group of the greating wizards the Gloomspite have. In the team roster, they can become just about anything and fulfill just about any roll. I'm a big fan of the special rules for teams in league play that you can find among various SL teams such as the Night Goblins. I decided that upon purchasing a Gobbapalooza, there would be a random chance of what kind of goblin you're actually getting. With their skill options, all of the options are beneficial to the team. Some more than others maybe, but that's Nuffles for you *shrugs*

For those of you who have looking through the battletome and at the new Fanatic, you might be wondering where I got the skills that I did. Since their Fantatics are swinging around large mushroom cloud spewing balls, I wanted them to be different. I gave them Disturbing Presence and Prehensile tail to signify the clouds of toxic mushrooms surrounding them. I, of course, increased their cost to reflect this compared to a normal fanatic.

The Snuffler, was one that I was rather excited to include in the team roster. They were a new model introduced in the Gloomspite Gitz battletome and use small pet squigs to hunt down their prey/targets. I represented this by stab and shadowing. I think these guys will require a big of smart play simply because shadowing on a St2/Av7 stunty positional is a very dangerous place to be.

The Troggoth is actually something I'm still on the fence about. The Gloomspite Gitz have big Troggoths, Mangler Squigs, and Giant Spiders in their arsenal. I didn't want to include all of them, and had to make a choice. I settled on the Troggoth for the traditional flying circus that Goblins are well known for. I made them somewhat more reliable than a normal Goblin's Troll to help balance the fact that I only gave them one. These, I feel makes them slightly more reliable and able to actually function and perform screening duty without a Goblin planted firmly by their side. Only time will tell if this was a good move or not.

Gloomspite Gitz
0-16 Goblin 40K 6237 Stunty, Dodge, Right Stuff A/GS
0-1 Fanatic 100K 3717 Stunty, Ball & Chain, No Hands, Disturbing Presence, Prehensile Tail, Secret Weapon 6+ S/GAM
0-2 Snuffler 80K 6237 Stunty, Dodge, Stab, Shadowing A/GSP
0-4 Gobbapalooza 80K 6237 *, Dodge, Stunty, Sure Feet, Sprint, Right Stuff GA/SM
0-1 Loonboss 90K 6338 Stunty, Dodge GAP/SM
0-1 Troggoth 110K 4519 Loner, Bonehead, Mighty Blow, Regeneration, Throw Teammate, Always Hungry S/GAM
Reroll 60k
*In open play, the Gobbapalooza will take the skills as listed above. In league play, the Gobbapalooza will lose Sure Feet, Sprint, and Right Stuff and will instead roll d6 upon hiring and take the skills as listed below instead:
1) Leap, Very Long Legs (Shroomancer)
2) Hypnotic Gaze (Boggleye)
3) Sure Feet, Sprint (Spiker)
4) Foul Appearance, Mighty Blow (Scaremonger)
5) Fan Favorite (Brewgit)
6) Tentacle, Prehensile Tail (Webspinner Shaman)
almic85



Joined: May 25, 2009

Post   Posted: Feb 04, 2019 - 05:37 Reply with quote Back to top

Roto wrote:
almic85 wrote:
Are you sure you don’t mean Nighthaunt instead of Shadespire?

Shadespire is the city that the Warhammer Underworld game is set in.

Nighthaunt is the army made up of ghosts.

Actually a faction of Nighthaunt led by the Briar Queen is pretty much Shadespire focused. As that's where she got banished to by Nagash. It's why I kinda tried to focus that team more around the Briar Queen and her retinue.


I understand that there is a specific Nighthaunt group that lines up with the Shadespire miniatures which includes the Briar Queen, but every faction has a small group of models that are specific to Shadespire. It seems odd that you are applying this name to the Briar Queen and her retinue (who are the exact same stats as chainrasps), but not to Mollogs Mob or the Eyes of the Nine which actually have unique models for Shadespire.

As far as I am aware the Briar Queen warscrolls for AOS are limited to the Briar Queen herself and the Thorns of the Briar Queen. The rest are all generic Nighthaunt models.

You should jump on the Warscroll Builder on Warhammer Community and reference some of the faction names off there for consistency with AOS as well as giving you a good base of what units are in each faction.

Also doing a bit of digging through the various AOS models rules the Spirit Hosts are much bigger and tougher than Chainrasps. In fact the Cairn Wraith (4 wounds) is the only one of the creatures you have listed that has more wounds than the Spirit Hosts (which have 3 wounds). The rest are all man sized creatures with 1 wound.

EDIT - To try and be a bit more constructive it is probably worth keeping in mind that most of the existing Bloodbowl teams are based on generic linemen (which are the basic infantry unit of the faction) with a couple of positionals (which can be elite units) and big guy (Think a large model with 4 wounds like the a troggoth or an ogor in AOS speak).

If you start trying to throw everything into each faction you will end up with team lists with too many positionals (like what you are getting with the Gloomspite Gitz) and they start to get a little bit out of control.

If you start to get more than 3-4 positionals on a team something is going wrong and you need to see if you break that faction down further.

If you start from the top you can quickly see which factions already exist (Seraphon, Ironguts, Ironjaws, Maggotkin) and which can be easily created with only minr adjustment of existing rosters (Everchosen could be 0-4 Chaos Warriors from Chaos Chosen and 0-16 Maruaders from Chaos Pact, plus a big guy chosen for flavour; Flesheaters could be 0-16 Ghouls with new rules for 0-1 Crypt Horror, 0-1 Crypt Flayer).

You are also going to hit the issue that a lot of what makes AOS special is the big stuff that just doesn't fit on a BloodBowl pitch or needs to be really scaled back in order to not murder everything else on the pitch (like the existing Khorne roster for BloodBowl).

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FinnDiesel



Joined: Mar 07, 2018

Post   Posted: Feb 05, 2019 - 12:16 Reply with quote Back to top

Free People’s army?

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Roto



Joined: Oct 12, 2018

Post   Posted: Mar 13, 2019 - 01:35 Reply with quote Back to top

So it's been about a month since my last update, and I hope the wait was worth it because I have 2 teams entering the playtest: Kharadon and Ironjaws.

Ironjawz:
0-16 Brute 70k 5339 Dauntless G/SAP
0-4 Ardboy 70k 5339 Block GS/AP
0-2 Warchanter 70k 5339 Disturbing Presence GP/AS
0-1 Megaboss 140k 5529 Thick Skull, Mighty Blow GS/AP
Reroll 70k

I want to give a special shout out to ArthurWynne for comign up with the idea behind the Ironjawz and their core theme as a team.
I think the Warchanter is probably the most interesting member of this team. In fluff it both demoralizes foes and raises the spirits of its fellow Ironjawz. To represent this, we gave it P access and also gave it Disturbing Presence.

Kharadon:
0-16 Arkanaut 60k 4329 Thick Skull, Block GS/AP
0-2 Thunderer 100k 4339 Thick Skull, Bombadier, Secret Weapon 8+, Pass GS/AP
0-4 Skywarden 120k 5339 Thick Skull, Leap, Very Long Legs GAS/P
Reroll 60k

These guys gave me a bit of trouble, but I eventually decided to base the team around two of their more iconic models. The floating dwarves and the dwarves with guns.

Whoever heard of leaping dwarves before? Well, now you've seen them. With their broad skill access and semi reliable leaping ability, I envision many shenanigans playing out with them.

The Thunderers gave me a bit of trouble as I wanted them to fulfill dual rolls and both gunners (bombadiers) and possible passing options. Unfortunately, you can't exactly give bombadiers passing availability on singles or else it'd be hilariously broken. I hope I found a decent balance here. I may take away Pass from them depending on how they perform going forward.
garyt1



Joined: Mar 12, 2011

Post   Posted: Mar 14, 2019 - 03:29 Reply with quote Back to top

Seems like fun. Though Megaboss is too cheap as has general access, and doesn't suffer from loner or negatraits.

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LeviathanPurple



Joined: Mar 25, 2019

Post   Posted: Mar 25, 2019 - 21:00 Reply with quote Back to top

Hey guys, new poster here.

I was also looking at coming up with teams for all the new models (and I think GW should too). Just thinking that blood bowl needs some new life into it and new teams would excite old and new players alike as long as they weren't dumb.

Here is my Gloomspite Team
Gloomspite Gitz
0-16 Goblin 5 2 3 7 Dodge, Right Stuff, Stunty A GSP 40K
0-4 Squig Hopper 7 3 3 7 Wild Animal, Sprint, Side Step A GSP 70K
0-2 Cave Sneak 6 2 3 7 Dodge, Right Stuff, Stunty, Shadowing, Sneaky Git A GSP 60K
0-2 Fanatic 3 7 3 7 No Hands, Secret Weapon, Ball and Chain, Stunty S GAP 70K
0-2 Spore Troll 4 5 1 9 Loner, Mighty Blow, Really Stupid,Regeneration, Throw Team-Mate,
Disturbing Presence S GAP 120K

You get your trolls who don't have a chance to eat goblins and have disturbing presence representing their diet of fungi and the dizzying spores emitted from the mushrooms growing on them. I was really inspired by Mollog for this troll. You have a goblin team who ditches their tried and true shenanigans for an additional fanatic given their presence in night goblins and the squig riders. They are fast and stronger goblins due to the squigs and I thought side step would be a good skill for their jumpiness while wild animal prevented them from being reliable ball carriers. Fun but not there to make goblins op. Also cave sneaks were an idea to be a nifty positional you can fill. I think here you are getting a team that can hold off some of the higher spectrum teams of bashy and ball playing without getting flat stomped while being fun to actually try out.

Made a Nighthaunt team as well. Though it isn't perfect and I'm looking for ways to change it I imagined a more agile undead team but not in the ball playing sense. While Jump up was a consideration I thought dodge as a near universal skill would be more interesting into grounding the team as a real possibility. I didn't go Banshees in the team, went with a more traditional ghost list. I figured Banshees would instead make a cool star player. The spirit Host is the big guy for the team but I didn't imagine him being physically strong. I imagined since it was made up of multiple ghosts that it could block multiple people reliably so I gave it the swirling spirits rule, something I came up with to allow it to do this. Won't help too much against a very bashy team but works well for clearing out linemen and such.

Night Haunt
0-16 Chainghast 5 3 2 7 Regeneration, Dodge G SA 50K
0-2 Grimghast 6 3 3 8 Regeneration, Dodge, Foul Appearance G SAP 100K
0-2 Knight of Shrouds 6 3 3 8 Regeneration, Dodge, Nerves of Steel A GSP 100K
0-2 Bladegheist 6 3 3 7 Regeneration, Frenzy GS AP 90K
0-2 Spirit Host 6 3 2 9 Regeneration, Dodge, Multiple Block, Swirling Spirits G SA 110K

Reroll 70k
Apothecary No
Swirling Spirits- When this model blocks and uses multiple block, do not increase the enemy’s strength by 2 for either block.
GorbadIronclaw



Joined: Feb 16, 2016

Post   Posted: Mar 25, 2019 - 22:41 Reply with quote Back to top

This is a fun idea with a few more options to explore:

Kharadron Overlords - Dwarves with leap?
Idoneth Deepkin - Lots of fun to be had with Sharks, Eels and Giant Turtles
Roto



Joined: Oct 12, 2018

Post   Posted: Mar 26, 2019 - 02:09 Reply with quote Back to top

GorbadIronclaw wrote:
This is a fun idea with a few more options to explore:

Kharadron Overlords - Dwarves with leap?
Idoneth Deepkin - Lots of fun to be had with Sharks, Eels and Giant Turtles


Kharadron are actually out and being playtested. They basically boiled down to dwarves with leap and dwarves with guns.

Still working on Idoneth.
delusional



Joined: Jan 18, 2013

Post   Posted: Mar 26, 2019 - 04:09 Reply with quote Back to top

Roto wrote:
Here's the currently IN WORK Daughters of Khaine roster:

0-16 Witch Aelve 70k 6347 Frenzy GA/SP
0-4 Melusai 70k 6328 Prehensile Tail, Foul Appearance GS/PA
0-4 Khinerai 60k 7247 Leap, Very Long Legs GA/PS
0-1 Medusa 150k 6439 Loner, Prehensile Tail, Foul Appearance, Hypnotic Gaze S/GAP
Reroll 70k


The pricing is very interesting on this. I would say the witch Aelve is overspec'd for a line'o. You basically have a Wood elf line person starting with Frenzy!

Then you have the Melusai who seem to be LOS fodder. Two special skills and better armor. Their a little too leet!
I would loose G access, you then have a S access character with a few interesting physical skills. It would also cause more blocking with the Frenzy lineman. thinking mv5 could be an idea here.

Medusa should have two heads (useless but fluffy), maybe mv5 or mv4 with Hypnotic gaze as HG is going to be a reasonable game changer.

The Khinerai seem a little too good but interesting. Tactically a leap with frenzy support offers opportunities. for 60k they get 2x skills and no stunty compaired to skinks... once they get dodge they will be try machines.
Roto



Joined: Oct 12, 2018

Post   Posted: Mar 26, 2019 - 23:39 Reply with quote Back to top

delusional wrote:
Roto wrote:
Here's the currently IN WORK Daughters of Khaine roster:

0-16 Witch Aelve 70k 6347 Frenzy GA/SP
0-4 Melusai 70k 6328 Prehensile Tail, Foul Appearance GS/PA
0-4 Khinerai 60k 7247 Leap, Very Long Legs GA/PS
0-1 Medusa 150k 6439 Loner, Prehensile Tail, Foul Appearance, Hypnotic Gaze S/GAP
Reroll 70k


The pricing is very interesting on this. I would say the witch Aelve is overspec'd for a line'o. You basically have a Wood elf line person starting with Frenzy!

Then you have the Melusai who seem to be LOS fodder. Two special skills and better armor. Their a little too leet!
I would loose G access, you then have a S access character with a few interesting physical skills. It would also cause more blocking with the Frenzy lineman. thinking mv5 could be an idea here.

Medusa should have two heads (useless but fluffy), maybe mv5 or mv4 with Hypnotic gaze as HG is going to be a reasonable game changer.

The Khinerai seem a little too good but interesting. Tactically a leap with frenzy support offers opportunities. for 60k they get 2x skills and no stunty compaired to skinks... once they get dodge they will be try machines.


I guess I'll go into a bit on where some of the skills and pricing for this team came from. Because I agree that it needs some changes and I'm actually trying to figure out just how to better balance it still.

First off, I use this https://fumbbl.com/index.php?name=PNphpBB2&file=viewtopic&t=20129 as a basis for the initial pricing for teams I'm working on. Its a good tool, but definitely not set in stone. I make tweaks here and there based on if something is a bit too good in context of the rest of the team. That said, the Daughters of Khaine are currently correctly priced with that formula, but that's one of the things I'm looking at in regards to tweaking.

You compared the Witch Aelve to the woodie lino right? I actually took the Kurnous lino for the inspiration for it. https://fumbbl.com/help:KurnousT The big difference between the Witch Aelve and the woodie lino is that they lose MA but gain a skill. The reason they have frenzy stems from the skillset of the normal Witch Elf positional. Considering that I knew that Witch Aelves needed to be the core lino of the team, I had to figure out a way to take the extremely expensive Witch Elf and make them.... Not as expensive. I looked at what made the Witch Elf so.. unique and settled on Frenzy. Once I had that, I realized that there was already a Frenzy lino in Secret League and modeled them off that. I think it works well to be honest.

The Melusai is a bit trickier. I really wanted them to act as a sort of mix between blitzer and screener for the team. Prehensile Tail comes into the picture due to inspiration from the Snakemen Secret League team. I figured that'd make them good at that role. I wanted to make sure they had both G and S access on singles to help them fill this roll and give them some variety if need be. The issue I've run into with them with the few test games I've done is that I don't think they start off that well and lack basic skills to help them get going. I had hoped that Foul Appearance would help them succeed in what I wanted their role to be, but so far, it's been largely worthless in the test games. I'm honestly thinking about taking FA away from them, giving them block, and bumping their price up 10k. I know you brought up their speed, but surprisingly in the tabletop they're actually faster than the Witch Aelves. I might take a look at that later on though.

The Khinerai are actually giving me the most trouble in figuring out how I want to balance them properly. With their wings, I thought Leap and Very Long Legs would be great ways to express that. And I still do. They're also the fastest model in the AoS army so I needed to make sure that they were faster than the rest of the team. At least by a little. That said, I had hoped that the St2 and Av7 would be deterrents and glaring weaknesses for them. Without starting dodge or stunty as you like to compare, they need a little more build up to become monstrous, but I think they will be in time. I don't like their current price, truth be told. I really really REALLY don't like the idea that a positional is cheaper than a linemen. That said, I don't think I can justify raising their prices more than 10k arbitrarily without overcosting them. Still trying to figure this one out honestly. I'm considering changing their skills to AP on singles and GS on doubles, but I'm unsure. I'd like at least some access to P on this team and Khinerai are expert archers. OTOH, I don't want them to not have G access either. We'll see how it goes.

Now the Medusa. I actually rather like her model on the tabletop and was excited to bring her to Bloodbowl. The issue I had with her is that she wasn't as... dumb or wild like a lot of other Big Guys are in the fluff. She's a cruel and cunning operator. That compounded with the fact that I really liked the idea of giving her Hypnotic Gaze to represent her fluffy gaze, made me very hesitent to give her a negatrait other than Loner. Without a Nega Trait, however, I was rather hesitent in her overall stats. I figured St4 and Ag3 would be more than enough but not too much for a fairly reliable pseudo Big Guy. I'm considering dropping her MA down to 5, but I'm still not entirely certain if it's warranted. I just haven't had enough time to really playtest her thoroughly. (Its really ironic that in the army, the Witch Aelves are the slowest troop choice around.) I actually disagree about the whole Two Heads thing simply because they really kinda don't. Other than the snake hair, but that's not really the same thing?

Lastly, I'm definately planning on dropping the Reroll price down to 60k for the time being. 70k is just too much for these guys, but I'm hesitant to take them all the way down to 50k. I figure 60k is a good compromise to go forward with.
delusional



Joined: Jan 18, 2013

Post   Posted: Mar 27, 2019 - 04:08 Reply with quote Back to top

Roto wrote:
Another of the teams I'm working on is Clan Verminous. They are another of the major Skaven clans and their focus has mostly been building the giant rat swarms used in combat. In the tabletop, they don't have a ton of units, but what they do have is mostly around said Rat Swarms. A single rat was weak, but a swarm was a nightmare. When putting this team together, I tried to capture that feel of swarming your opponent with A horde of weaker linemen.

0-16 Clanrats 40k 5136 Guard, Stunty, Titchy Dodge A/GSM
0-4 Packmaster 100k 6338 Grab, Prehensile Tail GA/SPM
0-1 Stormvermin 140k 7439 Leader GS/APM
Reroll 60k

The problem I'm having is to really capture the feel of the swarm of rats, I gave the Clanrats Guard to start with. This in turn made me rather nervous in regards to what I gave the positionals. I tried to limit what they got to start with.

I wanted to give the Packmasters Bloodlust initially to symbolize them whipping the rats a little too harshly, but ended up scrapping that due to making them just too dangerous in such a team. What I went instead with was Prehensile Tail and Grab to symbolize the whips their models carry.

The Stormvermin mostly comes from the Clan Verminous Shadespire pack. In it, the Clan Verminous team is led by a Stormvermin. I wanted to make this team led by a powerful Stormvermin. He wasn't quite a big guy, but I wanted to be the one in charge of everyone else. To help illustrate this, I decided to give him Leader in response to his fluff. I'm not too sure on that as it is essentially giving a free reroll to start with. But I was afraid of giving him too many skills to start with due to all the Guard present on the team.

If anyone has any way possible to pick holes in this team roster go for it.. Please lol


I think the fluff kinda works in reverse. With the master not supporting clanrats.

Also Where is the SPEED!

I would think of flipping it a little.
0-16 Clanrats 40k 6237 Stunty, Titchy, Dodge A/GSM
0-2 Weirdrat 80k 8328 Two heads, Dauntless, Leap G/ASM
0-4 Rabble rousers 60K 7126 Stunty, Leader, Guard, Titchy, hypotic gaze, right stuff PM/SA
0-2 Stormvermin 140k 7439 Grab, throw team mate GS/APM

I.e. you have a really weak rats supporting other rats.

This would work better to the Skaven style. Very fast team that can't stay for the fight but will run past you. Having a lot of stunty means people running through you.
I also would like to see an AG2 try and leap. Ok that's me just wanting LOLZ
Roto



Joined: Oct 12, 2018

Post   Posted: Mar 29, 2019 - 01:07 Reply with quote Back to top

I have literally no idea where the idea for Weirdrats and Rabble Rousers came from. Nothing with those names have anything to do with Clan Verminous. One thing is, why stunty and titchy on the your version of clanrats? No skaven would be considered stunty like that. I mean.. there's a lot of odd in that roster of yours but.. yeah...

The thing is, it's not just a Skaven style I'm working on, its a Clan Verminous style. You know, the clan that's all about ALL THE CLANRATS ALL THE TIME!!! Basic Skaven already exist and Garion has done an amazing job with the other clans in Secret League. I have no desire to copy/paste any of them. That said, I am trying to keep it fluffy but also you know.. not... terrible or over powered.

I did up the Clanrat MA in the fix and changed around the Stormvermin and added the Clawlord (from the battletome). I brought the Stormvermin in line with the Secret League Stormvermin. For the Clawlord, I gave him claw and block and mostly called it a day. I figure with guard support, that claw will help defeat the bigger guys in the other rosters. I miiight up it to 0-2 later on if I feel like it needs it though.
almic85



Joined: May 25, 2009

Post   Posted: Apr 07, 2019 - 22:39 Reply with quote Back to top

Hi Roto.

This popped up on my Facebook feed and I thought of this thread. https://theboneheadpodcast.podbean.com/e/the-bonehead-podcast-14-team-design-competition-and-bonehead-basics-halflings/

There’s a podcast looking for proposed BB teams based on AoS models and it looks like you have already made a few if you are interested in sharing them a bit wider.

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