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Poll
Chameoleon Skinks???
Love them
39%
 39%  [ 27 ]
Trash
27%
 27%  [ 19 ]
SKINKS ONLY FOOL!
33%
 33%  [ 23 ]
Total Votes : 69


Hovring



Joined: Oct 29, 2003

Post   Posted: Jun 05, 2020 - 15:31 Reply with quote Back to top

Yeah but the point is that you get it for +10k on the chameleon.

So using his example 2, but with 60 and 70k. You have an expected loss on 18.6k without git and 14.7k with git. I would take one for my liz and foul high value players every turn possible. The 42% chance of ko/cas from AV break is something.

That said 10k might be better spend on something else, but not pass block or just +10k imo.
Grod



Joined: Sep 30, 2003

Post   Posted: Jun 21, 2020 - 11:33 Reply with quote Back to top

I just want to point out - these new Chameleon skinks get 2 general skills that would otherwise require doubles! So they get 60TV of skills, lost 30TV for the stat, but only cost 10K more!

Keep in mind that choosing from agility skills alone, Skinks don't really go that far - Sidestep, diving tackle then maybe sure feet? Even worse, they all end up the same!

These new Chameleon skinks can be interesting multi-skill pieces with just a few levels and really create versatility in your skink lineup that non-chameleon skink teams don't have.

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MattDakka



Joined: Oct 09, 2007

Post   Posted: Jun 21, 2020 - 13:14 Reply with quote Back to top

Grod wrote:
I just want to point out - these new Chameleon skinks get 2 general skills that would otherwise require doubles! So they get 60TV of skills, lost 30TV for the stat, but only cost 10K more

Would you use a double to take Pass Block or Shadowing on a Skink?
I think you would take either Sure Hands, Block or Wrestle.
So, even if Pass Block and Shadowing are 2 skills requiring a double, you should consider that you would not take them.
On the other hand, you are sacrificing a MA point to have 2 skills that would require a double, but you would not take (so their actual value is close to 0).


+MA > Pass Block and Shadowing

if you roll +MA or +AG on a regular Skink you have a great ball carrier (and potential one turner).
One turners make Lizardmen win their games, especially at high TV where they could be outbashed.

And about Skinks not having many choices, it's true, but then you just cycle them at 16 SPPs if no double/stat and hope to get +MA or +AG on the next one.
If you have MA 8 and roll +MA/+AG you have a good Skink, if you have MA 7 and roll +MA you have a quite expensive Skink, and it's less likely indeed to have a MA 9 (and impossible MA 10) Skink if you develop a Chameleon Skink.
Grod



Joined: Sep 30, 2003

Post   Posted: Jun 21, 2020 - 13:57 Reply with quote Back to top

Stuntys with dodge and pass block is kinda interesting - they could be quite annoying at interfering with passes! Stunty allowing them to make dodges pretty easily... Having 2 to cover both sides of field, screw up 1 turn tds etc. It might even be OP!

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MattDakka



Joined: Oct 09, 2007

Post   Posted: Jun 21, 2020 - 14:42 Reply with quote Back to top

If they were, they would be used.
Play a Lizardman team with Chameleon Skinks in the Box and show their utility, then you will have a point.
Otherwise, just theorycrafting not backed up by results.
Rbthma



Joined: Jan 14, 2009

Post   Posted: Jun 21, 2020 - 18:22 Reply with quote Back to top

MattDakka wrote:
If they were, they would be used.
Play a Lizardman team with Chameleon Skinks in the Box and show their utility, then you will have a point.
Otherwise, just theorycrafting not backed up by results.


Play a Lizardman team with Chameleon Skinks in the Box and show their uselessness, then you will have a point. Otherwise, just theorycrafting not backed up by results.

funny how that works. Also I know responding to you is useless as you will go off on some other tangent
MattDakka



Joined: Oct 09, 2007

Post   Posted: Jun 21, 2020 - 18:30 Reply with quote Back to top

I'm not going to play sub-par positionals.
It's up to the guy claiming Chameleon Skinks are good to show they actually are.
I have 70.10 % win rate with Lizardmen and I don't use Chameleon Skinks.
Probably I have more clue about Lizardmen than you or Grod.
Doofr



Joined: Nov 04, 2015

Post   Posted: Jun 21, 2020 - 18:42 Reply with quote Back to top

So if i follow you Matt you have more clue than Baza about Lizardmen ?Wink

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