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Poll
Which turn limit fix would you prefer?
1. Timeout! button
23%
 23%  [ 72 ]
2. Pause button + start of turn blanking
27%
 27%  [ 86 ]
3. Global emergency timer
41%
 41%  [ 129 ]
4. Something else (explained below)
8%
 8%  [ 26 ]
Total Votes : 313


Purplegoo



Joined: Mar 23, 2006

Post   Posted: Feb 27, 2007 - 16:07 Reply with quote Back to top

Stormbringer wrote:
Purplegoo wrote:
I voted for option 3 - this would be ideal, I think. It's a cure-all, I can chat, answer the phone, and the uber-slow players are still limited to an enforced time limit when I'm playing them or speccing. Perfect.

However, if it proves too hard to implement, option 1 is a good compromise. Perhaps if each player were limited to 2 Timeouts! a game, it copes with both the RL emergency, and the "Oh crap I'm still chatting about those double skulls at 3 minutes, now I'm in a rush and will screw up" moment. If there were unlimited timeouts, as you have suggested, the time-limit would be rendered useless. Plus the timeout could be used as a strategic tool - for instance a very important turn in a major could take more than 4 minutes to evaluate, but if we only have 2, when it's gone, it's gone!

Although - adding another strategic non-LRB layer/tool, good or bad? Confused


As I understood it, 1) doesn't mean a timeout as in basketball or american football, but allows the opposing player to click a button once the 4 minute siren sounded to simply end your turn.

Stormbringer


Ahh yes - having re-read the op - I think you're correct. The word timeout confused me a bit, despite the reference to illegal procedure. In that case, scratch what I said about option 1, as the only time this would be enforced would be where there is ill feeling between coaches. Black-lists would balloon. 3 is the way of the future! Very Happy
Stormbringer



Joined: Aug 19, 2005

Post   Posted: Feb 27, 2007 - 16:13 Reply with quote Back to top

Just to remind there is one problem that comes with 2 & 3:

the player that didn't take the break might feel tempted to go afk himself and could find himself in the middle of his next turn once he comes back and you can't really expect a player to wait up to 15 minutes in case the other player comes back and finishes his turn. Ending a pause or ending the turn while the emergency timer is activated should be something that has to be done by both players.

And I am with everyone that is against 1) because, as purplegoo stated, there is much aggression potential in it.

Stormbringer

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sk8bcn



Joined: Apr 13, 2004

Post   Posted: Feb 27, 2007 - 16:15 Reply with quote Back to top

I am all for the end turn button so that you could decide what kind of game you want.

BTW, for clock problems:

I would use the clock of the playing coach and send the info that 4 mins are reached to the other one then allow him to use the option.

That kills synch problems (I guess).

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spiro



Joined: Nov 18, 2005

Post   Posted: Feb 27, 2007 - 16:16 Reply with quote Back to top

Am wondering why in option 2 screen must be blanked Question Maybe enough stop the clock for 10-15 mins hmmm

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kemimutt



Joined: Apr 21, 2004

Post   Posted: Feb 27, 2007 - 16:17 Reply with quote Back to top

You are refering to alternative 2 here, not 1.

Purplegoo wrote:

However, if it proves too hard to implement, option 1 is a good compromise. Perhaps if each player were limited to 2 Timeouts! a game, it copes with both the RL emergency, and the "Oh crap I'm still chatting about those double skulls at 3 minutes, now I'm in a rush and will screw up" moment. If there were unlimited timeouts, as you have suggested, the time-limit would be rendered useless. Plus the timeout could be used as a strategic tool - for instance a very important turn in a major could take more than 4 minutes to evaluate, but if we only have 2, when it's gone, it's gone!

Although - adding another strategic non-LRB layer/tool, good or bad? Confused
Unstoffe



Joined: Aug 22, 2004

Post   Posted: Feb 27, 2007 - 16:18 Reply with quote Back to top

Voted 2 - although I also hate the blanking idea - so please don't do that bit! If somebody wants to abuse this to get more thinking time then they will, blanking or not. But how many will actually say 'brb' and actually sit there planning? About as many as intentionally disconnect now I'd think, and they'll be as easy to spot...
As for making chat difficult - surely 4 minutes is enough time to play and chat?
1) Has indeed got some nasty cons.
3) Hmm. Actually I'd love it if this replaced the per turn time, and each player got, say, 30 minutes per game Smile. But as suggested, I can't see it helping - a slow player would get three ten minute turns effectively, more than enough to bore the opposition into submission.

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Purplegoo



Joined: Mar 23, 2006

Post   Posted: Feb 27, 2007 - 16:18 Reply with quote Back to top

kemimutt wrote:
You are refering to alternative 2 here, not 1.


Yup - mistake noted. Smile
kemimutt



Joined: Apr 21, 2004

Post   Posted: Feb 27, 2007 - 16:20 Reply with quote Back to top

spiro wrote:
Am wondering why in option 2 screen must be blanked Question Maybe enough stop the clock for 10-15 mins hmmm


If you have unlimited amounts of pauses ochg pause each start of turn, the screen must be blanked. Otherwise slow players could pause each turn and think of their moves. If the amoount of pauses are limited, then there is no need for blanking out. The problem with start-of-turn-pause however still exist in this case.
JanMattys



Joined: Feb 29, 2004

Post   Posted: Feb 27, 2007 - 16:22 Reply with quote Back to top

I voted option 2.

I don't really believe a lot of people would take screenshots just to have the time to think (Jesus!!!... Shocked), so I don't think the screenshot is much of an issue.

And how about only blanking the pitch of the one who hits the button? I mean, if I pause the game I shouldn't be able to think about strategy, but YOU should (after all in tabletop if I answer the phone you spend those extra minutes thinking what you're doing next, don't you?)

I don't like option three because it still puts limits, and 15 just seems as arbitrary as 30 or 4 or 10. But it could work as well, even if to me it doesn't seem as optimal as option 2.

Option 1 biggest problem is that it WILL cause hostility, I bet my life on this. And since I care for the community and the friendly behaviour, and opposed the time limit rule in the first place because it made chatting more difficult, then it is obvious why I oppose option 1.

So I vote option 2. If only the pitch of the one requiring the pause "blanks",and if it's still possible to write in the chat box, it's REAL close to be the perfect solution in my eyes.

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Craftnburn



Joined: Jul 29, 2005

Post   Posted: Feb 27, 2007 - 16:26 Reply with quote Back to top

I think Option 1 is the perfect solution. If you want Competetive games, you'd better be prepared for your opponent to call you on time. Meanwhile if you want a casual game, you can agree with your opponent to not worry about the button.

I think it's odd that those who want the time automatically enforced would have an issue with making it optionally enforced. The only way I can see this leading to problems is if your opponent says "sure I won't call it, you can go afk" then waits till you're gone and calls Time on you! But we can't A-hole proof the game!

As for option 2.. I play blindfold chess, I wouldn't have much problem planning my turns with a blanked screen. Also as stated it doesn't help the chat issue.

Option 3 seems to have an large technical overhead, not to mention it seems to be contrary to the 4 min/turn concept.
Khaan



Joined: Aug 02, 2003

Post   Posted: Feb 27, 2007 - 16:33 Reply with quote Back to top

Option 3, with the possible of what Stormbringer said.

A turn that ends whilst drawing from the pool of emergency time could result in the opposing coach getting a prompt to start his.

As the above might get annoying if the turn limit is exceeded every turn by only a couple of seconds, an alternative is to have a sound effect (customisable... chainsaw anyone?) go off every time a turn ends whilst on emergency time. As long as i keep within earshot of the pc i can also go extinguish my burning cat. Perhaps make this mutable as a togglefunction in-game.

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pac



Joined: Oct 03, 2005

Post   Posted: Feb 27, 2007 - 16:36 Reply with quote Back to top

The key factor is which option SkiJunkie thinks he could most easily and efficiently code. I would suggest that most people would rather see their least favourite of the three options implemented flawlessly, than a buggy version of their preferred one.

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Purplegoo



Joined: Mar 23, 2006

Post   Posted: Feb 27, 2007 - 16:36 Reply with quote Back to top

Khaan wrote:
Option 3, with the possible of what Stormbringer said.

A turn that ends whilst drawing from the pool of emergency time could result in the opposing coach getting a prompt to start his.

As the above might get annoying if the turn limit is exceeded every turn by only a couple of seconds, an alternative is to have a sound effect (customisable... chainsaw anyone?) go off every time a turn ends whilst on emergency time. As long as i keep within earshot of the pc i can also go extinguish my burning cat. Perhaps make this mutable as a togglefunction in-game.


Thats a good idea (the prompt that is, I'm not sure about the noise).

Am I the only one that now plays with a bucket of water near the PC incase a flaming feline/Zebra/Girlfriend/sambuca crosses my path? No? Just me then... Laughing
Jesperius



Joined: Dec 28, 2003

Post   Posted: Feb 27, 2007 - 16:37 Reply with quote Back to top

Why not make time a part of options? Then if one of the players want to play with time u have to or finde another game. I think that will solve a lot of the problems for everybody. In tournament time will then be used if one of the players want it.
pac



Joined: Oct 03, 2005

Post   Posted: Feb 27, 2007 - 16:38 Reply with quote Back to top

Purplegoo wrote:
Am I the only one that now plays with a bucket of water near the PC incase a flaming feline/Zebra/Girlfriend/sambuca crosses my path? No? Just me then... Laughing

No, I play with a bucket of gasoline so I can light cats and then send them to distract my opponents. Smile

They're even more effective than the killer bees were!

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