| Poll |
| Do you want BR in the Formula? |
| Yes - And if it is removed, I will likely leave Blackbox |
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4% |
[ 10 ] |
| Yes - But I would play Blackbox regardless |
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23% |
[ 53 ] |
| No - But I would play Blackbox regardless |
|
39% |
[ 91 ] |
| No - And if it remains, I will likely leave Blackbox |
|
20% |
[ 48 ] |
| Unsure - I have not decided, or do not understand BR |
|
12% |
[ 28 ] |
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| Total Votes : 230 |
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DukeTyrion
Joined: Feb 18, 2004
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 Posted:
Nov 14, 2008 - 10:50 |
 
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A quick poll, just to get the general view of the people playing in [B].
This is not likely to change Christer's mind, nor do we even know that BR affects the match-ups given by the system, but I wanted to get an idea of the views of the masses.
The belief is (unconfirmed), that your Blackbox Rating will change your match up, so if you have a BR of say 160 and play a BR of say 140, you will have to give up a significant TS advantage for the game.
The end result I think, is to bring all games to a 50/50 chance of winning, regardless of race, opponent level and TS.
The question is, would you prefer the 50% match up, or would you like coaches to be matched just on TS/Race, with their BR then showing their true Bloodbowl rating? |
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JanMattys
Joined: Feb 29, 2004
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| Posted:
Nov 14, 2008 - 10:53 |
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I'd prefer a matchup based on race and ts only. If I am a bad coach, I need to improve, not to get easier opponents.
But I consider myself an average bbowler, so it doesn't really influence my DivB experience much...
ps: also it's quite important the weight it has in the equation... the more it is, the less likely I am to accept it as a good thing. |
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DukeTyrion
Joined: Feb 18, 2004
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| Posted:
Nov 14, 2008 - 11:01 |
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I agree Jan, I would put myself somewhere around slightly above average, but if I go on a good run, I don't want to be giving up a huge TS advantage. On the flip side, if the dice go against me for a few gams, I don't want to suddenly get 25 TS against someone I would normally have a good balance game against. |
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PurpleChest
Joined: Oct 25, 2003
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i like to think i'm a little above average.
But see absolutely no reason why i shouldn't be offered balanced games becuase of this.
Now would i want or seek any advantage over the coaches that are better than me. |
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Barbarus hic ego sum, quia non intelligor illis -Ovid
I am a barbarian here because i am not understood by anyone |
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Rijssiej
Joined: Jan 04, 2005
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| Posted:
Nov 14, 2008 - 11:12 |
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I like to think I am well below average and love to get some TS advantage.  |
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koadah
Joined: Mar 30, 2005
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| Posted:
Nov 14, 2008 - 11:20 |
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If there is a championship I wouldn't mind championship standing being used.
i.e. we all start even at the beginning of the month but the big dogs are more likely to clash towards the end of the month.
| PurpleChest wrote: | | i like to think i'm a little above average. |
I guess it's a while since you checked your profile
I have no problem with including or not including BR but PurpleChest vs AverageCoach in balanced game looks a lot like a cherrypick to me  |
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O[L]C 2016 Swiss! - April ---- All Star Bowl - Teams of Stars - 2 more teams needed |
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RC
Joined: Sep 22, 2005
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| Posted:
Nov 14, 2008 - 11:24 |
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Well if you play a broken team your br will go up due to you winning a lot of games (multi dp khemri, multi dp dwarfs , UD that brings the count along, flings vs broken teams ect) and then it is only fair that you should get a little harder games. Not saying that there should be +30 in ts difference but 10 or so seems fair. |
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"Oh, you hate your job? Why didn't you say so? There's a support group for that. It's called EVERYBODY, and they meet at the bar." |
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JanMattys
Joined: Feb 29, 2004
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| Posted:
Nov 14, 2008 - 11:28 |
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| koadah wrote: | | I have no problem with including or not including BR but PurpleChest vs AverageCoach in balanced game looks a lot like a cherrypick to me |
Koadah, the thing is that the GAME is balanced. Purplechest is just better.
And if you are a worse coach, by playing on equal teams you lose but grow more skilled with time, while playing with a upper hand might give you some wins and the feeling that "you are not that bad after all".
I would honestly shake my head at a Chess pairing system that makes me play against a good player who is taken away his rooks...
Hell, what's this politically correctness? If you're worse than someone, you swallow your pride and get better by learning. You don't ask for artificial ways to play on even ground... Especially if there's nothing other than "skill" that separates you from a better coach. It's not like you're use-impaired at playing bb... it's just that you're not as experienced and skilled *yet*.
(ps: *you* is used in its general meaning here, and is not referring to Sir Koadah who would probably pwn me on the bloodbowl pitch anyway ^_^) |
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JanMattys
Joined: Feb 29, 2004
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| Posted:
Nov 14, 2008 - 11:35 |
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| RC wrote: | | Well if you play a broken team your br will go up due to you winning a lot of games (multi dp khemri, multi dp dwarfs , UD that brings the count along, flings vs broken teams ect) and then it is only fair that you should get a little harder games. Not saying that there should be +30 in ts difference but 10 or so seems fair. |
A multi-dp khemri is hardly a winning choice on Blackbox (assuming an equal spread of opponents) |
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RC
Joined: Sep 22, 2005
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| Posted:
Nov 14, 2008 - 11:37 |
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| JanMattys wrote: | | RC wrote: | | Well if you play a broken team your br will go up due to you winning a lot of games (multi dp khemri, multi dp dwarfs , UD that brings the count along, flings vs broken teams ect) and then it is only fair that you should get a little harder games. Not saying that there should be +30 in ts difference but 10 or so seems fair. |
A multi-dp khemri is hardly a winning choice on Blackbox (assuming an equal spread of opponents) |
Well I disagree, unless I am playing Dorfs, orcs or blodge elves I will lose 2 players every turn (k.o, cas). |
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"Oh, you hate your job? Why didn't you say so? There's a support group for that. It's called EVERYBODY, and they meet at the bar." |
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Mithrilpoint
Joined: Mar 16, 2004
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| Posted:
Nov 14, 2008 - 11:38 |
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A good coach playing vs. a bad coach on otherwise equal terms is a distinctive advantage to the good coach.
Is that what the blackboxers want? |
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Stop the Whining! |
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clarkin
Joined: Oct 15, 2007
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| Posted:
Nov 14, 2008 - 11:41 |
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| RC wrote: | | Well I disagree, unless I am playing Dorfs, orcs or blodge elves I will lose 2 players every turn (k.o, cas). |
It may feel dangerous to your team but khemri (even with many DPs) have a very difficult time winning.
You don't see them winning any majors for a reason. |
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Mattybee
Joined: Mar 22, 2007
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| Posted:
Nov 14, 2008 - 11:41 |
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If it's a distinct advantage because that coach has more skill, I don't see why not.
I wouldn't mind BR remaining in, but only as a VERY SLIGHT modifier, if that. TR and TS and other hidden factors should play a much greater role in it than BR. Like if I have CoachA, CoachB, CoachZ, and CoachX - A and B are very good, Z and X are average - if A and B are still fairly close with their teams and Z and X are fairly close even though, say, Z vs A and B vs X would be better - okay, sure, match them up instead. But don't give wild TR/TS bonuses to poorer coaches, if that makes sense? |
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JanMattys
Joined: Feb 29, 2004
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| Posted:
Nov 14, 2008 - 11:44 |
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| Mithrilpoint wrote: | A good coach playing vs. a bad coach on otherwise equal terms is a distinctive advantage to the good coach.
Is that what the blackboxers want? |
Why not?
Blackbox is not a learning playground, where worse coaches get tutored into getting better. It's just pure bb, two guys meet, one guy loses and one wins.
The Blackbox bot imho is there just to make sure that the pairing grants equal teams. After that, it's up to coaches skills. And if one is better than the other, then why shouldn't he win?
At the Olympics, the Dream Team doesn't get a smaller basket when facing France or England, *to make it harder to score and to even things a bit"... |
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Mattybee
Joined: Mar 22, 2007
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| Posted:
Nov 14, 2008 - 11:46 |
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| JanMattys wrote: | | At the Olympics, the Dream Team doesn't get a smaller basket when facing France or England, *to make it harder to score and to even things a bit"... |
I have to admit this sounds like it would be totally awesome to watch. |
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