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ilpars



Joined: Nov 14, 2012

Post   Posted: Jan 13, 2013 - 20:47 Reply with quote Back to top

For creating new teams:
Why not create new skills while developing new teams? The skills which will give new interesting options and more fluff. They can be put under extraordinary category so they will not be open to existing teams.
harvestmouse



Joined: May 13, 2007

Post   Posted: Jan 13, 2013 - 21:12 Reply with quote Back to top

ilpars wrote:
For creating new teams:
Why not create new skills while developing new teams? The skills which will give new interesting options and more fluff. They can be put under extraordinary category so they will not be open to existing teams.


Because this creates unrealistic stats. Remember the basic stats of a human lineman. This is the basic bloodbowl player. If the stats deviate from this basic stat, there has to be a good reason.

It's pretty easy to make interesting teams with interesting stats, but as I stated earlier and so many times before, this deviates from the basic premise of GW games.

Dwarfs are pretty much the most boring race ever devised. However they are how a Dwarf should be. You could make much interesting stats for a Dwarf, but...........it wouldn't be a Dwarf anymore. And this is very important. The players portray the stats you expect them to portray; not what would be the most fun to play.
KhorneliusPraxx



Joined: Jul 28, 2005

Post   Posted: Jan 13, 2013 - 21:18 Reply with quote Back to top

I'm not reading all of this.
Simply put...DAEMONS TO NOT PLAY SPORTING EVENTS.

Man-o-man...I wish this discussion would end.

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Purplegoo



Joined: Mar 23, 2006

Post   Posted: Jan 14, 2013 - 08:22 Reply with quote Back to top

KhorneliusPraxx wrote:
Man-o-man...I wish this discussion would end.


This is a pointless discussion, agreed. Khorne were never going to make it out of Cyanide making a quick buck unless they were designed officially and given due process, and there is no sign that will happen.

I was going to move this to RLBB, but obviously, that doesn't work either. Since it's a BB forum, maybe this simply needs booting to off topic.

Methinks this dead horse should stop being flogged. We have ClawMBPO, after all.
Overhamsteren



Joined: May 27, 2006

Post   Posted: Jan 14, 2013 - 10:25 Reply with quote Back to top

Awww you mean to tell me your not interested in my highly original never before heard of khorne roster idea?

0-16 Pit Fighters MA6 ST3 AG3 AV8, Frenzy, G/APS
0-4 Bloodletters MA6 ST4 AG3 AV7, Regeneration, Horns, Frenzy, Wild Animal, GS/AP
0-2 Heralds MA6 ST4 AG3 AV8, Regeneration, Horns, Frenzy, Wild animal, GS/AP
0-1 Bloodthirster MA5 ST6 AG1 AV9, Regeneration, Horns, Frenzy, Mighty Blow, Wild Animal, S/GAP
Rerolls 70k

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ilpars



Joined: Nov 14, 2012

Post   Posted: Jan 14, 2013 - 10:28 Reply with quote Back to top

Personally I like new teams as long as there is no balancing issues. More the merrier.
Kelkka



Joined: Aug 14, 2009

Post   Posted: Jan 14, 2013 - 10:33 Reply with quote Back to top

I bought the Cyanide game now during the Steam holiday sale.
Faced khorne once. Server is down due to maintenance right now, but match up was something like my 1100 undeads vs 1430 khorne.

The feeling I got during the match, was that khorne isn't too weak, nor too powerful. It's mainly idiotic.

If khorne can get some good dice early on and gain man advantage, there is little to stop them controlling the field, getting tons of blocks and surfs.
On the other hand, if khorne loses few players early, it's relatively easy to control them, set up frenzy traps and force them to rely on risky moves.

Given enough time to develop, in hands of a good player I can see them being very frustrating and boring to play against. Closest comparison I can come up with other races is 2 cpombers facing each others, match can be decided in first couple turns and rest is just uphill struggle for the other team.

EDIT: Oh and I think bloodthirster is missing a claw from the skills there. At least bloodthirster of my oppo had it natural.
spubbbba



Joined: Jul 31, 2006

Post   Posted: Jan 14, 2013 - 19:57 Reply with quote Back to top

The roster itself is not a bad representation of khorne, it's just not very appropriate for Daemons.

If you rename the players to khorngors and the bloodthirster to a Khornataur and tweak the skills a little you'd have a decent khorne Beastmen team.

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Garion



Joined: Aug 19, 2009

Post   Posted: Jan 14, 2013 - 20:07 Reply with quote Back to top

even then you are pushing it really. Khorngors with regen and av7 doesnt seem right to me. Though I agree with you on horns, jugger, frenzy. That makes sense. and I'm not sure what the herald woudl be really.

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dode74



Joined: Aug 14, 2009

Post   Posted: Jan 14, 2013 - 20:56 Reply with quote Back to top

Possible renaming option (which wasn't one we had open to us):
0-16 Khorne Marauders
0-4 Furies
0-2 Khorngors
0-1 Bloodletter

If M access was an option (which it wasn't) then on doubles for the Marauders and Khorngors might be a possibility.
bghandras



Joined: Feb 06, 2011

Post   Posted: Jan 14, 2013 - 22:07 Reply with quote Back to top

"Dwarfs are pretty much the most boring race ever devised. However they are how a Dwarf should be. You could make much interesting stats for a Dwarf, but...........it wouldn't be a Dwarf anymore. And this is very important. The players portray the stats you expect them to portray; not what would be the most fun to play."

Good design should combine good game play, and fitting fluff. To me the good fluff is no excuse for bad game play experience. (I dont say the opposite is excuse.)

I read somewhere that a guy designed a tower defense game, and used plants as defenders, and zombies as attackers. As plants are static, and zombies are slow, this is what he needed mechanically speaking. They do exactly what the designers wanted, and what the players expected. For the sake of example (purpose is not to smash dwarven) if dwarwen are horrible to play, then should be removed altogether does not matter if they fit fluffwise. Or in case the developers hand is tied with design, then the developer should downpower all unfun mechanics (with pricing), and make sure that all Tier 1 elements are fun to play. (So price those agressively.)

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ilpars



Joined: Nov 14, 2012

Post   Posted: Jan 14, 2013 - 22:15 Reply with quote Back to top

I prefer to see new Chaos Warrior teams dedicated to Khorne, Slaneesh and Tzeench (like Nurgle team). That will be much more interesting than Daemon teams.
harvestmouse



Joined: May 13, 2007

Post   Posted: Jan 15, 2013 - 12:14 Reply with quote Back to top

bghandras wrote:
"Dwarfs are pretty much the most boring race ever devised. However they are how a Dwarf should be. You could make much interesting stats for a Dwarf, but...........it wouldn't be a Dwarf anymore. And this is very important. The players portray the stats you expect them to portray; not what would be the most fun to play."

Good design should combine good game play, and fitting fluff. To me the good fluff is no excuse for bad game play experience. (I dont say the opposite is excuse.)

I read somewhere that a guy designed a tower defense game, and used plants as defenders, and zombies as attackers. As plants are static, and zombies are slow, this is what he needed mechanically speaking. They do exactly what the designers wanted, and what the players expected. For the sake of example (purpose is not to smash dwarven) if dwarwen are horrible to play, then should be removed altogether does not matter if they fit fluffwise. Or in case the developers hand is tied with design, then the developer should downpower all unfun mechanics (with pricing), and make sure that all Tier 1 elements are fun to play. (So price those agressively.)


But people play Dwarfs. Why? Because they like the fluff, how they are portrayed like Dwarfs, and they like how they play. If the game wasn't stereotypical fantasy, then you might have point, but as it is, Dwarfs are as important as having a roof on your house.

Being a fantasy football game is the major draw. 'Do they have Elves?' 'Yes'. 'Cool, and Orcs?' 'Yep' 'Great, and Dwarfs?' 'No, they did, but they got removed because they were too boring.'

That wouldn't go down very well, and your average starter cares little for the finer mechanics of a race, he's more interested in how they look, and that his favourite characters from LotR are in there, and they are Dwarflike in nature.
Garion



Joined: Aug 19, 2009

Post   Posted: Jan 15, 2013 - 12:59 Reply with quote Back to top

dode74 wrote:
Possible renaming option (which wasn't one we had open to us):
0-16 Khorne Marauders
0-4 Furies
0-2 Khorngors
0-1 Bloodletter

If M access was an option (which it wasn't) then on doubles for the Marauders and Khorngors might be a possibility.


Furies is a terrible idea. They aren't khorne and they can fly so wouldnt really fit. also making the bloodthirster a bloodletter doesnt fit either really.
dode74



Joined: Aug 14, 2009

Post   Posted: Jan 15, 2013 - 13:07 Reply with quote Back to top

Furies aren't specific to Khorne, but can certainly be a part of a Khornate roster. Bloodthirsters can fly too, but you don't seem to have an issue with that...

Why does renaming the Thirster as a Letter "not fit"? You might need to be a tad more specific.
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