98smithg
Joined: Oct 06, 2005
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 Posted:
Jan 12, 2014 - 22:12 |
 
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There are a million different elf teams, no reason why there isn't room for one more human one. Although I don't think a grail knight would every play bloodbowl, they have sworn a life of piety in allegiance to the lady and are bound by the grail.
The list previously mentioned has been through a lot of balance passes and development. It is considered a tier 1 team with a good win rate.
0-16 Peasant 40,000 6 3 2 7 Fend G ASP
0-4 Yeomen 70,000 6 3 3 8 Wrestle GS AP
0-4 Knight 120,000 8 3 3 8 Block, Catch, Dauntless GS AP |
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harvestmouse
Joined: May 13, 2007
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Jan 12, 2014 - 22:27 |
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Hmmmmm a few points.
1. Cowhead already posted that roster.
2. Who mentioned Grail Knights?
3. Remember that BloodBowl is the tongue in cheek of the warhammer world, so in this world everyone legitimately can play BB (even Grail Knights).
4. Yes there are a million elf teams or..... 4 to be exact.
5. Bretonnians are not a recognised top notch BB race, so in no way should they be tier 1.
6. Are you the custodian of the Plasmoid fan club? |
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Mozza1
Joined: Oct 06, 2013
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Jan 12, 2014 - 23:34 |
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Many many years ago (about the time Citadel Journal posted the mixed teams rules for 3rd edition) my gaming group considered this.
My favourite option (which tbh was simply the best of a poor selection of options) was that the Human roster essentially represents Empire teams, but could be used for other Old World nations with tweaks to the number of players, for example Bretonnian teams could have 6 Blitzers, but only 1 Thrower and 2 Catchers (and no Ogre), so they are basically made up of rubbish 'peasant' Linemen, and aristocratic Blitzers who all think they're Lord Flasheart Le Legend. Conversely Estallian Teams could have 2 Blitzers but more Catchers/Throwers to allow a more attacking/running game, Tilean teams less Blitzers but an extra Ogre as they play more defensively. |
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98smithg
Joined: Oct 06, 2005
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Jan 12, 2014 - 23:46 |
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Arktoris mentioned grail knights, of course you already have mummies and vampires playing so clearly nothing is out of bounds but i don't think it would fit with the theme of Bretonions to have them. We are talking about making up a new team so obviously they are not going to be mentioned in the bb literature, although i do agree that any made up team should be tier 2 or lower.
I honestly don't know why you are so against the idea we are not talking about putting them on fumbbl, we are just talking about this guys own league. Bretonians have one of the most richly developed identity and lore of all the warhammer races and so it is not beyond reason that people may want to play them in bloodbowl. |
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Calcium
Joined: Apr 08, 2007
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Jan 12, 2014 - 23:50 |
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| 98smithg wrote: | | Bretonians have one of the most richly developed identity and lore of all the warhammer races and so it is not beyond reason that people may want to play them in bloodbowl. |
Are they? That's news to me  |
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Mozza1
Joined: Oct 06, 2013
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Jan 12, 2014 - 23:56 |
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Old Bretonnia would've been more suited to Blood Bowl than New Bretonnia. I miss the cannons. |
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harvestmouse
Joined: May 13, 2007
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Jan 13, 2014 - 00:14 |
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| 98smithg wrote: | | Arktoris mentioned grail knights, of course you already have mummies and vampires playing so clearly nothing is out of bounds but i don't think it would fit with the theme of Bretonions to have them. We are talking about making up a new team so obviously they are not going to be mentioned in the bb literature, although i do agree that any made up team should be tier 2 or lower. |
Well I'm probably giving conflicting information here. This isn't Warhammer. In this world BloodBowl has become more important than war, so it fits that your most talented individuals play BB for national honour.
However they aren't a new team. They were initially made 15 years or more ago.
| 98smithg wrote: | | I honestly don't know why you are so against the idea we are not talking about putting them on fumbbl, we are just talking about this guys own league. Bretonians have one of the most richly developed identity and lore of all the warhammer races and so it is not beyond reason that people may want to play them in bloodbowl. |
I'm most definitely not against the idea, I'm massively in favour of adding Bretonnians. In fact I'd like to see them added to FUMBBL. I think they should be in BloodBowl rules at least. I'm just against Plasmoid deciding what the roster should be, as I don't believe he understands the fundamentals of roster design and dislike all his finished rosters.
| Calcium wrote: | | 98smithg wrote: | | Bretonians have one of the most richly developed identity and lore of all the warhammer races and so it is not beyond reason that people may want to play them in bloodbowl. |
Are they? That's news to me |
Well they've been around a long time, since around 87. The reason being, that Bryan Ansell had a historical range, and wanted an army to represent them (same for Norse and Nippon).
The argument is, that there isn't an 'Imperial' team, but a 'human' team. Which means that standard humans are world wide.
Making the human team an 'Imperial' area team is fine. However a human is a human. So you need a very good reason to make Bretonnian players different to human roster players. This is where the OPs and Plasmoid's roster fail for me. It's adding the skills you'd like, not that will fit. |
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98smithg
Joined: Oct 06, 2005
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Jan 13, 2014 - 04:09 |
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Fair enough, the thing i like about the plasmoid roster is you have these 4 very good players who you have to rely on to cover the weakness found elsewhere. But it is not perfect.
You're choice of stand-firm is good, i would use that. But you haven't used any dauntless which is a must with knights i think. I would also consider something like dirty player for the peasants, that fits their MO. Fend is a bit too good. I would also choose guard on the yomen instead of wrestle, not sure if that is OP on a starting roster, obviously they are sworn to protect their knights.
So i would look at something like
4 knights block, dauntless, stand firm, animosity 7,3,3,9
2-4(???) squires, guard 6,3,3,7
peasants dirty player 6,3,2,7. |
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harvestmouse
Joined: May 13, 2007
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Jan 13, 2014 - 07:50 |
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I used stand firm as that is what they originally had in 4th/gold edition. They never back down in the face of a challenge. Essentially, your top end Bret knights are as close a competitor to a Chaos Warrior as you're going to get. They are also very heavily armoured, hence my stats. After that everything else is what you're find in the human world.
Peasants are the lowest of the low. In medieval times, and warhammer they're/were forced into war they really don't/didn't want to be in. Also as you quite rightly pointed out the Bret teams should be a balance of the very very good and the uber poor.
However I'm never going to agree to adding skills, without extremely good fluff to back it up or are skills already in use for humans (in the main game anyway, stunty is different). This also goes for stat changes. The AV is fine I think, because of the armour, but most likely the knights would lose MA because of it. Loss of AG on the peasants, well yeah I can see this too, but I don't think it's necessary, they're bad enough already, and you're removing a 3rd of their agility.
Guard and DP, I wouldn't want to see on these players. There just isn't the fluff to back it up. DP I would only add to teams that are renowned for being uber dirty. Some of the goblin teams, Dwarf warhammerers, Black Death, Middenheim Marauders maybe.
I also think you're missing an opportunity by only having one type of knight. This is why I have a standardy type knight as a blitzer (still a very good player) and then 2 very heavily armoured and strong knights to shore up the centre.
Here you have the 2 tier team, well with the squires in the middle.
2 uber knights based off of the old stats, to hold the centre with the unwilling peasants falling around them. Then the standard knight/blitzers to do the fancy stuff of making a whole for the faster moving, but lightly armoured squires. |
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ErobererZim
Joined: Dec 19, 2009
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Jan 13, 2014 - 08:21 |
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Im not sure but be Bretonnians Humans? Yes!?!
So why Giving them an own Teamroster? Are Imperiums the only Humans? NO!?! And why is there no Imperium Roster? And when there dont get Imperium and Bretonnis, lets go Deeper into the Warhammer World and say, why not have every Human state an own like an Altdort Team etc.. Cause there be Humans not more not less, no kind of Different racial. And dont be so much different (only the 1Side use Cannons and Technologie and the other Believe). The Humans who have difference, have there own Teams, with Amazones, Norse and the Thralls in the Vampire Team, who u can name Transivilian and these be a state of Brettonnia. |
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spubbbba
Joined: Jul 31, 2006
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Jan 13, 2014 - 09:29 |
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| Arktoris wrote: | I think a Bretonnian team should look like this:
0-16 Bretonnian Squire 6 3 3 8 G 50K
0-2 Bretonian Cleric 6 3 3 8 sure hands Pass 70k G,P
0-4 Bretonnian Errand Knight 8 2 3 7 dodge catch 70k G,A
0-4 Bretonnian Grail Knight 7 3 3 8 Block 90K G, S
0-1 Bretonnian Ogre 5 5 2 9 thick skull mighty blow throw teammate loner bonehead
rerolls 50K
apothecary 50k |
Looks more interesting than every other Bretonnian roster I've seen. Though I do quite like this as an alternative.
0-16 Knight Errant 5 3 3 9 50K
0-2 Squire 5 3 3 8 sure hands, pass 70K
0-4 Knight of the Realm 6 3 3 9 Block 80K
0-4 Questing Knight 4 4 2 9 80K
0-4 Peasant 6 2 3 7 Dodge, stunty, right stuff 40K
Rerolls 60K
Apoth 50K |
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bghandras
Joined: Feb 06, 2011
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| Posted:
Jan 13, 2014 - 09:56 |
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0-16 Squire 6 3 3 8 G 50k
0-4 Armored knight 5 3 3 9 block GS 70k
0-2 Charging knight 7 3 3 8 dauntless GAS 80k
0-1 Mounted knight 8 4 3 8 break tackle, juggernaut, frenzy, secret weapon G 130k
Apo 50k
Reroll 50k |
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jamesfarrell129
Joined: Dec 23, 2009
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Jan 13, 2014 - 10:08 |
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I think spubbbbbbbba and Arktoris have posted the best Bret rosters here. Fluffy, fairly balanced... though not sure about the Errand Knights (shouldn't they be ST3, or AV8 maybe??) and those Knights of the Realm look about 10k too cheap 
If we add Bretonnians to the list of rosters, it has to be done with Monty Python in mind... because I can't see bretonnian knights without being reminded of them. |
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Garion
Joined: Aug 19, 2009
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Jan 13, 2014 - 10:28 |
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Obviously we will never have them in the main divisions thank god. But it would be awesome to have custom rosters in L .
Also for the nay sayers Brets used to be an official roster in 4th ed gold so it is not so dumb to have a separate roster for them. |
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Roland
Joined: May 12, 2004
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Jan 13, 2014 - 10:31 |
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| Garion wrote: | | Also for the nay sayers Brets used to be an official roster in 4th ed gold so it is not so dumb to have a separate roster for them. |
were they anywhere near plasmoids roster?
EDIT: is it this one?
Quantity Title MA ST AG AV Skills Traits Cost
0-12 Peasants 6 3 3 7 40,000
0-2 Squire Catchers 8 2 3 7 Dodge, Catch 70,000
0-4 Squire Throwers 6 3 3 7 Sure Hands, Pass 70,000
0-12 Realm Knight 6 3 3 8 Block Stand Firm 100,000
0-2 Questing Knight 7 4 3 9 Block Stand Firm, Leader 150,000
Title Skill categories
Catchers General, Agility
Throwers General, Passing
Blitzers General, Strength
Linemen General |
Last edited by Roland on %b %13, %2014 - %10:%Jan; edited 1 time in total |
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