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harvestmouse



Joined: May 13, 2007

Post   Posted: May 01, 2016 - 02:49 Reply with quote Back to top

There was a topic recently on using D&D initiative for playing Blood Bowl. That and some other things recently made me think about stat lines and how they're always the same (for a certain type of player).

If you look at the closest real life sports (rugby, American football, Aussie rules etc) you have players playing in a position that are very very different.

Arguably you could say that's how they have developed. However even when starting there are different type of players with different abilities playing the same position.

I'm not sure I'm sold on my idea here, however I was thinking what if you rolled dice for the stat line after making a player? A bit like what you do for roleplaying games.

I was thinking that for each stat you rolled a d8. 2-7 no change 1 -1 on stat 8 +1 on stat. So you'd average a change on every other player (50% chance of 1 change per new player).

Examples:

I buy a Skaven blitzer and roll 6,5,3,1 he has the stat lines 7 3 3 7.

I buy a human lino and roll 4,5,3,7 no change.

I buy an Orc thrower and roll 1,2,8,8 wow! he has the stats 4,3,4,9 a very odd fellow!

I think with stunty and big guys...stunties especially the system swings things a bit too much. However for regular players, it's an interesting concept.

Another downside would it favours teams with a large gold stack, who can recycle players. So probably would need a bank rule too.

I'm going to think about it a bit and I may implement it in my own personal games.

Anyway, thoughts appreciated.
ArrestedDevelopment



Joined: Sep 14, 2015

Post   Posted: May 01, 2016 - 02:52 Reply with quote Back to top

Interesting concept!

Maybe add another roll at 51spp and make it the new ageing Wink

Would definitely be quite cool in a non-retirement league Very Happy

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DarthPhysicist



Joined: Jun 14, 2015

Post   Posted: May 01, 2016 - 03:08 Reply with quote Back to top

Whatever you do... no action surge...

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Using derivative humor since 2005.
tussock



Joined: May 29, 2011

Post   Posted: May 01, 2016 - 04:14 Reply with quote Back to top

Somewhat balanced changes would be better, if still an overall powerup. RPGs have gone to point-buy stats anyway.

-1 ST/+1 AG. If already ST 1, also -1 MA and -1 AV.
-1 AV/+1 MA. If already MA 9, ignore.
-1 MA/-1 AG/+1 ST. If already AG 1 and/or MA 2, also -1 AV.
-1 AG/+1 AV. If already AG 1, ignore.

So you get the odd 5146, 6235, 4326, and 5227 halfling in the team by default.
As well as the odd 6248, 7337, 5428, and 6329 lineman for humans and such.

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pythrr



Joined: Mar 07, 2006

Post   Posted: May 01, 2016 - 04:23 Reply with quote Back to top

i would buy this cow

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pythrr



Joined: Mar 07, 2006

Post   Posted: May 01, 2016 - 04:24 Reply with quote Back to top

tussock wrote:
Somewhat balanced changes would be better, if still an overall powerup. RPGs have gone to point-buy stats anyway.


filthy rpgs, all copying the HERO system.

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ArthurWynne



Joined: Sep 23, 2015

Post   Posted: May 28, 2016 - 13:30 Reply with quote Back to top

I'm totally against it as a general rule change -BB doesn't need more randomness in teambuilding. But it could be fun as a house rule for a single league.
uzkulak



Joined: Mar 30, 2004

Post   Posted: May 28, 2016 - 14:12 Reply with quote Back to top

It does rather lend itself to the people who love to hire and fire, how would you feel about facing 5x hobgoblins with 2 stat increases each and no impact in tv?

If you could manage that aspect of it, the idea does sound kind of fun for a private league.

We did do a pub league one time where every player started with 2-3 perm injuries, was kinda funny but ultimately really favoured the bash teams.
paradocks



Joined: Jun 14, 2004

Post   Posted: May 28, 2016 - 14:37 Reply with quote Back to top

I was thinking about it for a while when I decided I'd prefer not just a random stat roll for new players but a random roll that could have different results like negatraits & mutations (maybe even weapons?) as well as stat modifiers
Wreckage



Joined: Aug 15, 2004

Post   Posted: May 28, 2016 - 14:53 Reply with quote Back to top

We've done something like that way back in tabletop. But the truth is that these stat changes completely dominate the game. An attribute change is just not a small thing.
DarthPhysicist



Joined: Jun 14, 2015

Post   Posted: May 28, 2016 - 15:32 Reply with quote Back to top

I'm for random team choices; a tournament where you have to play each race randomly determined from preset rosters.

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Matthueycamo



Joined: May 16, 2014

Post   Posted: May 28, 2016 - 16:46 Reply with quote Back to top

Probably be fun to create but would not work past that.

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krytie



Joined: Aug 16, 2007

Post   Posted: May 28, 2016 - 16:55 Reply with quote Back to top

paradocks wrote:
I was thinking about it for a while when I decided I'd prefer not just a random stat roll for new players but a random roll that could have different results like negatraits & mutations (maybe even weapons?) as well as stat modifiers


Something like the above but I'd go for having a set of "pre-approved" random variations for each position, eliminating any that might break the game too much.

The d8 would then be -
1=random pick from the lower half,
8=random pick from the upper half,
2-7 = normal positional.
This reduces the number of dice rolls and avoids some of the potential breakages.

I wanted to check two things with the OP --
1. Did you want to apply TV changes based on the new stats? This adds complexity but without it you could get some unfair matchups.
2. In an online environment such as FUMBBL, whats to stop someone creating team after team after team until he gets an amazing starting lineup?

Nice idea to swing things a bit. I've thought about similar things in the past e.g. a veterans league where every player starts with a random +stat and perm (niggle or -stat) but didn't like the way it would slow down TT games checking player profiles.

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harvestmouse



Joined: May 13, 2007

Post   Posted: May 28, 2016 - 20:43 Reply with quote Back to top

Well the comments are moving a bit away from my original intention. The idea is that players aren't 100% equal and that there would be some deviation. So the standard stat line is in fact the 'average' player; not every player. I'm still deliberating whether it's a good idea or not and whether I'm going to introduce it.

"Did you want to apply TV changes based on the new stats? This adds complexity but without it you could get some unfair matchups."

Actually I want to reduce the importance of TV altogether. I want to use it only to show the 'weight' of the team, changes in a team and to work out winnings.

For perpetual I'd like to see more of a recent win/loss handicapping and for league table positioning. I personally do not use handicapping at all. For resurrection, this would not work at all.

2. In an online environment such as FUMBBL, whats to stop someone creating team after team after team until he gets an amazing starting lineup?

A great point! So........possibly a starting line up should be standard stat players.....Also I think it's more of a League thing where you don't have that opportunity to recycle teams. I guess, you'd also have to have the rule where players without perms may not be sacked unless division weight culls are necessary. This would also give experienced teams a little bit of an edge. Therefore 'slightly' inhibits team recycling.
MattDakka



Joined: Oct 09, 2007

Post   Posted: May 28, 2016 - 20:53 Reply with quote Back to top

harvestmouse wrote:

I buy a Skaven blitzer and roll 6,5,3,1 he has the stat lines 7 3 3 7.

I buy an Orc thrower and roll 1,2,8,8 wow! he has the stats 4,3,4,9 a very odd fellow!

If that happened to me I would fire them immediately.
Why would I have a new Blitzer with -AV and a MA 4 Thrower?
Even with AG 4 he's too slow.
BB stats are not granular enough to ensure that a non-standard stat line system is reasonably balanced.
A -1 or +1 stats is often a massive swing for a player.
This system strongly encourages players cycling if a team has a huge treasury.

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