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Cyco



Joined: Nov 30, 2003

Post 18 Posted: Jun 01, 2004 - 08:20 Reply with quote Back to top

I think chaos beasts should have a stunty team. But Im no good with what is balanced or not so I whish for you to help me. My idea however is as follows.

0-1 Minotaur, 5528 Mighty Blow, Thick Skull, Frenzy, Horns, Throw Team Mate, Always Hungry, Big Guy, Wild Animal 110k
0-2 Beastigors 6338 Horns 60k
0-4 Gors 5237 Horns, Dodge, Stunty 50k
0-12 Ungors 5136 Horns, Dodge, Stunty 40k
RR: 70k

Access to physical ablilities for every player - (if they roll dubble).
Gors and Ungors only have access to agility skills.

They aint too good to start with but they may gain fun skills and might be very fun to play with when you have developed them, just like a regular chaos team. Hons give them some adventage but then again, thats all they have to start with.

You get an all horny team. Twisted Evil
AcheronStyx



Joined: Aug 02, 2003

Post   Posted: Jun 01, 2004 - 08:31 Reply with quote Back to top

Quote:

0-2 Beastigors 6338 Horns 60k

just plain beastmen, with what skill access?

team sounds like fun, and NO, it's not just nurglings....nurglings have regen. these poor sods only get the apoth. i would play a team like this. Plus, the minotaur is my favorite player in the game. maybe remove the beastigors, and just have 2 minos =D
Cyco



Joined: Nov 30, 2003

Post   Posted: Jun 01, 2004 - 08:40 Reply with quote Back to top

Quote:
just plain beastmen, with what skill access?

The beasts should have access to general and strenght. This is because the only have one mino and no secret weapons.

Quote:
maybe remove the beastigors, and just have 2 minos =D

That could be an idea but I think that its more fun with more player to choose from. Maybe change the beastigors a little.

Piekko said (in the chat)
Quote:
Give the Gors AG2 and a fun physical instead. That might be a very fun idea, if I could think of a fun physical to give them.

And I agree, but I dont know what skill?
peikko



Joined: Aug 02, 2003

Post   Posted: Jun 01, 2004 - 09:19 Reply with quote Back to top

CycoD wrote:
Quote:
just plain beastmen, with what skill access?

The beasts should have access to general and strenght. This is because the only have one mino and no secret weapons.


So there will be 3 players with mib-block-tackle with 2 of em st3 with no negative skill what so ever who can block 3d blitzes with 1 assistant... Sounds SCARY. Weapons do get send out and most of them sometimes backfire.
Smess



Joined: Feb 13, 2004

Post   Posted: Jun 01, 2004 - 09:48 Reply with quote Back to top

The two beastigors would be the best balhandlers and in stunty. And indeed, St3, horns, block, tackle, MB in stunty ??
They are obviously non-stunty players, so a team with 2 minos and no beasts would be a lot more balanced.
Cyco



Joined: Nov 30, 2003

Post   Posted: Jun 01, 2004 - 10:02 Reply with quote Back to top

peikko wrote:
CycoD wrote:
Quote:
just plain beastmen, with what skill access?

The beasts should have access to general and strenght. This is because the only have one mino and no secret weapons.


So there will be 3 players with mib-block-tackle with 2 of em st3 with no negative skill what so ever who can block 3d blitzes with 1 assistant... Sounds SCARY. Weapons do get send out and most of them sometimes backfire.


Very true.

Maybe this is a better idea, like AcheronStyx suggested;
0-2 Minotaur, 5528 Mighty Blow, Thick Skull, Frenzy, Horns, Throw Team Mate, Always Hungry, Big Guy, Wild Animal 110k
0-4 Gors 5237 Horns, Dodge, Stunty, 50k
0-12 Ungors 5136 Horns, Dodge, Stunty 40k
RR: 70k

Maybe change the Gors to;
Gor 5227 Horns, Dodge, Stunty, Thick Skull 50k
Mezir



Joined: Aug 02, 2003

Post   Posted: Jun 01, 2004 - 10:31 Reply with quote Back to top

Or... Drop the beastigors to AG 2 alongside the Gors. Stick to one mino. Maybe drop Strength access on the beastigors as well.

So that'd be:

0-1 Minotaur 5528 Mighty Blow, Thick Skull, Frenzy, Horns, Throw Team Mate, Always Hungry, Big Guy, Wild Animal 110k G, S, Ph
0-2 Beastigor 6328 Horns 60k G Ph
0-4 Gor 5227 Horns Dodge (Extra Arms?) 50k A Ph
0-12 Ungor 5136 Horns Dodge 40k A Ph
Grod



Joined: Sep 30, 2003

Post   Posted: Jun 01, 2004 - 11:00 Reply with quote Back to top

Horns is not so useful and necessary to have with every player - you can only blitz once per turn! Maybe take the horns from the Ungor, since they're not so useful anyway.

Another possibility to represent Ungors being wild and unruly creatures: give all Ungors thrall and OFAB, so that there is a possibility that they turn amongst themselves and attack each other every turn. You can then give them something nice to offset this unpredictability (maybe frenzy)? I like unpredictable stunty teams.

Anyway there isn't anything wrong with the roster you mentioned, Im just throwing my suggestions about it all.

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Cyco



Joined: Nov 30, 2003

Post   Posted: Jun 01, 2004 - 12:01 Reply with quote Back to top

Grod wrote:
Horns is not so useful and necessary to have with every player - you can only blitz once per turn! Maybe take the horns from the Ungor, since they're not so useful anyway.


Horns - Aint that good, true. But fun and gives the ungors some chance of throwing a blitz. Id like to keep horns.

Grod wrote:
Another possibility to represent Ungors being wild and unruly creatures: give all Ungors thrall and OFAB, so that there is a possibility that they turn amongst themselves and attack each other every turn. You can then give them something nice to offset this unpredictability (maybe frenzy)? I like unpredictable stunty teams.


That is a very fun idea. Could work with a Stunty skaven team aswell. Must think of one, hehe.

Mezir wrote:
Or... Drop the beastigors to AG 2 alongside the Gors. Stick to one mino. Maybe drop Strength access on the beastigors as well.


To give them general skills means they'll ge block and tackle farily quick. Maybe limit them to ST-skills instead. =)

If I add that togehter that would make;
0-1 Minotaur 5528 Mighty Blow, Thick Skull, Frenzy, Horns, Throw Team Mate, Always Hungry, Big Guy, Wild Animal 110k G, S, Ph
0-2 Beastigor 6328 Horns, Thick Skull 60k S Ph
0-4 Gor 5227 Horns, Dodge, Thick Skull 50k A Ph
0-12 Ungor 5136 Horns, Dodge, Stunty, Off For A Bite, Thrall, Thick Skull 40k A Ph
RR: 70k

Thick Skull and Horns shows how hard headed these beasts are.
OFAB and Thrall shows the just how much you can trust your ungors from fighting among themselves insead of the enemy.
Mezir



Joined: Aug 02, 2003

Post   Posted: Jun 01, 2004 - 12:06 Reply with quote Back to top

CycoD wrote:
Mezir wrote:
Or... Drop the beastigors to AG 2 alongside the Gors. Stick to one mino. Maybe drop Strength access on the beastigors as well.


To give them general skills means they'll ge block and tackle farily quick. Maybe limit them to ST-skills instead. =)


The point was that the Block/Tackle/Mighty Blow combo would be over the top. You need some players with Block and Tackle. All stunty teams have two at least, and those are big guys. With one big guy youneed some other back-up with Block. So make it harder for the beastigors to get Mighty Blow, so they're more reliable to block with, but less reliable on getting players off the pitch. Just my two cents.
Cyco



Joined: Nov 30, 2003

Post   Posted: Jun 01, 2004 - 12:16 Reply with quote Back to top

Mezir wrote:
The point was that the Block/Tackle/Mighty Blow combo would be over the top. You need some players with Block and Tackle. All stunty teams have two at least, and those are big guys. With one big guy youneed some other back-up with Block. So make it harder for the beastigors to get Mighty Blow, so they're more reliable to block with, but less reliable on getting players off the pitch. Just my two cents.


Good point that would make;
0-1 Minotaur 5528 Mighty Blow, Thick Skull, Frenzy, Horns, Throw Team Mate, Always Hungry, Big Guy, Wild Animal 110k G, S, Ph
0-2 Beastigor 6328 Horns, Thick Skull 60k G Ph
0-4 Gor 5227 Horns, Dodge, Thick Skull 50k A Ph
0-12 Ungor 5136 Horns, Dodge, Stunty, Off For A Bite, Thrall, Thick Skull 40k A Ph
RR: 70k

Thick Skull and Horns shows how hard headed these beasts are.
OFAB and Thrall shows the just how much you can trust your ungors from fighting among themselves insead of the enemy.
peikko



Joined: Aug 02, 2003

Post   Posted: Jun 01, 2004 - 12:24 Reply with quote Back to top

Mezir wrote:
You need some players with Block and Tackle. All stunty teams have two at least, and those are big guys.


That aint true, skinks and squigs dont.
And gnomes dont have bg's althought slayers get block+tackle
Mezir



Joined: Aug 02, 2003

Post   Posted: Jun 01, 2004 - 12:28 Reply with quote Back to top

Squigs have 6 str 4 players though, while skinks are the fastest players around. Meanwhile, gnomes have cannon, bombers and orc slayers that have great skill access, and are generally considered the weakest team in stunty.

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Build a man a fire and he's warm for a day; set a man on fire and he's warm for the rest of his life.
Nicrolagh



Joined: Mar 21, 2004

Post   Posted: Jun 01, 2004 - 15:12 Reply with quote Back to top

I was thinking of about some "beast-themed" stunties earlier on, based on what I read right here it could be something like this:

0-2 Minos 5 5 2 8 ect. (your classic bb mino's)
0-2 Centaurus Welps 8 2 2 7 sprint, Sure feet / Ag
0-2 Harpies 7 2 3 6 Leap, stunty, right stuff, Wild Animal / Ag
0-16 Ungors 6 2 2 6 horns, stunty, dodge, right stuff / Ag, Ph

Haprie get WA preventing them to be Td-machines, making their use more risky as ball handlers, passer or TTM bullets.
Gave the Ungors str 2 but reduced ag 2. got the impression they'd rather be nasty bashy little lads then and a little to wild and carried away to handle to ball correctly + they'd be less promt to dodge away nicely from opp's.
Centaurus welps could be made tougher (8 4 2 8 ) by losing the minos and being able to take 0-4 this way. should gain have Str/ag acces then I'd think, + prolly gain big guy making them a little less reliable.

I liked the idea of the thrall/ofab ungors, bashing each others, very much. Would indeed play with their beastial/wild side.

I didn't propose any prices, thus I truly suck at those Wink and it would depend on wheter they'd stick with minos or gain 4 centaurus instead, plus the thrall/ofab Ungors would lower their price consequently I Thing.

ps: just got up, don't look at the spelling Very Happy
EvolveToAnarchism



Joined: Aug 02, 2003

Post   Posted: Jun 03, 2004 - 07:05 Reply with quote Back to top

I had an Ungor team on the backburner for quite some time. I was waiting for the WA issue to be settled and to get my hands on the Beasts of Chaos before posting a team. I just got the Beasts Army Book the other day Smile Now that I've got a handle on the Fluff, I think I can make something Unique, and would have a Novel playing style.

Fluff: The team would be based on Brays, the weakest of the Ungors. Little runty beastmen that don't even have "real" horns. I'd also include the other parts of the herd that hang out on the periphery: hounds and centigors.

Unique: My original plan was to make them a brawling type stunty team. G access rather than A. I was going to use the Wild Animal or Bonehead schtick to represent all their internal fighting. Wild animal seems fluffier, but it would probably cripple the team unless I gave them the option to take alot of hounds.

Novel playing style: I want to emphasizes their brawling (G access) unreliable nature (wild animal, bonehead, frenzy).

A few ideas:
Brays (Brawlers) M6 S2 A3 AV7 Bonehead? Wild Animal?, Stunty?, Frenzy? , Block?
Brays (Traditional Stunty) M6 S2 A3 AV7 Bonehead, Stunty, Dodge A,S, Ph
Hounds M7 S2 A3 AV7 No Hands A, Ph
Bray Blitzers M6 S2 A3 AV7 Wild Animal, Frenzy?, Horns G, S
Centigors M5 S4 A1 AV9 Really Stupid, Frenzy, Surefeet, Sprint G, S
Minotaurs?

Thoughts:
Bray (Brawlers): Starting with block seems fair combined with either Bonehead or Wild Animal. It would definitely make a unique stunty profile, but WA could be crippling, so I'm leaning towards using Bonehead to represent their internal fighting and general undisciplinedness. Frenzy could be fun, but doesn't seem to fit the fluff. Either way it could become problematic when a bunch of them get block, tackle and perhaps even guard.
Bray (Traditional Stunty): An easy traditional way out. It may be the more balanced apporach but less FUN. I could give them Frenzy as compensation for bonehead, but again it doesn't really fit the fluff.
Hounds: I added these largely for balancing purposes. If you've got a roster full of WA, it might be nice to have a few reliable hounds to make the team playable. A few No Handed players could also give the team a Unique spin.
Bray Blitzer: The idea was to use these guys to help balance out the team and give them their equivalent to a secret weapon (horns). Definitely not as potent as other SWs but it's easier to justify getting rid of negatraits from the "elite" brays Smile
Centigors: It's awfully tempting to just give them minotaurs and be done with it, but minos are a large part of the Chaos Flings. So, I opted to include the Centigors. Really stupid and frenzy should capture the essence of these drunken louts. A fast moving pseudo big guy might compensate for their baseline stunties having a negatrait. Another option is to give them choices for their 2 BGs from Minos and Centigors.

Summary: I held off on trying to design a "beastman" stunty team for a long time. I hate the idea of just adding "ling" to a standard BB roster. I had proposed this rough idea to Klipp a LONG time ago, but we both agreed that ungors just really weren't stunty in the fluff. So, I was pleasantly suprised when I was reading through the Beasts Book the other day and came across a reference to the runty bray that hang out on the fringes of the beastman herd. So I was quite suprised to see this thread the day after I had finished reading the army book. I definitely think the team fits one of my 3 criteria of a stunty team... they are Fluffy.

The next dilemma is how to make them Unique. The answer was obvious, use the schtick I had originally wanted to use with the Ungors. An unreliable stunty team that likes to brawl instead of dodge. Dodgy brays could work and fit the fluff (cowardly runts who scavenge on the outskirts), but then they'd be very similar to every other stunty race. A dodgeless "stunty" would be different. They could likely be the weakest link in the team if they don't get the block to start. Other options would be to remove stunty from them to make them hardier, as they will get knocked over a ton without dodge. It woud definitely take alot of testing to get the Brays right.

Managing your Boneheads, Wild Animals, Frenzy and Beasts could be an interesting tactical challenge. The mayhem factor created by all those rolls would be high. Team development would be very different if the baseline "stunty" had G access. Overall, I think this team would offer a novel playing styles, but would need extensive playtesting to get the right mix of player types and skill sets.

Conclusion: This could be a revolutionary team, but I'd like to sit on it for a while as I think the Skryre Slaves and the Circus team both are likely to be a lot less work.

As Always,
Evolve To Anarchism

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