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MattDakka



Joined: Oct 09, 2007

Post   Posted: Oct 02, 2017 - 16:23 Reply with quote Back to top

About the stats: would it be possible to show the KOs in the Casualties entry? Currently the Casualties entry displays only BH/SI/Deaths.


Last edited by MattDakka on Oct 02, 2017 - 16:38; edited 2 times in total
Zabriskie69



Joined: Oct 18, 2016

Post   Posted: Oct 02, 2017 - 16:25 Reply with quote Back to top

MrMagic wrote:
Double ones are not so bad when being rolled on your pieces injury table.

I speak about your own dices , not the opponent dices.

MattDakka wrote:
Since you can't control the dice you should focus more on improving your coaching skill rather than on dice stats.

why this agressivity ?

MattDakka wrote:
Rolling a double 1 is not generally an issue if it happens after the important actions have been performed while rolling a double 1 at the start of a turn is generally an issue, the point is that dice rolls need a context to be really meaningful.

No, double 1 on ball action is always a problem.

MattDakka wrote:
It's not just the quantity of good dice rolled, sometimes a single very lucky roll (like an unlikely pass or a -2d block) will have more impact on the game than rolling pows all game.

it's why i purpose to sort the dices by kind of action .....

So gentleman (and the few laides), thanks to speak about my proposition with serious and no agressivity, I just launch a subject, if you are bored or not interested about it , just continue your way .
Tulkas_jrrt



Joined: Apr 30, 2012

Post   Posted: Oct 02, 2017 - 16:29 Reply with quote Back to top

Thanks ArrestedDevelopment, and Yes, my Ogre has made a double Skull and KOshimself on last turn Smile That's exact.
I got a rock on turn 0 of second half on Helmut Wulf, where can i propose an improvement ? mp CandleJack ?

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MattDakka



Joined: Oct 09, 2007

Post   Posted: Oct 02, 2017 - 16:34 Reply with quote Back to top

Zabriskie69 wrote:

MattDakka wrote:
Since you can't control the dice you should focus more on improving your coaching skill rather than on dice stats.

why this agressivity ?

Not aggressivity, I just made a suggestion, you seem really obsessed by dice stats. The majority of the games you play will have average dice, so, unless you play weak teams, dice will not be an issue, don't worry so much about dice and you can't change them anyway. Worry about the things you can change, like tactics, strategy, positioning, skill builds, actions' order etc.
Zabriskie69 wrote:

No, double 1 on ball action is always a problem.

Nope, if you are making a pass to farm 1 SPP at the end of a half failing that ball action is not a problem, if you are handing off the ball to a player near the endzone to make him skill up and the opponent can't reach the ball is not a problem, not all double 1s are a problem, it's when or for what you roll the double 1 that might be troublesome.
I failed a pick up with double 1 the last game I played, but my opponent was far from the ball and I had screened it so the failure was not a problem.
Not all the failed actions are really relevant for the outcome of a game.
Zabriskie69



Joined: Oct 18, 2016

Post   Posted: Oct 02, 2017 - 16:45 Reply with quote Back to top

MattDakka wrote:
Zabriskie69 wrote:

MattDakka wrote:
Since you can't control the dice you should focus more on improving your coaching skill rather than on dice stats.

why this agressivity ?

Not aggressivity, I just made a suggestion, you seem really obsessed by dice stats. The majority of the games you play will have average dice, so, unless you play weak teams, dice will not be an issue, don't worry so much about dice and you can't change them anyway. Worry about the things you can change, like tactics, strategy, positioning, skill builds, actions' order etc.

Say like that is better (thank you) and OK i understand your point of view, just note that I'm not obsessed just wanna have a real "dice" meter

MattDakka wrote:

Nope, if you are making a pass to farm 1 SPP at the end of a half failing that ball action is not a problem, if you are handing off the ball to a player near the endzone to make him skill up and the opponent can't reach the ball is not a problem, not all double 1s are a problem, it's when or for what you roll the double 1 that might be troublesome.
I failed a pick up with double 1 the last game I played, but my opponent was far from the ball and I had screened it so the failure was not a problem.
Not all the failed actions are really relevant for the outcome of a game.

I was more speeking about game without SPP , the last example is the only example which concern this kind of game, and in this case, if your opponent play well by surrounding the ball, therefore this double 1 could lead to an issue .
MattDakka



Joined: Oct 09, 2007

Post   Posted: Oct 02, 2017 - 16:51 Reply with quote Back to top

For sure a double 1 could lead to an issue, but it's not an absolute thing.
When that double 1 happens (end of game? Turn 1?), where (can your opponent reach the ball or not? can you reach it before him?) and for what kind of action (did you really need to pick up the ball? Just screening it was enough?).
Also, you can protect the ball, unless you are outnumbered or some event happens.
Candlejack



Joined: Aug 02, 2003

Post   Posted: Oct 02, 2017 - 18:01 Reply with quote Back to top

Finally I have some time to weigh in Wink

Where to start..

Yesterday Christer approached me since he finally found time to start integrating the extended dice stats code that has been lying around for a while. The new version caused errors on basically all recent replays, which in retrospect fits with the issue that a lot of matches did not have dice stats generated for a few months.

I don't want to bother you with the tech babble, so in short terms: I soon found the issue and after a few hours I had a fix ready that Christer put into production a few minutes later. So I hope that now all games get basic stats again, at least those matches I checked did.

Now Christer has started to visualize the extended stats that should now be available for all games. One feature is the turn time line that is already visible in a first version.

But there is quite some more stuff in it and I hope Christer can afford the time to visualize all or at least most of it. As an example, there is turnover imformation, showing why a turn ended prematurely e.g. what action failed, what the required roll was and if it was rerolled and if so if it was a team reroll or not.

Another thing is that the stats show how man 2+, 3+, 4+.. rolls where made, succeeded and failed. So this could be some indication about something similar to "luck" but would also show if people are just rolling recklessly risky dice.

There acutally is much more in it and all stats are available in match and on turn level. The question is if all of that can be visualized in a sensible way. So please bare with Christer, he has a lot of work to do after all.

@Tulkas_jrrt: If you refer to a kick off event like "throw a rock", that information should be there already, it is just not assigned to a certain turn. Instead it is assigned to the drive object wrapping the turns. So it is just not visualized yet.

In case it was on a blitz turn, then this is related to an issue we found yesterday, it seems that for some reason the stats for blitz turns are not recorded properly. I will look into that and try to fix it.

Additionally I will see if I can add a bit more data as there have been a few requests already, here in the forum and on discord. Unfortunately not all requests will be fulfilled because either the data is not accessible or would require way too much effort or the value added does not justify the work needed.

In an ideal world the stats generation would take place inside the ffb server but that will probably not happen any time soon.

So the bottom line is: Please be patient, Christer is working on the rendering and I will try to improve/fix the code to provide sensible and complete data. Of course any feature request is welcome but I hope you understand that not everything will be implemented.

And finally I have to say that I am really happy people still like the dice stats and seem to use quite a bit Smile I was afraid interest would run low after the initial hype.

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MattDakka



Joined: Oct 09, 2007

Post   Posted: Oct 02, 2017 - 18:08 Reply with quote Back to top

Hi Candlejack, is it possible to add the KOs please?
Currently the post match page displays only Badly Hurt, Serious Injuries and Dead.
KOs, even if they are not Casualties, still have an impact on a game.
Candlejack



Joined: Aug 02, 2003

Post   Posted: Oct 02, 2017 - 18:18 Reply with quote Back to top

The match report page is not created from my data. But in the stats I also count the KOs, so it could be rendered. But that is something Christer would have to do.

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Zabriskie69



Joined: Oct 18, 2016

Post   Posted: Oct 02, 2017 - 18:47 Reply with quote Back to top

A big thank you CandleJAck, especialy for this part :

Candlejack wrote:
Another thing is that the stats show how man 2+, 3+, 4+.. rolls where made, succeeded and failed. So this could be some indication about something similar to "luck" but would also show if people are just rolling recklessly risky dice.


is exactly what i wanna see Smile
I Hope it will be available soon
Sp00keh



Joined: Dec 06, 2011

Post   Posted: Oct 02, 2017 - 19:50 Reply with quote Back to top

easilyamused wrote:
So basically you want something that will tell you that your opponent only won because of good dice?


Why not?
Sometimes I am unsure if the result (win or loss) was a more to do with luck, or skill

It'd be nice to be able to put a number on it somehow, currently the stats don't really give an indication of actual luck which is what OP is after really


If I failed every pickup attempt, but roll sixes for everything else, this still means bad luck cost me the game, and isn't displayed currently

The improvements mentioned above do sound good, look forward to it
Sp00keh



Joined: Dec 06, 2011

Post   Posted: Oct 02, 2017 - 20:02 Reply with quote Back to top

Could it track hits on the ball carrier?
That's often something that swings the scoreline...
Candlejack



Joined: Aug 02, 2003

Post   Posted: Oct 02, 2017 - 20:18 Reply with quote Back to top

Hits on the ball carrier is something that is not really recorded by the client. It does however record ball scatter events. And that is something I already gather in the report, so the visualization could indicate in which turns the ball scattered. That is not the same but it could be an indication, but I am not sure it would be useful.

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Wozzaa



Joined: Apr 23, 2016

Post   Posted: Oct 02, 2017 - 20:42 Reply with quote Back to top

Here is the game that started this 'dice stat rampage': https://fumbbl.com/FUMBBL.php?page=match&id=3934805

Thought I'd post to give a bit of context.

Throughout the game Zabriskie69 got very upset and began to insult my apparent lack of intelligence.

I don't think I played as aimlessly as he suggests, but admit at crucial times I got reasonable dice which led to the win.

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ramchop



Joined: Oct 12, 2013

Post   Posted: Oct 02, 2017 - 20:58
FUMBBL Staff
Reply with quote Back to top

Dice stats are great. I really appreciate the good work that you do Candlejack (and Christer of course).

Dice stats can help justify why you feel hard done by in a game. But they will never vindicate poor sportsmanship. Be nice.
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