RedDevilCG
Joined: Jan 09, 2010
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 Posted:
Dec 28, 2017 - 21:52 |
 
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JackassRampant
Joined: Feb 26, 2011
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Dec 28, 2017 - 22:04 |
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I think the naming rules are important. But an auto-generated player name that you could overwrite would be really welcome for a lot of newer coaches. |
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Lude enixe, obliviscatur timor. |
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RedDevilCG
Joined: Jan 09, 2010
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Dec 28, 2017 - 22:11 |
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People are already flaunting the spirit of the naming rules. Random noun + a roman numeral for replacements; might as well make it okay to just make positional names + jersey number. |
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Arktoris
Joined: Feb 16, 2004
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Dec 28, 2017 - 22:24 |
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[quote="koadah"]
| Arktoris wrote: | | sweep away the unnecessary rules. We old folks know the rules well because we were here when the new rules were invented and thus got to learn them in steps. But new folks are hit with pages and pages of rules and are expected to know them all before their first game. |
Get rid of the rules and you get a horrible mess like Cyanide.
read what I said again.
yes, when I meet someone who clearly is new and doesn't have a grasp of the fundamental rules. I tell them about the 145 club. Provide link etc. |
_________________
Hail to Manowar! The latest charioteer to DIE for bloodbowl! - Slain, by Ghor Oggaz |
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Brainsaw
Joined: Sep 27, 2005
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| Posted:
Dec 28, 2017 - 22:40 |
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as i read it, there are several aspects to consider:
1) understanding the site, especially divisions
2) how to get a game
3) game rules
4) make BB great again
i would say: if you ever reached the point where you understood the basic rules AND got the game running, we are almost done. After that people stay or leave due to the game itself, not for the client or the site.
Understanding the site in its full complexity isnt target no1 and wont help. I suggest providing one or more premade teams in a Academy or other non ranked division. If people learn, that Ranked or Blackbox do count towards CR, it might be an additional downer and/or exit point.
There has to be an easy fast setup non ranked way to play a game.
Steps for solutions:
-Video Tutorial!
-Guided Tour including the Installation of JRE.
-Mentoring!
I am sure there are specialists here who can do the video tutorial part and the guided tour.
Regarding the mentoring, I would happily agree on being available for such kind of requests and academic games.
Getting a popup message from fumbbl, that someboday new with an Academic team wants a game would help.
If all coaches who agreed upon being a mentor AND are online receive such a message, chances are very high, that newbies can be provided help quickly AND there is a direct personal touch to it.
At the time, i was new to fumbbl, Flix took me by the hand and explained the most important things about the site, leagues, divisions and the rules to me.
I think this was one of the main reasons i stayed with fumbbl and BB.
The starter Guide, which includes all relevant links and Infos could be made to pop up on every login until ticked away by the user.
I think, all suggested points should be doable by users or christer. |
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Guardikai
Joined: Jun 23, 2009
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Dec 28, 2017 - 23:06 |
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I have a suggestion that's free, fairly quick to do and useful to all new visitors of the website - video tutorials.
The quick start guide - https://fumbbl.com/help:CRP - is really helpful. It would simply be taking this and breaking it up into short (3-5 minute) blocks.
E.g.
1) How to sign up and meet the community
Two minutes to purpose of the site, creating an account, telling people there is a discord and to use the forums for help
2) How to create a team
Literally showing someone how to create a team and name them. It should include a few links/mentions to name generating webpages to help those who struggle with this. It should also mention there are webpages for strategy, and to join the discord or forums for assistance.
3) New coaches tips and tricks
The 145 club, again mentioning the discord and forums (drive this point home!), the strategy pages, other good sites to use
4) Different divisions and coach rating
A quick explanation of each and how coaches get their ratings
5) How to get a ranked game
6) How to get a box game
7) Leagues
 How the client works (aka how to make players actually do stuff when you open the java)
9) How to manage teams (after games, with skill ups, buying new players, etc.)
10) Site rules, especially what to do if you have an issue
Cover things like disconnections, being harassed, bugs/glitches
This would really help people get into things faster. Young people now process information quickly and (whether good or bad) expect bite size information, at least generally in my experience and that of organisations I've worked for. The help page covers most of this, but people often find too much text and everything in one place somewhat intimidating. It isn't as engaging as a video would be.
Auto team/player name generators would be great, stricter rules enforcement would be nice, updates to the client, etc. All good ideas Igvy. However, I think the easiest, quickest and best first step would be video tutorials. It'd be a big quick win.
I am somewhat sad Brainsaw got to them first as I type! :3 *Shakes fist* But I do second the idea. |
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Dominik
Joined: Oct 29, 2004
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Dec 28, 2017 - 23:08 |
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Just saying its tedious to find a fair Ranked game and seeing the same coaches asking for the same matchup again and again, combined with a "biing" sound doesn't help.
To the proposals of the thread creator:
Speeding up the initial phase (registration, creating a team, finding a game) might help. Rookies could get the help of an "automatic team creator".
Just lower the hurdles. Not everyone who discovers FUMBBL is a die-hard Blood Bowl fan, but one might become one! |
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koadah
Joined: Mar 30, 2005
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| Posted:
Dec 28, 2017 - 23:15 |
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[quote="Arktoris"]| koadah wrote: |
| Arktoris wrote: | | sweep away the unnecessary rules. We old folks know the rules well because we were here when the new rules were invented and thus got to learn them in steps. But new folks are hit with pages and pages of rules and are expected to know them all before their first game. |
Get rid of the rules and you get a horrible mess like Cyanide. |
| Arktoris wrote: |
read what I said again.
yes, when I meet someone who clearly is new and doesn't have a grasp of the fundamental rules. I tell them about the 145 club. Provide link etc. |
So which rules are the "unnecessary" ones? |
_________________
O[L]C 2016 Swiss! - April ---- All Star Bowl - Teams of Stars - 2 more teams needed |
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JellyBelly
Joined: Jul 08, 2009
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Dec 28, 2017 - 23:24 |
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Something else that has occurred to me is that there could be several benefits to making the site/FFB client free software (which they currently aren't):
- If the source code were open, it would make it much easier for anyone that had the time/inclination to try to make alternative versions of the client. For example, a scalable client or Javascript client that would work on tablets. As mentioned, both of these things might help bring in new players. Free software can be easily built upon by others.
- Perhaps a free-software model could apply to the site itself as well? If others could play around with their own versions of the site locally, and then submit 'merge requests', it might help to accelerate some of the ideas that are being mentioned here. Christer is amazing, but it's hard when there is only one developer.
- There is a list of several long-standing bugs in the client that have not been fixed for years. If the code were free then there might be a realistic chance of these getting fixed. For all that Kalimar has done for us, it seems clear he does not intend to continue developing/maintaining the code.
- There is already an established community of 'free-software enthusiasts', many of whom are (guess what?) somewhat nerdy people who like games. However, there are not that many options out there for free software games. So, if word was to get around that FUMBBL was to become 'free', then that might help to bring some new people in. Also, guess what? Many of them have some level of coding/development experience too. Ah, the synergies ...
Just something else to think about  |
_________________
"Opinions are like arseholes, everybody's got them and they all stink." - The protagonist, Fallout 2
"Go for the eyes, Boo! Go for the eyes!!"  |
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sann0638
Joined: Aug 09, 2010
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| Posted:
Dec 28, 2017 - 23:29 |
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gpope
Joined: Jun 04, 2010
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| Posted:
Dec 28, 2017 - 23:32 |
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| Guardikai wrote: | I have a suggestion that's free, fairly quick to do and useful to all new visitors of the website - video tutorials.
The quick start guide - https://fumbbl.com/help:CRP - is really helpful. It would simply be taking this and breaking it up into short (3-5 minute) blocks.
E.g.
1) How to sign up and meet the community
Two minutes to purpose of the site, creating an account, telling people there is a discord and to use the forums for help
2) How to create a team
Literally showing someone how to create a team and name them. It should include a few links/mentions to name generating webpages to help those who struggle with this. It should also mention there are webpages for strategy, and to join the discord or forums for assistance.
3) New coaches tips and tricks
The 145 club, again mentioning the discord and forums (drive this point home!), the strategy pages, other good sites to use
4) Different divisions and coach rating
A quick explanation of each and how coaches get their ratings
5) How to get a ranked game
6) How to get a box game
7) Leagues
How the client works (aka how to make players actually do stuff when you open the java)
9) How to manage teams (after games, with skill ups, buying new players, etc.)
10) Site rules, especially what to do if you have an issue
Cover things like disconnections, being harassed, bugs/glitches |
Not saying that video tutorials aren't a good idea, but the fact that you propose 30+ minutes worth of video tutorial just to get into the game really underscores how much of a barrier to entry we're dealing with here. |
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mrt1212
Joined: Feb 26, 2013
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Dec 28, 2017 - 23:40 |
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| gpope wrote: | | Guardikai wrote: | I have a suggestion that's free, fairly quick to do and useful to all new visitors of the website - video tutorials.
The quick start guide - https://fumbbl.com/help:CRP - is really helpful. It would simply be taking this and breaking it up into short (3-5 minute) blocks.
E.g.
1) How to sign up and meet the community
Two minutes to purpose of the site, creating an account, telling people there is a discord and to use the forums for help
2) How to create a team
Literally showing someone how to create a team and name them. It should include a few links/mentions to name generating webpages to help those who struggle with this. It should also mention there are webpages for strategy, and to join the discord or forums for assistance.
3) New coaches tips and tricks
The 145 club, again mentioning the discord and forums (drive this point home!), the strategy pages, other good sites to use
4) Different divisions and coach rating
A quick explanation of each and how coaches get their ratings
5) How to get a ranked game
6) How to get a box game
7) Leagues
How the client works (aka how to make players actually do stuff when you open the java)
9) How to manage teams (after games, with skill ups, buying new players, etc.)
10) Site rules, especially what to do if you have an issue
Cover things like disconnections, being harassed, bugs/glitches |
Not saying that video tutorials aren't a good idea, but the fact that you propose 30+ minutes worth of video tutorial just to get into the game really underscores how much of a barrier to entry we're dealing with here. |
But that's an intrinsic barrier to the game itself. If one of your buds was trying to rope you into playing TT, you'd spend 4 hours gawking while your bud does moves and explains them.
Couple that with the very real issue of specific things not being demonstrable because of their infrequency.
BB and Fumbbl especially really do reward those who are willing to give in fully to it. But making the convincing case that you couldn't live without BB is tricky. |
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Igvy
Joined: Apr 29, 2007
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| Posted:
Dec 28, 2017 - 23:48 |
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To all that say this game is too compex for the masses.
i say it is much eaiser than dota or hearthstone. ..
Why is it so hard then? |
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Arktoris
Joined: Feb 16, 2004
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| Posted:
Dec 28, 2017 - 23:51 |
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[quote="koadah"]| Arktoris wrote: | | koadah wrote: |
| Arktoris wrote: | | sweep away the unnecessary rules. We old folks know the rules well because we were here when the new rules were invented and thus got to learn them in steps. But new folks are hit with pages and pages of rules and are expected to know them all before their first game. |
Get rid of the rules and you get a horrible mess like Cyanide. |
| Arktoris wrote: |
read what I said again.
yes, when I meet someone who clearly is new and doesn't have a grasp of the fundamental rules. I tell them about the 145 club. Provide link etc. |
So which rules are the "unnecessary" ones? |
ok, as you've mentioned, without the 15 minute disconnection rule or all games are expected to play through...fumbbl would collapse.
But how about say, "no team names in all caps" rule?
Would fumbbl fall apart if a team were named, "NASA"? |
_________________
Hail to Manowar! The latest charioteer to DIE for bloodbowl! - Slain, by Ghor Oggaz |
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Burnalot
Joined: Aug 02, 2003
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| Posted:
Dec 29, 2017 - 00:03 |
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I think the main problem is that new coaches can't really connect to the community right away. I think guiding them to the chat should be the first step in integrating them into the community.
This way people can help right away and the newcomer sees that there are actually people around here.
Everything else should come after this in my opinion. |
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If Jah is by my side, how can I be afraid? |
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