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Grod



Joined: Sep 30, 2003

Post   Posted: Jan 11, 2018 - 08:59 Reply with quote Back to top

Frankly, this is a light merge of the Ranked and Box divisions. It perpetuates an unnecessary complication in the division structure while removing any genuine argument to keep the divisions separated. Just merge already.

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bram



Joined: Jan 04, 2008

Post   Posted: Jan 11, 2018 - 09:00 Reply with quote Back to top

BattleLore wrote:
Starting with the new WO Ranked and Black Box teams are accepted in all Majors.

Still only one team per coach is allowed.

The WO will be followed by the Ulthuan Invitational, Crown of Sands, Grotty Little Tournament and Fumbbl Cup.

These Majors are open for all.

There will be the XFL Masters as a special Major only for the winners of the XFL Tournaments.

There still will be Royal Rookie Rumbles and Brawls as Minor Tournaments which will start on demand.


Does this mean that the Majors not mentioned in this post remain as they were before?
Grod



Joined: Sep 30, 2003

Post   Posted: Jan 11, 2018 - 09:02 Reply with quote Back to top

Why not merge brawls and rookie rumbles as well? Open up the playing pool?

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Grod



Joined: Sep 30, 2003

Post   Posted: Jan 11, 2018 - 09:08 Reply with quote Back to top

Ok I sought of get it. If the plan is to merge the divisions, this is a first, gentler step before taking the great plunge. Change isn't always bad peoples.

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Mateuszzzzzz



Joined: Feb 26, 2006

Post   Posted: Jan 11, 2018 - 09:23 Reply with quote Back to top

I would like ability to switch my teams from 1 division to another. One time. I only have teams in ranked for tourneys and i would much more like to play them in ranked. And i like them too much just to retire.
BattleLore



Joined: Oct 11, 2007

Post   Posted: Jan 11, 2018 - 09:53 Reply with quote Back to top

bram wrote:
BattleLore wrote:
Starting with the new WO Ranked and Black Box teams are accepted in all Majors.

Still only one team per coach is allowed.

The WO will be followed by the Ulthuan Invitational, Crown of Sands, Grotty Little Tournament and Fumbbl Cup.

These Majors are open for all.

There will be the XFL Masters as a special Major only for the winners of the XFL Tournaments.

There still will be Royal Rookie Rumbles and Brawls as Minor Tournaments which will start on demand.


Does this mean that the Majors not mentioned in this post remain as they were before?


No, there will be only these 5 this year
Verminardo



Joined: Sep 27, 2006

Post   Posted: Jan 11, 2018 - 10:16 Reply with quote Back to top

I kind of have to agree that this is not good for Box. My Box Darkies were looking like a reasonably good entry for CoS, not so much now that you have to expect the 2500+ TV Ranked Darkies to come flooding in.
Sp00keh



Joined: Dec 06, 2011

Post   Posted: Jan 11, 2018 - 10:18 Reply with quote Back to top

Hmmm. Less majors is probably good, for admin workload reduction, and makes them more special
There's only a few hardcore who enter them all anyways

As a compromise, would it be possible to have 1x for ranked only (UI?), 1x for box only (CoS?), and 3x combined ones (FC, WO, GLT)?
Just to retain a little of the old style, and avoid some of the downsides mentioned above
Verminardo



Joined: Sep 27, 2006

Post   Posted: Jan 11, 2018 - 10:24 Reply with quote Back to top

Oh the consolidation makes absolute sense, last year there was not enough interest to warrant all the Majors there were. But I did particularly enjoy being the "Box Elf" and that will no longer be viable for tourneys. Sad
mister__joshua



Joined: Jun 20, 2007

Post   Posted: Jan 11, 2018 - 10:32
FUMBBL Staff
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Verminardo wrote:
Oh the consolidation makes absolute sense, last year there was not enough interest to warrant all the Majors there were. But I did particularly enjoy being the "Box Elf" and that will no longer be viable for tourneys. Sad


When all the preened R elves get bashed to death at the Majors, you'll be the grizzled elves who know what to expect Wink

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Christer



Joined: Aug 02, 2003

Post   Posted: Jan 11, 2018 - 11:10
FUMBBL Staff
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To clarify a couple of points that have been mentioned here in the thread:

1. We have 5 major tournaments this year, and no more. They are all cross-division.

2. This is not a step towards merging B and R.
Currently, both divisions are performing roughly equally in terms of games played. Joining the divisions would, in my opinion, be equivalent of killing off the division entirely, potentially creating something new in the process. While this isn't inherently a bad thing, there's no compelling reason to destroy an environment people actually enjoy.

3. This has been in the works for quite a while (since before the FC), and has been delayed due to some unfortunate real-life events (easilyamused breaking his leg and being away for a while).
Some details are still not 100% set (minors and their structure), but with the major tournaments for this year starting up we wanted to let you know about this shift.

So why are we doing this shift?

There are a couple of reasons, and I'll go through some of them in no particular order. And yes, I realize some of these aren't huge but they're still factors.

- The Blackbox tournaments felt like watered down versions of the Ranked ones. Simply not unique enough formats, and the fluff felt a bit bland. Reducing the number of majors allows us to have better diversity and separation between the tournaments.

- North American and Australian coaches have (rightly so) for a long time complained how hard it is to get Blackbox matches played. This more or less made the Box-only tournaments Euro-centric which is a bit unfortunate. And yes, I know there are NA and Australian coaches who have well-established teams.

- Too many major tournaments. There are two primary reasons this is bad. The first problem is that it devalues the major tournaments and makes them less exciting. The other problem is the amount of time and effort it takes to administrate and deal with the tournaments from a staff perspective.

- Overlapping. Having 9 major tournaments, some people had to make choices of which major tournaments to join due to time constraints. A shift to 5 majors reduces the risk of this.

- Reducing the number of tournaments gives us the freedom to review the prizes for the tournaments and potentially make them a bit more powerful without changing the overall power added to teams over a given year. Mind you, this is not a promise that we'll change all prizes for majors. That being said, I will be sending out a set of Green block dice to the winner of the Warpstone Open this year (yay you for having read through this far; call it early access into something that will be posted a bit more prominently later). I am hoping to be able to persist with these RL prizes going forward, but again no promises. Perhaps we could introduce prizes for the best performing non-winner B and R teams to give an extra dimension of choice.

I hope this gives a bit of understanding into the background of this tournament shift, and I'm sure you'll continue posting your thoughts Smile
morehouse



Joined: Sep 29, 2005

Post   Posted: Jan 11, 2018 - 11:26 Reply with quote Back to top

^^^ I was just thinking the WO prize really needs a boost. A lot of mutations are just worthless on the wrong players so the odds of it doing that much to help a team are fairly low right now. I would like to see one that the coach chooses the player AND the mutation, one coach chooses player random mutation, one random player random mutation.

*In game prize I mean only, Christer sending the coach dice is awesome and well worth playing for.


Last edited by morehouse on Jan 11, 2018 - 11:29; edited 1 time in total
Purplegoo



Joined: Mar 23, 2006

Post   Posted: Jan 11, 2018 - 11:28 Reply with quote Back to top

I have no horse in this race, so please forgive a relatively uneducated opinion.

When I first fell in love with FUMBBL, Majors felt like big deals. I never personally liked or got on with them, but you couldn’t move for Major conversation, hype or general chat. I’ve never personally changed my opinion of the tournaments, but I can’t remember the last time one happened and I knew what was going on. I knew there was always one happening, but they all seemed the same and there were so many of them; chat and importance was diluted. So I think the consolidation is a really good idea.

I don’t think bringing R and B together at a massive, uncapped TV level is an issue, it’s all luck as to whether you roll a ridiculous mega-team anyway. I had a silly Wardancer in B that almost single handedly won me the first B Major (I think the first one?) in a time before Wizards. That wasn’t divisional, it was just jam. If the tournaments were held at a TV where you can make truly obnoxious teams in B, I’d have more of a worry, but they aren’t. That’s not an attempted argument starter or a dig at anyone, by the way, I just prefer my BB to be organic and natural.

All in all, looks good to me.

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Rawlf



Joined: Jul 15, 2007

Post   Posted: Jan 11, 2018 - 11:35 Reply with quote Back to top

For me, tournaments always felt alien to the blackbox division to begin with. Playing with teambuilding in mind is the about the opposite of my idea of the blackbox spirit. Protecting your key players and drawing instead of risking them for the win - that should be for ranked (and even questionable there).

Also, despite PurpleChests fine efforts to make the box majors unique, they never reached the status of their ranked equivalents when it comes to tradition and prestige; again, just IMO.

So I am very happy with the change.
And I will always be happy however it is done. FUMBBL offers more options to play and have fun than I have time to take part in.
huff



Joined: Dec 19, 2009

Post   Posted: Jan 11, 2018 - 11:56 Reply with quote Back to top

Rawlf wrote:
And I will always be happy however [FUMBBL] is done. FUMBBL offers more options to play and have fun than I have time to take part in.


Nice to read so much truth in one thread.

Quote above especially resonates.
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