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Poll
Which?
Elf Union
6%
 6%  [ 3 ]
High Elf
13%
 13%  [ 6 ]
Dark Elf
60%
 60%  [ 27 ]
Wood Elf
20%
 20%  [ 9 ]
Total Votes : 45


noobie2k7



Joined: Sep 28, 2012

Post   Posted: Mar 10, 2018 - 11:23 Reply with quote Back to top

I'm someone who's played pretty much only bash teams and i want to try out and learn to play Elfbowl. Which is the best team to start out with?

Also what are some good beginner tips for Elfbowl and things i should definitely forget compared to playing bash.

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ClawPOMB don't kill players, Coaches do!
Cloggy



Joined: Sep 23, 2004

Post   Posted: Mar 10, 2018 - 11:30 Reply with quote Back to top

I voted for dark elves. My reasons:

1. Darkies have Av8. Inexperienced elf coaches often struggle to limit the amount of blocks they give to the opposition, which is usually quite disastrous when playing with Av7.

2. Darkies have 6 positionals who are only skill away from having blodge. Learning to make use of the advantages of blodge players is another very important thing for people learning the elf game.

Once you get more comfortable with elves you will find that although they seem quite similar at first glance they offer a decent variety in styles of play and you will develop a favorite. Somehow I always end up with Elven Union while other gravitate toward TV300 teams from the Av8 races.

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Proud owner of three completed Ranked grids, sadly lacking in having a life.
Bram



Joined: Jan 04, 2008

Post   Posted: Mar 10, 2018 - 12:23 Reply with quote Back to top

Dark elves usually play a running game (although blanket AG4 allows for passes in emergencies) and therefore are the elf race whose style comes the closest to how bash races play (AV8 helps too). Playing dark elves will be a less radical change in play style coming from playing bash races compared to the other elves.

However, if you want to learn the finesse of elven play, high elves should be considered too. They still have mostly AV8, which should increase the longevity of your players somewhat. But they also have access to 4 MA8 ST3 AG4 catchers. These guys will become the core of your team once they get a skill or three (the more, the merrier). They only have AV7 though, so you need to learn how to protect them. You also need to learn when to play conservatively and when to go "all in" on defense (= when you get a decent shot at the ball).

So if you are interested in a more radical change in play style, go for high elves.

Elven Union and wood elves are very interesting too, but you'll suffer more from attrition due to blanket AV7 (except for the tree), which can be discouraging if you don't know how to minimize it.
Gartch



Joined: Sep 07, 2012

Post   Posted: Mar 10, 2018 - 12:28 Reply with quote Back to top

Wood Elves and Dark Elves are better than the 2 other elf teams.

And among them I think it's easier to play WE for a beginner because of Jump which allow Wardancer to jump into the opposing cage.

Moreover there is a very good guide for beginners for Wood Elves by Garion:
http://www.plasmoids.dk/bbowl/playbooks/Woodelf2.pdf
PurpleChest



Joined: Oct 25, 2003

Post   Posted: Mar 10, 2018 - 12:36
FUMBBL Staff
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Dark Elf for transitioning from str heavy rosters. they usually play a running/brawling style.

Leave the av7 elves for when you have a better idea of when not to be there getting hit.

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Barbarus hic ego sum, quia non intelligor illis -Ovid
I am a barbarian here because i am not understood by anyone
noobie2k7



Joined: Sep 28, 2012

Post   Posted: Mar 10, 2018 - 12:54 Reply with quote Back to top

Yeah, the thing i seem to struggle most with is playing of defense with elves, since you obviously set up a lot differently than with a bash team. Same with how you attack cages or the ball.

Like it seems with Elf teams it's less about getting tackle zones on the BC and more about positioning to correctly to limit the opponents movement options. That's what i struggle most with as when i'm in a pinch or being pushed i tend to revert to that very direct mindset.

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ClawPOMB don't kill players, Coaches do!
Bram



Joined: Jan 04, 2008

Post   Posted: Mar 10, 2018 - 14:30 Reply with quote Back to top

If you struggle with defense, I suggest spectating some good elf coaches. Pay special attention to their timing; when are they keeping their distance and when do they decide to make a shot? Sometimes they will go all in right from the start, sometimes they will never do it and limit themselves to restricting movement of the opposition, simply trying to prevent a touchdown rather than stealing the ball.
noobie2k7



Joined: Sep 28, 2012

Post   Posted: Mar 10, 2018 - 15:28 Reply with quote Back to top

bram wrote:
If you struggle with defense, I suggest spectating some good elf coaches. Pay special attention to their timing; when are they keeping their distance and when do they decide to make a shot? Sometimes they will go all in right from the start, sometimes they will never do it and limit themselves to restricting movement of the opposition, simply trying to prevent a touchdown rather than stealing the ball.
So who might these mysterious great Elf coaches be?

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ClawPOMB don't kill players, Coaches do!
Antithesisoftime



Joined: Aug 20, 2014

Post   Posted: Mar 10, 2018 - 17:51 Reply with quote Back to top

noobie2k7 wrote:
bram wrote:
If you struggle with defense, I suggest spectating some good elf coaches. Pay special attention to their timing; when are they keeping their distance and when do they decide to make a shot? Sometimes they will go all in right from the start, sometimes they will never do it and limit themselves to restricting movement of the opposition, simply trying to prevent a touchdown rather than stealing the ball.
So who might these mysterious great Elf coaches be?
Relezite, MikiRuni, and The_Demon would be 3 examples of elf coaches I'd keep an eye on.

High or Dark are probably the most elf newbie friendly, as the AV8 can be unforgiving. High Elves can play a run or pass game, while Dark Elves tend to be more run oriented, with the occasional passing option (which improves slightly if you use a Dark Elf Runner, and take him down the thrower route)

Pro Elves, once they get some skills on a thrower and the catchers become a team with a difficult to stop aerial assault, but you'll have to suffer through a lot of frustration in early games due to lack of core skills for anything else.

Wood Elves are the easiest of the elf teams to one turn with out of the box, if you use catchers. That said, the team revolves around it's wardancers, especially early on. The tree is a hit or miss option, that tends to be a better player against bash rosters.
noobie2k7



Joined: Sep 28, 2012

Post   Posted: Mar 10, 2018 - 18:02 Reply with quote Back to top

From what i have seen though over time playing is that Wood Elves seem like the strongest Elf team,Perhaps even one of the best teams overall. Though they have a very high skill ceiling and entry point. While Dark Elves seem sort of in the middle, i have tried Elf Union before in like a couple games. One for for a knock out tourney i lost in the first round haha.

What would be a good TV 1000 DElf side? Like what positionals do i skip? Do i take any Witches or Assassins? Do i just take the blitzers and runners?

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ClawPOMB don't kill players, Coaches do!
Bram



Joined: Jan 04, 2008

Post   Posted: Mar 10, 2018 - 18:46 Reply with quote Back to top

All elf teams are strong. Especially at mid and high TV. Wood elves are strong at 1000 TV too because the wardancer is simply the best player in the game.

Other good elf coaches: Pirigin and PeteW (dark elf) and Manp (Elven Union).

Good dark elf TV 1000 roster? 4 blitzers, fill up with linemen and 2 rerolls. Alternatively 3 blitzers and a witch elf. A runner can work too, especially if you turn him into into a leader caddy once he skills up (in my experience all elves need at least 3 rerolls; 4 at high TV where tackle is everywhere).
noobie2k7



Joined: Sep 28, 2012

Post   Posted: Mar 10, 2018 - 18:50 Reply with quote Back to top

I'll just do the 4 Blitzer thing as it seems the most simple and also most forgiving. Then pick up other positionals and things later. After the 3rd reroll and maybe an Apo. It does seem a bit boring though ignoring all the interesting positionals but sometimes you have too for an actually decent team.

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ClawPOMB don't kill players, Coaches do!
Antithesisoftime



Joined: Aug 20, 2014

Post   Posted: Mar 10, 2018 - 18:56 Reply with quote Back to top

noobie2k7 wrote:
I'll just do the 4 Blitzer thing as it seems the most simple and also most forgiving. Then pick up other positionals and things later. After the 3rd reroll and maybe an Apo. It does seem a bit boring though ignoring all the interesting positionals but sometimes you have too for an actually decent team.
4 Blitzers, 7 Linemen or 3 Blitzers, a Witch, and 7 Linemen is probably your best bet with Dark Elves
noobie2k7



Joined: Sep 28, 2012

Post   Posted: Mar 10, 2018 - 19:03 Reply with quote Back to top

So are Assassins kind of rubbish then? Or just not very beginner friendly? The stab seems very useful on offense and same with Shadowing on defense.

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ClawPOMB don't kill players, Coaches do!
mrt1212



Joined: Feb 26, 2013

Post   Posted: Mar 10, 2018 - 19:25 Reply with quote Back to top

noobie2k7 wrote:
So are Assassins kind of rubbish then? Or just not very beginner friendly? The stab seems very useful on offense and same with Shadowing on defense.


They are rubbish for 4 reasons

1. AV7 - it's the weak link on the team and woe unto thee who allows them to be exposed.

2. MA6 Shadowing isn't that great for when you need it. If you're using it in a scrum and processing Shadowing off of block follow ups from your opponents, it's highly likely they would be a viable block target in themselves. For one on one marking, MA6 simply won't stand up to MA7+

3. Stab is interesting but not better than a traditional block. Being able to get an opposing player out of contact on a block that doesn't yield a knockdown is vitally important for a skilless AV7 player. Against entire teams their stab ability becomes a liability like against Orcs and Dwarves rather than a potential boon. AV9 is hard to crack and if you miss and that player has Mighty Blow, look out.

4. Hard to consistently skill up and keep alive.
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