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Irgy



Joined: Feb 21, 2007

Post   Posted: Apr 17, 2018 - 06:26 Reply with quote Back to top

Can someone please explain in full what's actually going on at the moment in bloodbowl? I can see that stuff is happening but I can't get a proper picture of it.

Things I've worked out (so you know what sorts of things I'm asking about) include:
* GW are doing things, and this seems to be the root cause of the general upheaval. What I can't work out is exactly what they're doing, nor when they're doing it, nor even indeed whether it's happened already or just going to happen or both.
* There's a new version of the rules. As part of this change, the current rules are no longer publicly accessible. The "in-game" rules haven't changed much, but the "meta-game" aspects have changed a whole bunch, and I've seen those changes in the league I'm in.
* I can see a thread asking about BB2 and I assume it's the computer version of the game but I don't know what's going on with it nor how it relates (if at all) to anything else
* I can see a Rosters and Rulesets topic and it looks very much like someone has made order out of chaos but I don't understand the chaos.
* I tried to work out what the NAF are doing but was not enlightened. Things seem to be in some kind of stasis or bridging mode but to and from what I can't work out.
* There's now secret league which afaict has somewhat replaced stunty insofar as being the place to play around with more experimental rosters. I assume that whole business is a separate fumbbl-only issue.

I think the main thing missing is the what and the why of it all.
koadah



Joined: Mar 30, 2005

Post   Posted: Apr 17, 2018 - 08:02 Reply with quote Back to top

Secret League is a set of unofficial rosters. Garion led the project. They can be used anywhere. Though I don't know if anyone uses them outside of Fumbbl.

There is a new boxed set. It has new rules. The rules have not all been released at once. It is a kind of drip feed. I don't know if there is a way to get them without buying them. Wink

Fumbbl has implemented some of the new rules but not all.

BB2 is the Cyanide computer game. It is still CRP with a few tweaks.

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Wozzaa



Joined: Apr 23, 2016

Post   Posted: Apr 17, 2018 - 09:08 Reply with quote Back to top

Games workshop have got involved again by rereleasing blood bowl (they have also rereleased other games that have disappeared). The reading of the rule book sounds like they are ignoring the 'living rule book's as that was not made by games workshop. The new rules seem to be designed for table top, but are obviously influenced by online blood bowl. Some rules like piling on have been deemed unfair, so removed. The seasons rules seem to be 'fluffy' but also GW seem to be suggesting that this game is meant to be played with team values between 1000 and 1500. Hense, expensive mistake/seasons.
Sp00keh



Joined: Dec 06, 2011

Post   Posted: Apr 17, 2018 - 09:22 Reply with quote Back to top

The NAF or LRB unofficial BB council doesn't have any rules input now, they just do table top tournaments (?)

GW released BB2016 with new rules, and then a weird drip of facebook posts and app content with some additional stuff. Seems a bit of a messy way to do it, but these are the most official rules now

Cyanide's BB2 game has its own ruleset based mostly on CRP. Includes Brets and Khorne teams

Fumbbl has its own ruleset based mostly on BB2016, notably without seasons, so far. includes slann team

Secret League and Stunty League are both fumbbl creations
Irgy



Joined: Feb 21, 2007

Post   Posted: Apr 17, 2018 - 09:46 Reply with quote Back to top

Ok, so I'm being told GW have released new rules, and that they are drip feeding new rules. Have they:
A) Not released any new rules yet but are drip-feeding some hints as to what they will be like when they do?
B) Released new rules already, that one could actually go and buy, and are also drip-feeding information about the next version of those rules?
C) Released new rules, and also drip-fed those same rules, so most people only know some of the new rules but anyone who bought the book would know all of them?

Sorry but I can't tell from what's been said so far...
Sp00keh



Joined: Dec 06, 2011

Post   Posted: Apr 17, 2018 - 10:18 Reply with quote Back to top

B) I think
The main thing was the new rulebook in the recent boxed game re release. This is BB2016

They also recently posted about teams of legend which included rules for chaos renegades and underworld denizens for example, as they weren't included previously
They haven't given any real clues as to their overall plan afaik
Sp00keh



Joined: Dec 06, 2011

Post   Posted: Apr 17, 2018 - 10:46 Reply with quote Back to top

If you're playing on fumbbl then I wouldn't worry much about changes

Expensive Mistakes replaced Spiralling Expenses. Piling On and the Wizard are gone. There some other small things like inducments work a bit different, human catchers got 10k cheaper or something. Chaos renegades got a orc renegade but not yet implemented here

Otherwise it's just the same as previously, and also just the same as BB2016, and the ingame experience hasn't changed much
Irgy



Joined: Feb 21, 2007

Post   Posted: Apr 17, 2018 - 10:58 Reply with quote Back to top

It's not the same in SWL, we've completely redrafted the teams and are following the "seasons" process based on the new rules. But I'm not worried about changes so much as just trying to get on top of what's actually going on in the first place.

I can at least understand why there's some degree of chaos if there's now three sets of rules - one publicly available but "out of date", one only available for purchase and official, and one not fully available and in the future.

So are these new rules and future newer rules called "Death Zone 1" and "Death Zone 2" or is that something else?
Sp00keh



Joined: Dec 06, 2011

Post   Posted: Apr 17, 2018 - 11:06 Reply with quote Back to top

Uhh I'd not say there's 3 sets

There's old rules, including LRB versions then CRP
Then there's new rules which are current. Starting with the BB2016 box set rulebook, and yea you have to buy this
The Death Zone stuff is expansion packs? expected to include Wizard for example. I don't know much about these

Fumbbl and Cyanide both have attempted to interpret some of the above rules in their own ways...
kummo



Joined: Mar 29, 2016

Post   Posted: Apr 17, 2018 - 11:12 Reply with quote Back to top

koadah wrote:
Secret League is a set of unofficial rosters. Garion led the project. They can be used anywhere. Though I don't know if anyone uses them outside of Fumbbl.


I have heard of one small tabletop league that took some of the rosters from SL and iirc they are using some or full bb2016 ruleset otherwise.

I wish i remembered who the guy was who mentioned about it.
Fabrizio



Joined: May 28, 2004

Post   Posted: Apr 17, 2018 - 11:29 Reply with quote Back to top

The rulebook included in the new boxed set only contains the basic rules of the game, which have remained the same (blocking, passing, etc), although maybe some minor changes to skills were also introduced in this book. At least the cheaper human catcher was probably here. The Death Zones are "expansion packs", but at least Death Zone 1 is absolutely necessary to play the actual game, as it includes the rules for league play and lots of other essential stuff. Death Zone 2 had all kinds of optional rules like stadiums, famous refs, and in general I think it tries to add to the role-playing aspect of BB for those who are interested.

Basically, if one is familiar with previous rulesets, I think Death Zone 1 is the book to get if one wants to get the bare minimum. There is now also something called the Almanac, which is a compilation of the rules so far (although even that does not contain everything if I recall correctly).
Purplegoo



Joined: Mar 23, 2006

Post   Posted: Apr 17, 2018 - 17:20 Reply with quote Back to top

I think the above is mainly correct, but I thought I'd try an explanation as well to see if I can paint a holistic, clear picture. I agree it's not super easy to follow sometimes.

GW have re-released Blood Bowl. It's not alone, Necromunda followed. The new BB edition is known as BB2016.

There is a base BB2016 boxed set with Orcs, Humans, redesigned dice and templates, a bigger pitch (new minis are bigger) and a basic rulebook. A 'Teams of Legend' document and the 'Deathzone' supplement (Season 1) completed the initial ruleset and rounded off the 23 rosters (no Slann). There were some minor changes, e.g. Gutter Runners got a Weeping Dagger (huge nerd rage, but a minor thing) and Piling On became 'optional'. There was a new Halfling Tree skill and a few changes like D3 MVPs, Seasons and the like. Most of it was pretty cosmetic. There were a bunch of typos in the box set rules and DZ1, fixed by an errata found on bloodbowl.com.

Deathzone Season 2 was next, and this introduced new Goblin positionals, a new Pact (er.. Renegades, there are some new names for old races / positionals) Orc Lineman and some new Star Players. There was also a raft of optional league stuff in there, like stadium rules.

White Dwarf articles have contained some fun optional stuff (e.g. ball rules), and there have been a couple of limited edition star players (Grak and Crumbleberry) that you can only buy from Warhammer World. Wholly optional. An 'Almanac' collated everything from DZ1 to the White Dwarf stuff in one book, and corrected the typos.

There is other stuff too. An app (My Dugout) contains some new, optional races that you can use your already bought minis to represent in your local league. Such as Savage Orcs (see those minis in the boxed set? You can use them for something else too!). You can buy the rules via the app as well, making it quite useful. There have been some interventions by GW online. For instance, we know there is an FAQ item coming soon that clarifies the new inducement sequence; FUMBBL was not alone in misinterpreting the rules as written, effectively it's per CRP. The new Special Play Cards are optional, although they don't appear that way in the rules as written. There are other ways of using the cards on the website. As ever, the onus is on the commissioner to make the decision as to what is fun and set the rules for his league from what is out there.

There have been a whole bunch of minis (Orcs, Humans, Skaven, Dwarfs, Goblins, Elven Union, Stars) and dice released, as well as loads of pitches. Some of them ship with fluffy optional rules.

What's next? Well - Chaos, it seems. A Spike! Magazine has been trailed, and we've seen the minis. So I guess we'll see more and more as the game release continues. In general - these rules are not free. You have to buy them to stay current.

BB2 - The Cyanide game is still using the CRP rules, from what I can gather. With a new race called Bretonnians, without Khorne (this was BB1) and without Pact. They are as you left them, love them or hate them.

FUMBBL - It seems FUMBBL has adopted as many of the new rules as Kalimar / Christer have had time to code. We're behind, but we're always going to be when GW go in this direction. I wouldn't panic too much; not enough has changed since CRP to confuse you too much. Important FUMBBL changes: Wizard removal (not in BB2016 yet, but it's been said it'll be back in some form or other), PO removal, D3 MVP, the incorrect inducement sequence. Secret League is a fun FUMBBL only house rule thing, think Stunty Leeg x 100.

NAF - The NAF is far from in stasis! There was a recent referendum that means Khorne and Brets are now welcome at TT events. We have 26 teams to choose from. The NAF are taking a reactive approach to the new rules. Every year from here on out, we will debate internally the rules that have been released, and then release a document so everyone knows on Jan. 1 what rules they'll be playing with at NAF tournaments for the next 12 months. We have retained CRP PO (at a TT tournament, this is seen as not as impactful as it was online), but other than that, we've pretty much gone with BB2016 for now.

The game has rarely been in ruder health. I'm sure I've forgotten something, but there's (happily) a lot going on! Enjoy. Smile

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lawofthewest



Joined: Nov 09, 2017

Post   Posted: Apr 17, 2018 - 19:18 Reply with quote Back to top

Sp00keh wrote:
If you're playing on fumbbl then I wouldn't worry much about changes

Expensive Mistakes replaced Spiralling Expenses. Piling On and the Wizard are gone. There some other small things like inducments work a bit different, human catchers got 10k cheaper or something. Chaos renegades got a orc renegade but not yet implemented here



1) I would like to know what Spiralling Expenses were.

2) Piling on is not quite gone - you can hire a Merc with the piling on skill

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ArrestedDevelopment



Joined: Sep 14, 2015

Post   Posted: Apr 17, 2018 - 19:19 Reply with quote Back to top

lawofthewest wrote:


2) Piling on is not quite gone - you can hire a Merc with the piling on skill


is bug, has been reported as a bug, if you do so you're exploiting a bug Smile

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MattDakka



Joined: Oct 09, 2007

Post   Posted: Apr 17, 2018 - 19:27 Reply with quote Back to top

lawofthewest wrote:

1) I would like to know what Spiralling Expenses were.

Once a team's value equals or exceeds 1750 it must deduct some gold from the Treasury (Treasury can never be reduced to less than 0.

TV 1750-1890: -10,000
TV 1900-2040: -20,000
TV 2050-2190: -30,000
TV 2200-2340: -40,000
TV 2350-2490: -50,000
TV 2500-2640: -60,000
continuing in steps of 150 TV (-10,000 each)

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