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ramchop



Joined: Oct 12, 2013

Post   Posted: Aug 04, 2018 - 23:12
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Box Sprint Data has been down for a few months now.

Groups like ARR relied on them for their bimonthly Loot! and RecARRds.

Can anyone please point me to an idiot's guide on how to collate this data automatically like koadah had set up before? It might be beyond me, but I'd like to at least give it a try.
koadah



Joined: Mar 30, 2005

Post   Posted: Aug 05, 2018 - 00:30 Reply with quote Back to top

Happygrue was looking into it.

Maybe he can let us know if he has got anywhere.

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O[L]C 2016 Swiss! - April ---- All Stars - Anniversary Bowl - Teams of Stars - 13th March
happygrue



Joined: Oct 15, 2010

Post   Posted: Aug 06, 2018 - 01:40 Reply with quote Back to top

I have not gotten anywhere with it, and it's unlikely that I will at any kind of a reasonable pace. I had some hopes I would get to it over the Summer, but it's not going to happen (and it surely won't happen this fall).

JellyBelly was kind enough to share some automagic files he cooked up for E.L.F. and their scoring, and I have passed those on to other interested parties. I have been meaning to write a longish post seeking help and asking about new interested leaders and possibly new waters for ARR to explore, but I have not gotten to that either.

With the first season of the Box Trophy winding down and another one on the horizon, I think there is a lot of merit to considering if/how that second and future seasons might be implemented and then considering how best ARR can supplement and encourage that effort, because there is a fair amount of overlap there. The possibly of changing the structure of ARR with the BT in mind seems timely, but I have also been waiting to see how that shakes out before gearing up for a big new push.

If there are folks out there who want to make automatic scoring for ARR and/or future metagroups (I HAZ IDEAS!!!1!), then please don't be strangers! I'm adding some to my workload this Fall and I might be able to help steer the ship but I won't have any time to monkey around in the engine room.

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garyt1



Joined: Mar 12, 2011

Post   Posted: Aug 06, 2018 - 04:48 Reply with quote Back to top

Can someone remind me what was the issue with the blackbox sprint on the old site? Koadah said about the personal data a while ago with new European rules, even though there isn't any personal data on it.?. Was there? Username is not surely as it doesnt say who the user really is. Or was it some issue with regularly updating it?
Still nice racial stats on there though.

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Verminardo



Joined: Sep 27, 2006

Post   Posted: Aug 06, 2018 - 12:32 Reply with quote Back to top

If I may be so bold as to egoistically inject that both the Sprint format and indeed the Black Box Trophy format have been assuming, shall we say, a certain level of activity, that some coaches (i.e. me) cannot sustain. So while doing this again from scratch (and I greatly commend anyone for doing it in the first place), might it be worthwhile to explore and investigate how other coaches stand on the issue, and what might be gained by making the format a little more, shall we say, inclusive?

Thanks for all you great efforts guys! Smile
happygrue



Joined: Oct 15, 2010

Post   Posted: Aug 06, 2018 - 12:52 Reply with quote Back to top

I don't know about the user data side of it, but to Verminardo's point - yeah, that's something I've long agonized over.

My original idea was a "reverse E.L.F.", where you could take exactly the same categories they use or change it up somehow, and then score points for any TWO teams you play in those 5 categories, for a run of ten games per season. So, for example, you'd get the best two games you played with two different bash teams, and the best two games you played with two different elf teams and so on. Bonus points for completing a cycle (play a game with all 24 races), and other such stuff. I had been hoping to launch something like that for the past several years, but automatic scoring is a must and I just haven't moved on it.

At this point, ARR has some fans that really really enjoy playing a lot of games with very specific teams (HLP is even more focused on one individual team), and people really love establishing long records with teams. It's hard to find something that allows people to play their "one real team" and also mix up the diversity (which makes for better box draws - lots of teams being thrown in), but the aim would be to have 1 or maybe 2 metagroups that are encouraging both aspects of this.

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koadah



Joined: Mar 30, 2005

Post   Posted: Aug 06, 2018 - 12:55 Reply with quote Back to top

garyt1 wrote:
Can someone remind me what was the issue with the blackbox sprint on the old site? Koadah said about the personal data a while ago with new European rules, even though there isn't any personal data on it.?. Was there? Username is not surely as it doesnt say who the user really is. Or was it some issue with regularly updating it?
Still nice racial stats on there though.


I took it down because I didn't have time to look into the GDPR stuff. I still haven't. Happygrue was going to look into taking over ARR so I haven't looked any further.

With Box Trophy taking off there doesn't seem to be as much need for the old Sprints. HPL appears to have pretty much died long ago.

If anyone can tell me what if anything must be done for GPDR the ARR page can return.

Though it probably needs re-doing anyway.

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koadah



Joined: Mar 30, 2005

Post   Posted: Aug 06, 2018 - 13:09 Reply with quote Back to top

Verminardo wrote:
If I may be so bold as to egoistically inject that both the Sprint format and indeed the Black Box Trophy format have been assuming, shall we say, a certain level of activity, that some coaches (i.e. me) cannot sustain. So while doing this again from scratch (and I greatly commend anyone for doing it in the first place), might it be worthwhile to explore and investigate how other coaches stand on the issue, and what might be gained by making the format a little more, shall we say, inclusive?

Thanks for all you great efforts guys! Smile


If you have ideas let's have them.

If your season is only 10 games in the box you could have a lot of people going 10-0-0. Some mainly by luck or weak schedule.

E.L.F. in the Box looks frustrating to me if you don't play many games. How do you fill your grid?

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happygrue



Joined: Oct 15, 2010

Post   Posted: Aug 06, 2018 - 13:41 Reply with quote Back to top

koadah wrote:


E.L.F. in the Box looks frustrating to me if you don't play many games. How do you fill your grid?


It's actually exactly opposite to E.L.F. - you choose which teams you play, and but you only get points for playing a wide range of teams. In other words, you can pick ten teams you like (2 from each category) and throw them in, removing one each team it's drawn. Then playing only 10 games you get a "season", so it's appealing to people who don't play as much. If you wanted to maximize your score, you probably need to play a lot with the crap races, because odds are you aren't going to get great scores from them with one game.

I think it would be ideal for encouraging diversity and also for those who only play a few games. Then rather than monoactivating one team and then dropping out if they fail to make a sprint, they are much more likely to get draws (and the draws will be better) if they throw 10 teams in, and they will still get a pretty good score even if they get only 7-8 games in but fall a bit short of completing the cycle.

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Christer



Joined: Aug 02, 2003

Post   Posted: Aug 06, 2018 - 14:46
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I might be interested in implementing sprints natively on the site.
happygrue



Joined: Oct 15, 2010

Post   Posted: Aug 06, 2018 - 15:19 Reply with quote Back to top

That would certainly be one way to breath new life into metagroups!

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garyt1



Joined: Mar 12, 2011

Post   Posted: Aug 06, 2018 - 18:02 Reply with quote Back to top

[quote="koadah"]
garyt1 wrote:

With Box Trophy taking off there doesn't seem to be as much need for the old Sprints. HPL appears to have pretty much died long ago.

Sprints cover all races so absolutely should remain if possible. I would love to see them back. The Trophy is great but most players in the Box wont get far with it, or at least it is long term. Any time you have a couple of months where you pay a good haul of games it is fun to see the sprints. Or even just for reference on other teams doing well.

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mrt1212



Joined: Feb 26, 2013

Post   Posted: Aug 06, 2018 - 18:09 Reply with quote Back to top

Christer wrote:
I might be interested in implementing sprints natively on the site.


Ummmmmm, how do we grease this wheel?
garyt1



Joined: Mar 12, 2011

Post   Posted: Aug 06, 2018 - 18:44 Reply with quote Back to top

Christer wrote:
I might be interested in implementing sprints natively on the site.

A joyous day.

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Christer



Joined: Aug 02, 2003

Post   Posted: Aug 06, 2018 - 18:48
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To implement sprints, I'd need a detailed specification of what they showed. I don't know the details (or much at all honestly) about how they worked.
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