mstrchef13
Joined: Dec 11, 2004
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 Posted:
Jan 20, 2005 - 20:35 |
 
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| uber wrote: | | I just hope the BBRC would wake up and nerf those annoying dwarves. I think the most reasonable solution would be to limit them to 4-6 longbeards and introduce a weaker form of dwarf as lineman. The longbeards are just too strong as standard linemen, it's as simple as that. They also need to pay more for their re-rolls. |
We all know the BBRC isn't going to do anything to the dwarfs themselves, because they are a core WH race and as such are not to be trifled with. However, as I said earlier and was re-stated above, their re-rolls are too cheap. If the BBRC "balanced" the big hats by making their rerolls 70k, why shouldn't the same apply to the dwarfs, by making their rerolls 60k or 70k?
And not to start another thread inside this one, but the deathroller should be available to CDs as well as regular dwarfs. It's much more of a chaotic piece of equipment anyway. I'd give up mino access for deathroller access any day.
Da Chef |
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Glomp
Joined: Jan 04, 2004
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Jan 20, 2005 - 20:47 |
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The problem isn't that dwarfs are overpowered in general, rather they're overpowered against certain teams.
Dwarfs vs Zons/elven teams/stunty teams and norse (to a lesser extent), are all pretty bad matchups.
Dwarfs vs Orcs/high level Chaos/Khemri/Undead (possibly) and chaos dwarfs are pretty bad matchups for the shorties.
Sadly there isn't an obvious solution to the problem unless/untill the vault is implamented.
A reduced injury table and a few new skills to help the elves will hopefully redress the problems encountered by low AV players.
No on pitch apoth, deathroller on the roster and the removal or nerfing of nasty mutations and the fouling system will help tackle Dwarven bogey teams.
All you really have to do is wait 2 years sadly.
Oh and get the BBRC to drop that bloody chainsaw from the roster... |
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SixFootDwarf
Joined: Aug 02, 2003
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Jan 21, 2005 - 14:40 |
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IF the Vault should get implemented I'd seriously consider quitting the game. It's almost a totally different game under those rules.
And no, rerolls should NOT be made more expensive. I think CDs were made more because of the plentiful AG3 Hobgobs, 2 ST4 things that can move up to 9 squares easily, AND a Big Guy. All that and 80k rerolls was absurd. They are STILL absurd, but that's another subject entirely.
You guys are forgetting that even though they do what they do almost perfectly, the lack of speed, limited agility, and lack of strength make a little boost mandatory. Think about it: ALL the other bashers have at least 2 STR4 or more players (CDs, Orcs, Chaos, Undead, Khemri, Vampires)...not to mention Lizards and Ogres which are crazy with STR. All the other teams, except Elves/Amazons, get a Big Guy to go with fast players. Dwarves have 2 Slayers to deal with this. You take Longbeards away, or tinker with their skills and Dwarves will suck. As for the reroll cost....Dwarves are just BETTER. That's why we get cheap rerolls. Superiority.  |
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nazerdemus
Joined: Nov 02, 2004
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Jan 21, 2005 - 14:56 |
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Six foot dwarf is a case in point of why dwarfs find it hard to find games , check out how many dwarfs his none dwarf teams have played |
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AFK_Eagle
Joined: Mar 12, 2004
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Jan 21, 2005 - 18:10 |
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Raise the cost of rr's on a dwarf team, so what? It just means he'll be a few games slower to start off, lose a few more games early. But with av9/thickskull (to keep on pitch more to lend assists), it's not likely he'll suffer much in terms of player loss, so he can easily save up and purchase the rr's at whatever cost you make them. So a dwarf team will have to wait 5 or 6 games to get to 5 rr's, instead of starting with 4 or 5...so what? That does absolutely nothing to impact the team at higher tr's, which by then everybody has more rr's anyway. |
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Founder of the E.L.F.--These elves will play anybody! |
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SixFootDwarf
Joined: Aug 02, 2003
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Jan 21, 2005 - 21:20 |
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No kidding, Naz....I'm not stupid. LMAO My teams are high TR, and high TR Dwarves make high TR teams into LOW TR teams.
Then again, I've had Dwarf coaches turn down a game with my Darkies. But honestly, I can't remember the last time a Dwarf challenged me. Maybe people the rating and record and don't both. I dunno. I'd play vs. Dwarves with any of my teams but the Rats. BUt if it was loaded with Dirties and MB I'd turn 'em down just like I would any team.
It's true, though...I complain about not getting games with my Dwarves but I rarely play against them. Maybe it's my self-preservation instinct kicking in.... |
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Mezir
Joined: Aug 02, 2003
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Jan 21, 2005 - 21:20 |
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Dwarfs start with four or five rr? News to me. Not if you want any positionals. Or a decent Fan Factor.
Plus there's the fact that Dwarfs don't really need RR anyway. That's why they're so cheap. |
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Mezir
Joined: Aug 02, 2003
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Jan 21, 2005 - 21:24 |
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| SixFootDwarf wrote: | No kidding, Naz....I'm not stupid. LMAO My teams are high TR, and high TR Dwarves make high TR teams into LOW TR teams.
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Bollocks. Orcs and Chaos do that far more than Dwarfs. Not to mention Khemri. Or Necromantic, with those nasty Claws and sacrificial DP zombies everywhere. |
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Build a man a fire and he's warm for a day; set a man on fire and he's warm for the rest of his life. |
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Patonius2000
Joined: Jun 03, 2004
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Jan 21, 2005 - 21:38 |
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after playing 30 games with my dorfs i have no dp or mb on my roster yet i still find it harder to get games with them than my chaos, who imo have much more team wrecking potential. i always try to include the link when asking for a game with my dorfs cos most of the time coaches see "DWARVES" and think, no absolutely no way at all, does he think im an idiot, and reply with something like lol, haha or even better or even better ......., because they are so clever and "in the know". can be v. frustrating. |
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Darkwolf
Joined: Aug 02, 2003
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Jan 21, 2005 - 21:43 |
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After playing with 2 dwarf teams to about 20+ games, my cas ratio is poor compared to khermi, chaos, orc, cd's. I did notice that 1) troll slayers have a shirt life expectancy 2) runners get ko'd or hurt during the game.
Again, Im left with longbeards with some guard, sf and mb and a 1 dimensional strategy (ie block). The rerolls go pretty fast when 3ag and 2ag players are trying to pass, pick up ball and hand off.
They are tough to play when you want to score consistantly and avoid the cage,stall tactic. |
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screech
Joined: Mar 30, 2004
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Jan 21, 2005 - 21:43 |
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Regarding team rerolls for dwarves: I find that I hardly ever use rerolls and end up buying additional ones more for the lack of anything better to do with my winnings. It's a rare half when I use more than 2 or 3 rerolls with my dwaves, usually for the rare failed slayer dauntless roll. I guess I could purchase a runesmith (does anyone ever use one?) or a deathroller instead, but as is, it's already hard enough to get games with them.
Hmm a runesmith...I should try that out one game. |
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skull
Joined: Dec 07, 2004
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Jan 21, 2005 - 22:02 |
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I disagree, i like playing dwarves... and i like playing with dwarves. I've rarely seen dwarves cage... it seems to happen more often with orcs when they're scared of losing. What i like to do with dwarves is divide the opposing team into small groups and surround them with a bunch of guards... and just go for the win with my runners. Also, I don't find slow play bad at all... my dwarf games... or chaos, are way more exciting than elf ones... less chance to succeed, more planning, more intensity, more stress... thus a better game. |
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Chaos and Order are not enemies, only opposites. |
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SixFootDwarf
Joined: Aug 02, 2003
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Jan 21, 2005 - 22:40 |
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Runesmiths are good later on, Screech. Once you have what you need on your team it's a great way to kill off money and get something useful out of it. Normal wizards only work once...SF and a +AV, or Frenzy/Dauntless for the WHOLE GAME is better I think. It isn't a crucial timing thing like a fireball, it just helps you do what you normally do better. |
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Vero
Joined: Dec 30, 2003
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Jan 21, 2005 - 23:12 |
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uber, dwarves don't need more than six or seven Long Beards 
What's the talk about the highest armour? 4 guys with av8 which is crappy by all standards. Orcs got only the two throwers with av8 and the rest with av9. Don't know what maths give 2 > 4. Thick skull is joke too. Dwarves pay 10k per guy for that skill. That's 10-15 points of TR, which can only be used to keep a guy on pitch occasionally. I wouldn't call that a huge advantage.
They do got guard all around. How scary. Orcs do got guard on eight players (counting doubles even more) and str4 on four of them. Chaos got even more guard and the stronger players. They are more agile than Orcs or Chaos too: Total four guys with ag3 and mv more than four. That's going to get all those orcs even more green.
What's left: Early development which peaks by TR200, the best linos - which are truly blockers - in the game and the cheapest rerolls for those 4+ dodges. A great and overpowered team maybe on Earth, not on Old World at least. |
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Macavity
Joined: Nov 23, 2004
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Jan 21, 2005 - 23:23 |
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Well here is my whining. Bashy team and Cherrypicker are not the same thing. Meet one of my dwarf games.
Barak-Varr Brawlers
TR/Str 164/168 Dwarf vs
(Replay) Inkaprettatori
TR/Str 197/195 Chaos
Date: 2005-01-02 20:18:52
Gate: 150000
1 Score 1
Macavity Coach Buskopanz
70000 Winnings 60000
-1 Fanfactor -1
0/0/0 Casualties 2/0/0
I choose to play. I wanted to. Because most ninnyhammers won't play my poor dwarves at all. |
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When I became a man I put away childish things, including the fear of childishness and the desire to be very grown up. -C.S. Lewis |
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Gnomes are trash
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