| Poll |
| Is playing for a tie sissy? |
| Yes |
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26% |
[ 46 ] |
| No |
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73% |
[ 125 ] |
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| Total Votes : 171 |
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Nordmark
Joined: Sep 09, 2004
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 Posted:
Mar 17, 2005 - 15:37 |
 
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@CircularLogic
I recognise a tactical stall as well as anyone else. But had it been turn4 second half I probably would have scored. Then in the next drive tryiing to steal the ball and score the winning td. That situation however is tricky since dwarves are rather slow. I probably would settle for a tie in that case. All I´m saying is that I play to win. If that costs me the game then that´s to bad.
P.s. Couldn´t you find ANY more extreme situation than that one? |
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”The oldest and strongest emotion of mankind is fear, and the oldest and strongest kind of fear is the fear of the unknown.” - H.P. Lovecraft |
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Azurus
Joined: Aug 02, 2003
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| Posted:
Mar 17, 2005 - 15:47 |
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I don't worry about it, I just play for the next TD. Doesn't matter if you're winning, losing or drawing, another TD is always good.
As for CircularLogic's example, you're not really 'playing for a tie' in that situation, since a win is a pretty remote possibility. Barring a lucky kick & a blitz, those dwarves have no choice but to settle for the tie. (unless of course the dwarf coach is MUCH better than his oppo, but if that was a case, they wouldn't be losing anyway). IMO the phrase 'playing for a tie' implies that you at least have a chance to go for the win.
You know, I don't think I'm making any sense... (again) |
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Wizard
Joined: Jul 09, 2004
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| Posted:
Mar 17, 2005 - 15:47 |
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CircularLogic - like i said, always score
I couldn't care about my CR, spp is all good |
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"As long as one person lives in darkness then it seems to be a responsibility to tell other people." |
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CorporateSlave3
Joined: Feb 07, 2004
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| Posted:
Mar 17, 2005 - 15:57 |
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| Nordmark wrote: |
P.s. Couldn´t you find ANY more extreme situation than that one? |
Ooh Ooooh! I can! Pick me!
Ok: what if they have a one turner, but you have a full skaven gutter squad with AG5 and catch on all of them. You're down 0-1, but all his players are Stunned. Do you score on your turn 15, hoping for a Blitz or a first action turnover on the next kickoff to get to the ball before they can, and run in the second TD on your turn 16? And, you have no RR but they do. And it is a tournament final. And you drank a lot of soda right before it, so you have to pee real bad, but your bathroom is broken so you'd have to run down to the corner shop to use theirs, and your opponent has to finish in the next 5 minutes cause he's shipping off to the army for two years right after the game. And you bet your life savings that you wouldn't lose the game. And your mouse isn't working properly, making critical misclicks very likely. And there are loud sirens and flashing red lights coming from the nuclear plant next door.
extreme enough example?
p.s. pay no attention to me, perhaps I will go away. |
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HollowOne
Joined: Sep 23, 2004
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| Posted:
Mar 17, 2005 - 16:04 |
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| Azurus wrote: | | As for CircularLogic's example, you're not really 'playing for a tie' in that situation, since a win is a pretty remote possibility. [...] IMO the phrase 'playing for a tie' implies that you at least have a chance to go for the win. |
That's a very questionable interpretation. If it's turn 8 of the second half and the dwarves are desperately trying to score the equalizer, they are still, by definition, playing for a tie. Even if they have no chance to win.
And the example does perfectly illustrate the difference between playing for a tie, and playing purely to win. If the dwarves stall in the turn 6, they're trying to force a tie. If they score instead, they're taking the very small chance that they'll get lucky and their Runners / Blitzers can somehow smack the elven thrower, and gambling it against the substantially larger chance that the elves will score again and win.
It's not even an extreme example, because it happens all the time. And I think that in most cases, the dwarf coach would take the strategic draw over the near impossible win. |
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A censor is a man who knows more than he thinks you ought to. - Granville Hicks |
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HollowOne
Joined: Sep 23, 2004
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| Posted:
Mar 17, 2005 - 16:13 |
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| Nordmark wrote: | | I probably would settle for a tie in that case. All I´m saying is that I play to win. If that costs me the game then that´s to bad. |
If you stall for a draw, then you don't always play to win.
| Quote: | | P.s. Couldn´t you find ANY more extreme situation than that one? |
It's not at all extreme and completely relevant; and successful, too, since it made you negate your absolute. |
_________________
A censor is a man who knows more than he thinks you ought to. - Granville Hicks |
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CircularLogic
Joined: Aug 22, 2003
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| Posted:
Mar 17, 2005 - 16:46 |
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HollowOne already made my points - thx 
So you would score with dwarves in turn 4, having 4 other turns to turn over the ball. What about turn 5? What about orcs on turn 6? What if you had a ST4 MA 7 dwarven runner with block stripball?
The question is not simple - there are alot of fine graduations and everyone has his point were he calls it a day and goes for the draw instead of trying to play for the win. That´s why I voted "NO".
And for the more extrem example:
Dwarven team, turn 6, all your runners and blitzers are BH, but your trollslayer can make it in 2 turn to his endzone with 3 GFI. |
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Nordmark
Joined: Sep 09, 2004
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| Posted:
Mar 17, 2005 - 17:18 |
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Ok...So i try to play to win. But as you said CircularLogic it depends on the situation. It really depends on what mood you are in as well. Sometimes you feel rash and sometimes you are calm. It also depends on how your team look. Has the orcs a blitzer or two with ag4? ag5? Let´s reverse. You are the highelves and play the dwarves. You are down 0-1. Do you stall against the dwarves. Questions that only lead to more questions.
P.s. Thx for the extreme examples. D.s.
Edit: Besides. Just because I sometimes in certain situations has too play for that tie doesn´t make it less sissy. |
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”The oldest and strongest emotion of mankind is fear, and the oldest and strongest kind of fear is the fear of the unknown.” - H.P. Lovecraft
Last edited by Nordmark on %b %17, %2005 - %20:%Mar; edited 1 time in total |
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xlars
Joined: May 12, 2004
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| Posted:
Mar 17, 2005 - 17:37 |
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I woted yes eventhough I do play for ties sometimes, Im just not proud of it. So I must be a sissy |
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Smurf team in Stunty leeg! |
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Azurus
Joined: Aug 02, 2003
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| Posted:
Mar 17, 2005 - 18:58 |
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| HollowOne wrote: |
That's a very questionable interpretation... |
Yup, that's the problem with interpretations, they ALWAYS questionable.
Anyway, like I said, I don't think i made much sense in that post. I actually attempted to re-word my sentiments for this post, but that made no sense either, so I'm just going to shut up now.
EDIT: I think the problem is I'm interpreting the original question differently from you guys...which means I took the example in a different context...HollowOne answered well, but he answered HIS interpreatation of what I said, not mine. You can see why I get so confused, my mind is always like this...  And I lied about shutting up... |
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*This is a public safety announcement. Azurus is a cynical, sarcastic idiot. Please ignore any and everything he may say. Thank you for your attention.* |
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tassel
Joined: May 04, 2004
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| Posted:
Mar 17, 2005 - 19:34 |
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Hmm. At the beginning of the thread I was sure I always play to win. What I'm about to say is about Ranked only, but those I play the most.
Now those examples were eye opening...
With common dwarves on turn 6, I'd score for quite sure. That's a classical case of "to stall or not to stall, what a prob m8"
A sure hands or reroll on opponent wouldn't make a difference.
With all my MA6:s removed ... I have to think. I'd probably still score. Sure one can come up with a situation where dwarves have played so that the stalling is FOR SURE safe, but those cases are rare. Plus I'd give the near impossible 3GFI td a chance. I like that sort of thing.
With a lot of gutters and the nuclear power plant... I'm positive I'd score. Right away. =D
But it's not because I hate being labeled a sissy nor because I'm that afraid of losing the chance to score, it's more because (normally) I simply play to win. It's the first objective. Losing is bad, but not really any more than tieing. The money isn't going to help any team. Fan factor I could care but not that much. And if it's not a +1 to wins and the percent, it doesn't matter to me if it's a tie or a lose.
The only thing I care more about than winning is the building of the team. =D
That means I would stall if it saved me from putting those last gutters in LoS in front of those tackkle mighty blows. |
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Ash
Joined: Feb 03, 2004
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| Posted:
Mar 17, 2005 - 20:37 |
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If i ve a nice chance to win, i will try it, don t care about the tie...
but it happens sometimes that i choose to set a tie for my target soon in a game. It happened shortly when i played my human against dwarves in a tournament, after 2 kills by turn 3 i decided to not ruin my team for all the tournament and just try a tie. And i did it! |
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Ash |
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bloodelf
Joined: Nov 30, 2003
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| Posted:
Mar 17, 2005 - 20:43 |
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gotta play for score, there could be injury time |
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Macavity
Joined: Nov 23, 2004
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| Posted:
Mar 17, 2005 - 20:44 |
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I actually own 8 Ties.... I wear one maybe twice a year, but I own 8 different ones.... |
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When I became a man I put away childish things, including the fear of childishness and the desire to be very grown up. -C.S. Lewis |
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keggiemckill
Joined: Oct 07, 2004
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| Posted:
Mar 17, 2005 - 20:52 |
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| Macavity wrote: | | I actually own 8 Ties.... I wear one maybe twice a year, but I own 8 different ones.... |
But do you play for them? |
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The Drunker I get, the more I spill
"Keggie is the guy with the bleach blond hair that gives answers nobody else would think of."
Jeffro |
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