FUMBBL :: Online Blood Bowl League

Casarez

Joined: Nov 17, 2006

Posted: Nov 27, 2006 - 17:28

OK, I figured I would hit up you guys for some advice etc on this team. I am having fun playing them although more and more before the end of the first half I am down to 5 players or so with the rest out to injuries. Problem is I am not getting enough money to really pad my numbers to absorb losing Gobbos to injuries during the game. I try to leave my apothecary for my Trolls since losing one of those would really hurt.

Is the solution to hire freebooters for the time being? Should I have not bought the second Troll during team creation? Am I actually doing OK and just do not realize it?

I do not expect to win all the time but I do want it to be a fun challenge for my opponents. Smile

Here is the team:
http://fumbbl.com/FUMBBL.php?page=team&op=view&team_id=310757

_________________
Rick

Smeat

Joined: Nov 19, 2006

Posted: Nov 27, 2006 - 21:07

(Edit- double post. Ignore or Delete)

_________________
Let's go A.P.E.!

(...and what exactly do you think they do with all those dead players?...)

Last edited by Smeat on %b %27, %2006 - %21:%Nov; edited 1 time in total

Smeat

Joined: Nov 19, 2006

Posted: Nov 27, 2006 - 21:08

Hey-

Relatively new here, but I'm perfectly capable of parroting the "usual advice", or at least some of it.

1) There is no single "right" way to play or build a team, and individual creativity is a wide open field, but the racial tips page* is "common wisdom", and a good place to start. There, under Goblins, it confirms that:
(* Here: http://fumbbl.com/help:Race+Playstyles+and+Strategy)

Now-
From your lineup (without actually analyzing the past story game by game), I see 5 "newish" players, with 1, 2, and 3, 5 and 6 games, respectively (the original 4 gobbo's and 2 trolls have 7. Past players shows 4 dead, and 1 niggle.

So...

2) Don't retire a Niggle until you really don't need him. Instead, put him up front when kicking off, in the "high mortality" zone, so he can serve one last function by giving his life, instead of a healthy gobbo.

3) With an AV of 9, Str 5 and Regenerate, Trolls are not "likely" to take a Casualty. If you want, save the Apoth for the 2nd half, but if it's 4 turns to go and a gobbo takes it in the shorts, you can probably accept the small risk and hope your Trolls don't get that unlucky*.

(* Famous last words. They will, of course, at some point, but you can't cover every base. Just as in any game, gotta accept a risk at some point.)

4) Have several backup gobbos (like 4!). Even if they're just BH (a "good" result, btw!), they need to be replaced next Kick Off for a full 11 on the field. Less than 11 means being outnumbered, and even more chance of injury. Rotate in newbs to the front line (along with the Niggles!), but look for opportunities to get them SPP, enough for that first skill (or two.) If they live, they improve, if they don't, they're cheap to replace.

5) If you want to see what a "successful" team looks like, go to the Teams page*, and by clicking the different heading categories you can scan for the gobbo team that has the best W/L record, or the most TD's, or whatever. Click on the Team, and see what their lineup/history looks like- or open an old game or three to see what their roster looked like "way back when".

(* Nav Link on your main page, which will take you here: http://fumbbl.com/FUMBBL.php?page=teams)

Good luck, and I'm sure someone else will come along to speak more from experience, and less from theory.

Readya later!

_________________
Let's go A.P.E.!

(...and what exactly do you think they do with all those dead players?...)

vanGorn

Joined: Feb 24, 2004

Posted: Nov 27, 2006 - 21:18

Goblins are fun. Even when they loose. And they loose a lot.
I like to hire Fungus the Looon. He's cheap, so even if he does collapse on his first move, there's no need to worry.
No risk - No fun. %)

_________________
Gimme a pint of fungus beer!
Then we will climb the ladder.

DaGhuty

Joined: Nov 08, 2004

Posted: Nov 27, 2006 - 21:37

Hey, if you need tips to coach goblins have a peek at this guys teams. http://fumbbl.com/~Habeli He has 3 pretty well going long term gobbo teams in ranked and all have positive win/lose record!

My tip would be that not be shy with the boot and the stars! Give a good foul at the start of each drive. Dp is skill that goblins will need to survive so take it asap!

Have fun and enjoy ur goblins take the pain Very Happy

Shinan

Joined: Aug 02, 2003

Posted: Nov 27, 2006 - 21:56

Retiring nigglers is a must later tough when you usually give up 3-4 handicaps. With a couple of "It wasn't me" "Morley's Revenge" and "Duh, where am I" you don't want any nigglers to suffer from "Virus" as well.

On the other hand Gobbos are more expensive than halflings and I only have experience with halflings 8^)

_________________
"ÃƒÂ„lÃƒÂ¤ lÃƒÂ¶i, en ole hurrit."

vanGorn

Joined: Feb 24, 2004

Posted: Nov 27, 2006 - 21:59

Well, there is no need to give 3-4 handicaps if your team plays against teams in its TR regions.

_________________
Gimme a pint of fungus beer!
Then we will climb the ladder.

pac

Joined: Oct 03, 2005

Posted: Nov 27, 2006 - 22:21

Don't hire freebooters. It's not that important to have 11 (or whatever number) for a match, and in the long term it's a very inefficient use of cash.

Starting with two Trolls is fine - having two Trolls is quite important, in fact.

If you want your team to survive, and maybe even have a bit of success, you will have to be a bit picky about your games. Make no bones about this: the TS system is highly inaccurate for Stunty teams, and to match games by TR would be brave indeed! Figure out your own criteria for match-ups you're prepared to take, and don't budge - no matter how nicely the Dwarf coach asks! Wink

Edit: BTW, normal skill choices for Goblins are Sidestep and Diving Tackle. It's okay to have Catch on one (as a one-turn TD specialist), but generally Catch is not a very useful skill choice compared to those two.

_________________
Join us in building Blood Bowl Sixth Edition.
In other news, the Hittites are back. Join us in #fumbbl.hi Very Happy

Casarez

Joined: Nov 17, 2006

Posted: Nov 27, 2006 - 22:39

Smeat wrote:

2) Don't retire a Niggle until you really don't need him. Instead, put him up front when kicking off, in the "high mortality" zone, so he can serve one last function by giving his life, instead of a healthy gobbo.

I came to that realization right after I retired him. I knew I should not have done it but I am sure the admins are busy enough without correcting my mistakes. I just figured I would live with that one.

_________________
Rick

Casarez

Joined: Nov 17, 2006

Posted: Nov 27, 2006 - 22:45

pac wrote:

Don't hire freebooters. It's not that important to have 11 (or whatever number) for a match, and in the long term it's a very inefficient use of cash.

That is what I wondered about. I figure I need to get my roster a bit deeper first.

Quote:

If you want your team to survive, and maybe even have a bit of success, you will have to be a bit picky about your games. Make no bones about this: the TS system is highly inaccurate for Stunty teams, and to match games by TR would be brave indeed! Figure out your own criteria for match-ups you're prepared to take, and don't budge - no matter how nicely the Dwarf coach asks! Wink

Heh, yeah I played two games against Khemri. I know it was not the best match-up but at the same time I wanted to get some games in.

Quote:

Edit: BTW, normal skill choices for Goblins are Sidestep and Diving Tackle. It's okay to have Catch on one (as a one-turn TD specialist), but generally Catch is not a very useful skill choice compared to those two.

OK, I wondered about that but the user guide really did not say much about which skills were better etc. Except to say Block was good for Trolls, which was weird it was not a choice when I got my skill roll for one of my Trolls. Thanks for the tip though, I will choose right ones from here on out.

Thanks for the posts so far guys!

_________________
Rick

johan

Joined: Aug 02, 2003

Posted: Nov 27, 2006 - 23:16

Casarez wrote:

OK, I figured I would hit up you guys for some advice etc on this team.

"A strange game. The only winning move is not to play."
--Joshua, WarGames

Wink

pac

Joined: Oct 03, 2005

Posted: Nov 27, 2006 - 23:20

Casarez wrote:

OK, I wondered about that but the user guide really did not say much about which skills were better etc. Except to say Block was good for Trolls, which was weird it was not a choice when I got my skill roll for one of my Trolls. Thanks for the tip though, I will choose right ones from here on out.

Yes, many of the racial strategy guides are out of date, and are still written as though Big Guys could take General skills on normal rolls. They are wikis, but we are all too shy/lazy to update them. Smile

My take on skills for a Goblin team: -

Goblins - normal: Sidestep and Diving Tackle. Usually SS first (about two-thirds of the time). A goblin with both these skills becomes line fodder, to be used to mark dangerous players. Why put a skilled player in danger? Because a goblin with only normal skills really isn't worth the amount he is valued in terms of TR or TS. So it's best to get him killed, and if he gets even more skills without dying, you may even want to retire him - a new goblin will be almost as good, and will get more chances to get better skill rolls faster.

Goblins - doubles: Here you really are spolit for choice. Block, Dirty Player, Strip Ball, Guard, Kick, Sure Hands … All these and more have good points. It really depends on what your team most needs at the time.

And take all stat ups on a goblin. You might take a double rather than MA on a 5+5, but that's all.

The development of goblins who get stat ups becomes much more interesting. An AG 4 goblin is probably going to see a lot of the ball, so Catch might well become worth it. An ST 3 Goblin must take Block should he roll a double (an ST 3 Block Sidestep Goblin will be a nightmare for many opponents, especially as he can crop up at a low TS level where few players with such skills are found).

Trolls - normal: Guard is the main one. Without stat ups or doubles, the other normal skill choices are nothing worth speaking of. Break Tackle is okay (and 1-in-6 odds aren't too bad for Goblins). But the others do little to improve the player.

Trolls - doubles: Again, when doubles come into the picture things get interesting! Block first. If you're lucky enough to get another … Well, my Goblin team has one example of what you might do with a few doubles on a Troll. Smile

But Stand Firm and Pro would have been good choices there too.

And a general point: keep the rating of your team down where you can. A squad of 14 should be big enough. If you get more cash and have a healthy squad of that size, spend it on Stars or Wizards - as Goblins, you will be able to find opponents who will play you despite having them. If you don't keep your TR down voluntarily, you will end up meeting a team that does it forcibly! Shocked

If you manage to build up a team with a good-sized group of goblins with stat ups and doubles then you can think about competing at a higher level (but don't expect it to last for too long!).

Casarez

Joined: Nov 17, 2006

Posted: Nov 28, 2006 - 04:41

pac wrote:

Yes, many of the racial strategy guides are out of date, and are still written as though Big Guys could take General skills on normal rolls. They are wikis, but we are all too shy/lazy to update them. Smile

If someone took the time it would help noobs like me. Smile

Quote:

My take on skills for a Goblin team:

Thanks for the help. I really do appreciate it. now I am wondering if I should keep going with this team or start again. I am leaning towards going on with it.

_________________
Rick

Topper

Joined: Aug 03, 2003

Posted: Nov 28, 2006 - 05:12

About the side step skill - it actually makes players stay out of trouble - and thus prevent them from being hurt (well sometimes Wink

)
You certainly need a bigger squad than your present 12.
Personally I´d go for 14-15, because they aren´t around long anyway Smile