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Kanny



Joined: Jul 06, 2016

Post   Posted: Jul 28, 2016 - 14:55 Reply with quote Back to top

ArrestedDevelopment wrote:
I'm assuming this is not on here, so will reply on that basis:

Block is the safe standard - your troll is now more reliable than he was before. People will be less inclined to just thoughtlessly mark him up (though they still will, because you can never get rid of that RS roll and skulls happen). In addition, half-dicing him with a blocker is now no longer a semi-attractive option and needs to be considered carefully. Short-term this is a far better option, but your odds of getting the +ST again are slim.

Taking +ST is a slightly dicier proposition. Your troll now gets 3d on one assist, and if/when he gets break tackle, will have a 3+ dodge into a cage if you are ever desperate. Opponents can still half-dice him with impunity (and will, and it'll be extra annoying, anyone who says that getting 3d without block easily makes not having block less of a big deal has never actually played a team that can end up completely reliant on having big guys on their feet at times), and every time you roll both down/both down/skull you will wince. You do however have good odds for rolling another double, and could eventually end up with an st6, block, stand firm behemoth that a lot of teams will struggle to deal with - especially so if you ever induce Ripper alongside him.


So..... I think this depends a lot on meta. In a long-term perpetual division (ie. online), you will, in all likelihood be able to play enough games for the +ST to give solid long-term value (providing no death/bad perms). In a short division, league or tournament where the team is not being carried over, this is incredibly unlikely and block will simply be much better value in terms of winning immediate games. On table top, since gaming dice are less random than an rng, it's probably less likely you get burned by 3d blocks with +ST, but it's also more likely that he goes a lot longer without block.


Thanks everyone for all the awesome responses, its a really tough choice. Bit more information: I'm 3 games in to an 11 game league (12 teams). I've won 2 and Lost 1.

Due to a player dropping out we have set up a system where each player gets 1 freebie 1-0 win at a point in the season. Basically during the freebie game you get 16 turns where all your allowed to do is score a TD and then end turn until the end of the match. No Blocks, throws or other SP generating actions can be taken. This gives the team a total of 8 SPP (3 for the TD and 5 for the MVP) and some winnings (I have 290k in the bank at the moment).

My freebie match is next. At the time of writing my Troll has 8SPP. So it may be possible to get him to score the TD and get him up to 11SPP next match (16 if I get very lucky and land the MVP on him).

Anyway, after the freebie game he will have 7 more games to play before the end of the league, so I'm not sure if that kind of time frame alters your opinions at all.

Thanks once again for all your thoughts!
JackassRampant



Joined: Feb 26, 2011

Post   Posted: Jul 29, 2016 - 00:13 Reply with quote Back to top

Do you just ditch the team after 11 games? If so, that's an argument for Block.

Either is a good call.

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DarthPhysicist



Joined: Jun 14, 2015

Post   Posted: Jul 29, 2016 - 00:55 Reply with quote Back to top

Block.

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Lorebass



Joined: Jun 25, 2010

Post   Posted: Jul 29, 2016 - 01:44
FUMBBL Staff
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pythrr wrote:
leap, baby


He probably meant +STR
BlackDice



Joined: Feb 13, 2016

Post   Posted: Jul 29, 2016 - 02:10 Reply with quote Back to top

Dirty Player and leap on the next double.
Matthueycamo



Joined: May 16, 2014

Post   Posted: Jul 29, 2016 - 02:18 Reply with quote Back to top

Nuffle get's mad when you turn down his gifts, don't make him feed in the quad skulls!

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Catalyst32



Joined: Jul 14, 2008

Post   Posted: Jul 29, 2016 - 03:07 Reply with quote Back to top

ST6...
Other Big Guys need 2 ASSISTS to get a 2D Block against him.
ST4 opponents need 3 ASSISTS to get a 2D Block against him.
ST3 opponents need 4 ASSISTS to get a 2D Block against him.

With 1 ASSIST you get a 3D Block against a ST3 opponent.
Against other Big Guys you don't need any assists to get a 2D Block against them.

You can only get a ST7 Troll if you take the 1st +ST.
He isn't going to roll +ST 3 times. (It COULD happen but... seriously)
But he could easily roll 2, 3 or 4 Doubles.
So you can still get Block.

+ST makes Break Tackle a better skill for him.
(Dodge into 1 TZ on a 2+... 2 TZ's on a 3+.)
(Dodge into a Cage and hit the Ball Carrier with a 2D Block without any assists!)

+ST makes Multiple Block a better skill for him.
(Add 1 assist and get 2 2D Blocks against 2 ST3 opponents.)

Block is great n a Big Guy. ST6 is BETTER.
Catalyst32



Joined: Jul 14, 2008

Post   Posted: Jul 29, 2016 - 03:11 Reply with quote Back to top

Definitely score the TD with the Troll.

Surely you can keep the Goblins going in another league.
Lots of leagues will take in transfers from other leagues.
Many won't take transfers... but might make an exception for a Goblin Team.
Wreckage



Joined: Aug 15, 2004

Post   Posted: Jul 29, 2016 - 03:19 Reply with quote Back to top

It's true that +st rarely comes along. On the other hand if you take block and are fortunate enough to roll another double you got a block pro troll..and the usefulness doesn't end with the second double.... whereas with +st you just gamble for the chance of that second double to make it worthwhile...
KhorneliusPraxx



Joined: Jul 28, 2005

Post   Posted: Jul 29, 2016 - 04:57 Reply with quote Back to top

Read my sig!

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Antithesisoftime



Joined: Aug 20, 2014

Post   Posted: Jul 29, 2016 - 06:31 Reply with quote Back to top

Wreckage wrote:
It's true that +st rarely comes along. On the other hand if you take block and are fortunate enough to roll another double you got a block pro troll..and the usefulness doesn't end with the second double.... whereas with +st you just gamble for the chance of that second double to make it worthwhile...
Personally, I'd prefer a blodge troll over a block/pro troll.
Blodge + Stand Firm makes for a road stop that is incredibly hard to deal with. Dodge also synergizes well with break tackle.

Even without Break Tackle, a blodge Troll is an obscenity that becomes harder to deal with as he skills more. Take grab, and an opponent either has to dodge away, or hope for a POW and expend a lot of resources to get it. Trolls work best with passive skills, especially if they can't get the assist on Really Stupid
garyt1



Joined: Mar 12, 2011

Post   Posted: Jul 29, 2016 - 06:37 Reply with quote Back to top

ArrestedDevelopment wrote:
On table top, since gaming dice are less random than an rng, it's probably less likely you get burned by 3d blocks with +ST, but it's also more likely that he goes a lot longer without block.

Less likely you will roll skulls and both downs on tabletop? Well rolling with few bounces you could try to roll the dice in a way to get less skulls but normally dice are on tabletop aren't going to be much different.

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garyt1



Joined: Mar 12, 2011

Post   Posted: Jul 29, 2016 - 06:42 Reply with quote Back to top

Kanny wrote:
[Anyway, after the freebie game he will have 7 more games to play before the end of the league,

In that case definitely block.
Different for online teams or a tabletop league where you can use the same team in future seasons.

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Dach



Joined: Dec 25, 2015

Post   Posted: Jul 29, 2016 - 06:45 Reply with quote Back to top

Block, if nuffle really want you to have a STR 6 block troll he will give you another +1 STR.
delusional



Joined: Jan 18, 2013

Post   Posted: Jul 29, 2016 - 06:46 Reply with quote Back to top

Go +St

You are probably not going to get a second double. The chances of 2x assist to block you down are fairly common, even on a 1 dice roll the opponent still gets a fairly high chance of making you go down or pushback (Pow, Pow!, pushback, pushback, both down, down). so 1/3 your going down, 1/3 pushback out of way. Sure you save on a 1/6 prob.

While if you choose str, 4 st3 takes up allot of players. if you face the same scenario you get to choose from 2 dice still, the opponenet is allot less likely to do this. Also you just need 1 assist to do 3 dice blocks vs st3.

Lastly if you get the second double, you go block, you now have a tournament monster and may stand a chance. It's 1/6 and rare, but possible. It also means you stand a huge advantage vs halflings. The chances of getting another +st are 1/36 and very rare. But lets face it you are playing goblins in a tourney you have to take a chance to get there. (you may want to get a str7 monster and just do 3d6 blocks all the time,,,, if so have fun Smile)
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