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garyt1



Joined: Mar 12, 2011

Post   Posted: Apr 28, 2021 - 04:50 Reply with quote Back to top

Glad you are enjoying them. Four rerolls is controversial. RRs are overpriced when having many loner players. That part will be marginally better in 2020 rules, but you are still asking for trouble when making key, actions with the loners (though you may have to).
Looks like you have a fun team there. The strong arm, accurate thrower build there too. Lots of options. Though no ag4 yet to catch his throws. A move 7 slayer in there too for the surf threat.

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smeborg



Joined: Jan 04, 2019

Post   Posted: Apr 28, 2021 - 08:01 Reply with quote Back to top

Thanks, yes I am enjoying them very much, that's why I have persisted with them despite their very poor record early on. The move to 4 RRs + Leader and 15 menz was based on playing experience - I did not expect to do either when I started. I was regularly down on numbers, and also missing that crucial RR or 2 at the end of drives. So I said: "Why not?", and it worked.

I might have added:

- OWA seem to enjoy playing against AG teams (elveses, Skaven etc.) at any level.

- They can get out-bashed early on, but get better against bash teams as they develop. They should not try to "out-bash" them though, better to stay out of contact (even if this means late-in-turn dodges, even at 4+).

- As they develop they can generate quite a lot of SPPs per game, allowing them to cope to an extent with losses (e.g. 19 SPPs vs. CDs in the last game).

- They are an "adaptive" team (like Humies), they have to change strategy according to the opponent. They have a surprising amount of good starting resources at their disposal (5 x Block, 3 x Dodge, 2 x Sure Hands, 5 x AV9, 6 x Thick Skull, etc.).

- Deployment at the set piece is highly variable according to the opposition and the match situation. This takes time to learn, it helps to develop general principles to speed up your thinking. Few set-ups are the same (though there are patterns).

Hope that helps!
smeborg



Joined: Jan 04, 2019

Post   Posted: Apr 28, 2021 - 08:06 Reply with quote Back to top

"...you are still asking for trouble when making key, actions with the loners..."

Maybe, but if you never take key actions with the Loners (there are 8 on the roster), you make life very easy for the opposing coach, surely?
smeborg



Joined: Jan 04, 2019

Post   Posted: Apr 28, 2021 - 10:59 Reply with quote Back to top

Also, Halflings are good value to me. 2 for the price of a Lino + 10,000. Better 11 menz on the park with a 'Fling, than 10. They come into their own against Tackle-lite opponents (which is nearly every team at the start), create surprising options on both O & D. Auxiliary Receivers. And they create the TTM one-turn-score option.

The higher AV of the Dorfs, and their T-Skull, has saved my bacon on many an occasion. I regard the Dorf Runner as an ideal Leader caddy, so would always take him.
Lyracian



Joined: Oct 29, 2015

Post   Posted: Apr 28, 2021 - 12:53 Reply with quote Back to top

Nice update. With Humans getting Flings in 2020 rules I am struggling to see the value in this team though? A Frenzy Troll Slayer seems to be the only advantage whereas 3 of your Blitzers get slower. at least with 2016 Rules you are getting Tackle on two of them.

At the TV you have reached it seems you could be doing the same with a Human team and not have to worry about Loner?

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Lyracian.
garyt1



Joined: Mar 12, 2011

Post   Posted: Apr 28, 2021 - 21:47 Reply with quote Back to top

Yeah once you change Block and Tackle for inferior skills they look less interesting. A few extra armour 9 and thick skull players does have its merits over Humans, but you lose the speedy team option.
It is more of an amusement option to combine Humans and Dwarfs. I don't rate Halflings for either roster. One as a bench warmer is ok. Maybe 2 for a while if you happen to have 60K left over, like I did when I started my team.

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Dan-Da-Man



Joined: May 14, 2012

Post   Posted: Apr 28, 2021 - 23:43 Reply with quote Back to top

will the dwarfs get the proper skills soon? arm bar brawler.

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garyt1



Joined: Mar 12, 2011

Post   Posted: Apr 29, 2021 - 03:04 Reply with quote Back to top

That will be whenever the whole client and site is updated to new rules. I believe could be a few months yet as a lot to do. The current skills are correct for BB2016.
https://fumbbl.com/p/blog?c=Christer

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ClayInfinity



Joined: Aug 15, 2003

Post   Posted: Apr 29, 2021 - 07:53 Reply with quote Back to top

Not sure about the 2020 ruleset, but with 2016, I have enjoyed my games with my team ( https://fumbbl.com/p/team?team_id=991936 ). I only carry 1 fling (and he's there ONLY as a OTTD option and only takes the field if we're less than 11) and I find the utility of the Human Linemen combined with the guarding longbeards great value.

I have not used the Runner (too slow) and I even struggle to utilise the Dwarf Blitzer much (he's just another, slightly more mobile guarder). I just lost my Tackle/Mighty Blow Troll Slayer last game, so I will lose his killing and anti dodging powers, but overall I find the team to be a "tough human team".

The Human thrower, catcher and blitzer are the core team members and everything else is "support".

With the 2020 rules, yes, I struggle to see them gaining popularity by changing to Brawler/Arm Bar and with Humans gaining Halflings, that becomes the better of the good aligned hybrid teams.
smeborg



Joined: Jan 04, 2019

Post   Posted: Apr 29, 2021 - 20:51 Reply with quote Back to top

Agreed that the team looks weaker in BB2020, especially at the start. The Dorf Blockers cannot easily be skilled up (MVP is random, not semi-chosen). But they are still useful lumps for the defensive LoS (maybe keep them off the field on O until they skill up?). Loss of starting Tackle will hurt the most IMO.

Compensatory factors are not to be sniffed at, though. Halflings lose Loner, a Tree can be taken (better for TTM and on the defensive LoS, also cheaper = more starting options), and the 5 Dorfs get 3+ Loner.

Am open-minded, looking forward to observing how they go.
smeborg



Joined: Jan 04, 2019

Post   Posted: Apr 29, 2021 - 21:02 Reply with quote Back to top

My inclination in both BB2016 and BB2020 is to take all the positionals (Tree in BB2020). Find ways to make them work harmoniously together - such ways undoubtedly exist. If that's not to your taste, no worries, play another team!
garyt1



Joined: Mar 12, 2011

Post   Posted: Apr 30, 2021 - 00:09 Reply with quote Back to top

I struggle to see a Tree as a better option than an Ogre. No Bonehead, but instead is stuck in place. Will struggle to be part of many cages. That said I have never used Halflings or Wood Elves.

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smeborg



Joined: Jan 04, 2019

Post   Posted: Apr 30, 2021 - 07:29 Reply with quote Back to top

garyt1 wrote:
I struggle to see a Tree as a better option than an Ogre. No Bonehead, but instead is stuck in place. Will struggle to be part of many cages. That said I have never used Halflings or Wood Elves.


Yes, I agree that Take Root is bad, as is MA2. However, I can see positive reasons to take the Tree:

- ST6
- AV10
- Stand Firm
- Strong Arm

I think a good TTM option would work well for OWA (based on my experience that the team cannot often hold the ball for long). Non-Loner 'Fling thrown by a Tree with Strong Arm is quite a bit better than at present. Might decide the result every few games.
garyt1



Joined: Mar 12, 2011

Post   Posted: May 01, 2021 - 01:14 Reply with quote Back to top

TTM attempts rather than running with a decent carrier will lose a result more often than save it. Halfling teams need desperation options. But could help in t8/16. OF course if you have an ag4 halfling things may look a bit different. Very Happy

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