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Poll
Do you think that timeout:
Should be always called without any warning
13%
 13%  [ 24 ]
Should be always called but never the first time (1 warning max)
17%
 17%  [ 31 ]
Should be called only if happen too often in a game
40%
 40%  [ 72 ]
Should be never called
11%
 11%  [ 20 ]
Each coach should agree before the match how to manage the timeout csll
8%
 8%  [ 15 ]
Pie!!!!
10%
 10%  [ 18 ]
Total Votes : 180


PurpleChest



Joined: Oct 25, 2003

Post   Posted: May 25, 2023 - 09:45
FUMBBL Staff
Reply with quote Back to top

Joost wrote:
I don't see how this can warrant a 16 page discussion.


Welcome the the internet.

Quote:
The rule is you can press it anytime. But a little bit of courtesy by giving an advance warning to people that may not anticipate an immediate time out is not too much to ask right? Typing "btw - I do time out when your turn goes over 4 minutes" at the start of the game will cost you 3 seconds. No rule needed, just a bit of consideration that your opponent might not count on an immediate time out in an environment where immediate time outs are rare.


This. So this. Accepting their is another human on the other end, even if its someone you have had a bad experience with before, and agreeing your parameters.

Simple courtesy can solve so much. Who knows what the other human you are playing with has had in their life, that day, or any other you faced them. Or why they play?

But that also cuts the other way. If you spin a game in a competitive division, one even named 'Competitive', and get an opponent (clearly marked on the game page as such) in the 'Black Box Trophy', it is not unreasonable to expect they 'might' be a sweaty try hard munchkin that will do absolutely anything to win that game. You could always take the first step and say 'hey, im just sometimes maybe a bit slow, is that cool?' or 'im still getting used to this'. You know, establish some parameters.

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Barbarus hic ego sum, quia non intelligor illis -Ovid
I am a barbarian here because i am not understood by anyone
koadah



Joined: Mar 30, 2005

Post   Posted: May 25, 2023 - 10:26 Reply with quote Back to top

An audible & visual warning at 3:30 would mean that people wouldn't get to 4 minutes so often.

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JimmyFantastic



Joined: Feb 06, 2007

Post   Posted: May 25, 2023 - 23:23 Reply with quote Back to top

It's not even about tryharding. It's flip that guy wasting my time.

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Pull down the veil - actively bad for the hobby!
MattDakka



Joined: Oct 09, 2007

Post   Posted: May 25, 2023 - 23:24 Reply with quote Back to top

JimmyFantastic's quote: "You have 240 warnings every turn!" Very Happy
RDaneel



Joined: Feb 24, 2023

Post   Posted: May 25, 2023 - 23:52 Reply with quote Back to top

PurpleChest wrote:
Joost wrote:


The rule is you can press it anytime. But a little bit of courtesy by giving an advance warning to people that may not anticipate an immediate time out is not too much to ask right? Typing "btw - I do time out when your turn goes over 4 minutes" at the start of the game will cost you 3 seconds. No rule needed, just a bit of consideration that your opponent might not count on an immediate time out in an environment where immediate time outs are rare.


This. So this. Accepting their is another human on the other end, even if its someone you have had a bad experience with before, and agreeing your parameters.

Simple courtesy can solve so much. Who knows what the other human you are playing with has had in their life, that day, or any other you faced them. Or why they play?


Very interesting this exchange, it made me thinking something:
it happened to me (very seldom to be honest on FUMBBL which is a community composed by 90% of nice coaches - often on other platforms ) to have the impression to play not vs an human being but vs a machine. Neither a”gl hf” at the start of the match,till a sudden and unexpected timeout ….
i think i had a couple of match like this, and I repeat is quite seldom on FUMBBL , but the sense of shock or sadness I resented persisted on me for a while

Maybe the guy is just not used to the chat or whatever he dont’ like to tell anything and he is so concentrated for the victory in the competitive division(I play 90% because i like to play competitive) so that every way is allowed to win so also this button .
so he is not necessary a bad person even if his apparent behaviour disappointed me I was probably judging him based on insufficient data…


sometimes was me the rude person when my opponent was complaining about the bad dicing and i asked him to stop whining ( this is a fixation of mine: I never complain about the die because the die on average is always honest, even though it can be ridiculously absurd in one specific match). But I admit that sometimes I have been the uneducated one.

i think sometimes I personally have a tendency to confuse social into something too real or to put too high “human” expectations in the game over internet (I like a lot the human interaction in games , i play very often vs AI , and even if there would be an AI of BB i think i will use it very seldom)
I see that the fact that you don't physically see your opponent is likely to generate biases or expectations that are too high .

Maybe if this forum thread generated a lot of replies is because there are others who sometime resent the same feeling and had the will to write or share with the community something here.
JimmyFantastic



Joined: Feb 06, 2007

Post   Posted: May 26, 2023 - 00:08 Reply with quote Back to top

RDaneel wrote:
PurpleChest wrote:
Joost wrote:


The rule is you can press it anytime. But a little bit of courtesy by giving an advance warning to people that may not anticipate an immediate time out is not too much to ask right? Typing "btw - I do time out when your turn goes over 4 minutes" at the start of the game will cost you 3 seconds. No rule needed, just a bit of consideration that your opponent might not count on an immediate time out in an environment where immediate time outs are rare.


This. So this. Accepting their is another human on the other end, even if its someone you have had a bad experience with before, and agreeing your parameters.

Simple courtesy can solve so much. Who knows what the other human you are playing with has had in their life, that day, or any other you faced them. Or why they play?


Very interesting this exchange, it made me thinking something:
it happened to me (very seldom to be honest on FUMBBL which is a community composed by 90% of nice coaches - often on other platforms ) to have the impression to play not vs an human being but vs a machine. Neither a”gl hf” at the start of the match,till a sudden and unexpected timeout ….
i think i had a couple of match like this, and I repeat is quite seldom on FUMBBL , but the sense of shock or sadness I resented persisted on me for a while

Maybe the guy is just not used to the chat or whatever he dont’ like to tell anything and he is so concentrated for the victory in the competitive division(I play 90% because i like to play competitive) so that every way is allowed to win so also this button .
so he is not necessary a bad person even if his apparent behaviour disappointed me I was probably judging him based on insufficient data…


sometimes was me the rude person when my opponent was complaining about the bad dicing and i asked him to stop whining ( this is a fixation of mine: I never complain about the die because the die on average is always honest, even though it can be ridiculously absurd in one specific match). But I admit that sometimes I have been the uneducated one.

i think sometimes I personally have a tendency to confuse social into something too real or to put too high “human” expectations in the game over internet (I like a lot the human interaction in games , i play very often vs AI , and even if there would be an AI of BB i think i will use it very seldom)
I see that the fact that you don't physically see your opponent is likely to generate biases or expectations that are too high .

Maybe if this forum thread generated a lot of replies is because there are others who sometime resent the same feeling and had the will to write or share with the community something here.


My expectation is that my opponent finishes their turn within 4 minutes. You are the rude one taking longer.
HaruHaru



Joined: Sep 05, 2019

Post   Posted: May 26, 2023 - 05:53 Reply with quote Back to top

Jimmy, you are insufferable.
I'm sad that you seem to have started playing on fumbbl again because you're actively bad for the hobby.

You're the type of person who when teaching another person a board game you will actively avoid telling someone about a rule in order to Gotcha' them in order to win.

Just like MattDakka, you enjoy beating weaker players because it makes you feel powerful and I'm not sure why, I'm positive that you should see someone for that though.
MattDakka



Joined: Oct 09, 2007

Post   Posted: May 26, 2023 - 11:49 Reply with quote Back to top

To be honest, I actually help people, for example I explained many times how to mark skills on players to people who didn't know it and clearly were struggling due to not noticing some skills. I explained how Juggernaut + Block works vs Wrestle during a Blitz Action, I told them that Rushing with a 4+ PA player to reduce the passing range from Long Bomb to Long Pass is futile, I sent a link with the skills not working during Blitz! event and stuff like that. Yesterday I helped a new-to-the-site coach via PM.
If I wanted to beat weaker players I would play only on GF, so that doesn't match reality as well.
Actually I asked on forums, some time ago, a Box filter to be paired vs Stars or higher (note: Star in old rank system, it would be Super Star with new rank system). I play for the CR and for that purpose it's better to play vs close-skilled coaches.


Last edited by MattDakka on May 26, 2023 - 15:20; edited 1 time in total
Bobs



Joined: Feb 26, 2009

Post   Posted: May 26, 2023 - 12:05 Reply with quote Back to top

HaruHaru wrote:
Jimmy, you are insufferable.
I'm sad that you seem to have started playing on fumbbl again because you're actively bad for the hobby.

You're the type of person who when teaching another person a board game you will actively avoid telling someone about a rule in order to Gotcha' them in order to win.

Just like MattDakka, you enjoy beating weaker players because it makes you feel powerful and I'm not sure why, I'm positive that you should see someone for that though.


I agree with this !!

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RDaneel



Joined: Feb 24, 2023

Post   Posted: May 26, 2023 - 12:51 Reply with quote Back to top

there are different categories of players. Those who would do everything in their power to win and follow the law of 'anything goes in order to win' (those who say you "i will timeout without mercy... for instance) and those who are proud of themselves when they manage to win by playing their best but without having exploited their luck to the fullest or - if you like - having given their opponent their chances.

I remember a football match in UK where an attacker dribbled past the goalkeeper who fell and hurt himself. The attacker instead of scoring an empty goal which was totally in his right - because he realized that the goalkeeper had suffered a serious injury- threw the ball out and called for help.
Then I think his team won anyway the match . And it was a competitive game!

I think that player and that team felt really proud of themselves.

Competitive does not mean behaving like a "Terminator" machine with the sole objective of destroying your opponent.

In the end on the other side is a human being like me who invests an hour or more of his time trying to play his best. So let's be humans (with humans).

I would not want this post to be interpreted as 'turning the other cheek' in the biblical sense.
To be clear: if I meet a machine that treats me like a machine then I will also play like a machine.
Wink
panalukidis



Joined: Feb 23, 2018

Post   Posted: May 26, 2023 - 13:04 Reply with quote Back to top

i try not to be rude, i always say glhf, i like banter, i give warnings. but jimmy is right, do your shit within 4 minutes
Joost



Joined: Mar 17, 2014

Post   Posted: May 26, 2023 - 13:28 Reply with quote Back to top

sure, 'do your shit in 4 minutes'. I'm not arguing against people having that preference. Just invest 3 seconds into letting your oppo know that that is what you expect and that you will time out. It will keep opponents happy at no cost whatsoever. I honestly don't get what the problem is with simply informing the opponent when it is so, so simple to do.
panalukidis



Joined: Feb 23, 2018

Post   Posted: May 26, 2023 - 14:11 Reply with quote Back to top

i try not to be rude, i always say glhf, i like banter, I GIVE WARNINGS. i have never had a problem with another player. just do your stuff in 4 minutes. i find people being offended at jimmy kind of silly
SickAsEggs



Joined: Nov 28, 2019

Post   Posted: May 26, 2023 - 14:45 Reply with quote Back to top

Glad we can all have a reasonable discussion where someone is called "insufferable" for wanting people to play their turns in 4 minutes Smile
Spence



Joined: Dec 05, 2012

Post   Posted: May 26, 2023 - 15:11 Reply with quote Back to top

Joost wrote:
I honestly don't get what the problem is with simply informing the opponent when it is so, so simple to do.


I don't disagree with this, and it's clearly the best current solution. But, it's also wearing to potentially provoke the argument before you know it's necessary (which I suspect is why people tend to warn at 3 min than pregame). It's kinda like asking for Chess Clocks at a TT game. You *can* do it, but then you're perceived as the **** instead of it simply being the standard.

You don't see referees at a football match saying to the players beforehand, "BTW, I send off for headbutts"
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