JohnDaker
Joined: Aug 01, 2014
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 Posted:
Jan 22, 2026 - 21:01 |
 
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2nd edition was "you choose what winning means", either number of TD or actual time limit. |
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MattDakka
Joined: Oct 09, 2007
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Jan 22, 2026 - 21:04 |
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Yes, I meant, if you played with the "score 3 TDs" rule, games could last hours.
There was no turnover either and reserves could enter the pitch with the game in progress, that made the matches last long too. |
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JackassRampant
Joined: Feb 26, 2011
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Jan 22, 2026 - 22:04 |
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| Drrek wrote: | Every time someone tries to argue against stalling because it "doesn't match american football" I just have to laugh about how little they know about american football. Running out the clock is a massive part of the game, when teams are ahead they specifically do the type of plays that tend to not get large amounts of yards but run more time off the clock, that is, they are literally stalling. Yes you still have to make forward progress, but if you wanted it to be more like that then the trigger for stalling would be if you didn't move forward a certain number of spaces per turn, not just if you could score and didn't.
This game is unlike american football is so, so many ways, but stalling actually isn't one of them. Sure the mechanics of it are different, but the mechanics of everything are different. |
Thing is, though, it's still 11 on 11. The halfback losing yards on 1st down is always a possibility, and then things get more exciting: if whatever happens on 2nd down also doesn't pick up yards, now we have a real play coming up. In BB, well, depends on the situation, but usually a good stall doesn't provide that level of interest (sometimes it does, yes).
In American Football, a gassed defender can take a breath, shake it off, and line up in position in front of the ball again, so even when the run play moves the chains, there's hope. The game is several times as much time for action too, like 11 minutes of violence in 60 minutes of clock-time, where an 8-turn BB drive could easily be roleplayed in just 1 minute.
It's not realism that's my concern. American Football stalling is waaaaay more fun to watch than BB stalling is to watch or experience. |
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Lude enixe, obliviscatur timor. |
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Carthage
Joined: Mar 18, 2021
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Jan 22, 2026 - 22:31 |
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| Garion wrote: |
Agree with what you said apart from this bit ^
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To be fair... I said trying. Not that they were actually good at it haha. I think the "buy 1 box and have all the positionals" was a nod to it, but there are problems there for anyone that wants a bench of linemen. |
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JohnDaker
Joined: Aug 01, 2014
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Jan 22, 2026 - 23:21 |
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| Carthage wrote: | | Stalling is not appealing to new or casual players. |
How is that? If you are an experienced player against a new player, why would you stall?
On TT, it's going to be someone you personally know that you are introducing to the game: you are not going to stall.
Here, even if it is not someone you are personally introducing to the game, be nice, talk to them about the 145 club and try to make the game fun. If they are new to the game, you don't need stalling to win. |
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JackassRampant
Joined: Feb 26, 2011
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Jan 22, 2026 - 23:35 |
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If anything, I think this would encourage veterans to run up the score on new players. That hurts worse, because unlike a stall, getting run up on <nasal voice> will go down on your permanent record.
Not stalling doesn't actually feel better than stalling, to a team that takes a bunch of damage or doesn't have a working offense.
The real problem is that it's all fnordy, not that it actually feels worse than the alternative. It's like land destruction and milling in Magic: people don't like it because it rubs them the wrong way. Is that an excuse not to address it? Heck naw, game design is about feels. But the solution of "get people to stall less" is far from a panacea.
At least better OTS options make stalling less viable on offense, slightly.... |
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Lude enixe, obliviscatur timor.
Last edited by JackassRampant on Jan 22, 2026; edited 1 time in total |
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MattDakka
Joined: Oct 09, 2007
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Jan 22, 2026 - 23:36 |
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Vs a newcomer or a close friend playing the game in a casual way, from time to time, yes, you don't need to stall but, if you really want to teach the game to somebody who wants to improve and be competitive, showing how to stall is essential. I guess it's better to play the first games without stalling, then, if the new coach starts getting interest, more stalling can be added gradually to the matches.
It's a necessary evil, no matter if you like or dislike stalling, it's effective to win and control the game pace. People can't learn tactics and strategies if they don't experience them or read about them.
Always playing without stalling and high scoring might teach a new coach bad gameplay habits. |
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Loon
Joined: Aug 14, 2024
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Jan 22, 2026 - 23:57 |
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I like stalling when I'm getting my crap kicked in and we can just trade end turn buttons to get to the end of game. Beats having to play out meaningless turns with 3 players alive. |
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JackassRampant
Joined: Feb 26, 2011
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Jan 23, 2026 - 00:00 |
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Sure. Where I think this will come up, and maybe won't be a problem, but might be a bit embarrassing, is when there's a huge skill discrepancy in a league. If you see your opponent probably can't protect the ball from you, in the first half, now you won't take it away and stall to do damage, you're just gonna plunge on down and protect that 10k, try to repeat. Meanwhile, they won't get a chance to stall, meaning they won't stall, and will make an extra 10k. But it's kinda embarrassing to get scored on 4 times to begin with, and now it's going to be 5 or 6.... |
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Lude enixe, obliviscatur timor. |
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Garion
Joined: Aug 19, 2009
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Jan 23, 2026 - 00:09 |
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Drrek is right. Thank god the people that think stalling needs to be "fixed" are nowhere near the game design...
Its integral to game being as good as it is.. |
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Carthage
Joined: Mar 18, 2021
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Jan 23, 2026 - 00:10 |
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In my experience playing with people on TT of lower skill than me, yeah I can run the score up but that at least gives them the 4 hits every kickoff with a fresh new formation to feel like they can do something.
When you are stalling well, the opponent gets to stand up (tagged) get 1 blitz, then get their teeth kicked in afterwards. Or they just pass the turn and disengage from the game. I usually see people getting more demoralized from stalling than me being up 5-0. Because they start taking some schadenfreude in getting to punch my team. |
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MattDakka
Joined: Oct 09, 2007
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Jan 23, 2026 - 01:24 |
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| Garion wrote: | | Drrek is right. Thank god the people that think stalling needs to be "fixed" are nowhere near the game design... |
Ah yes, that brilliant game design needing FAQs to fix the badly worded rules! 
Blood Bowl is good for many reasons, but not due to dumb static cage stalling. I consider it an accepted flaw, because overall the game is quite fun to play and has more positive than negative sides.
Not saying that stalling (both dynamic and static) should not be an integral part of the game, but the static one should be harder. With the right balance between stalling and sacking there would be a better game experience for both coaches. |
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nThatch
Joined: Jan 13, 2004
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Jan 23, 2026 - 02:25 |
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Understanding stalling is as basic as a soccer ball being round. Crazy to even think of changing it. |
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Garion
Joined: Aug 19, 2009
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Jan 23, 2026 - 08:19 |
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| MattDakka wrote: | | Garion wrote: | | Drrek is right. Thank god the people that think stalling needs to be "fixed" are nowhere near the game design... |
Ah yes, that brilliant game design needing FAQs to fix the badly worded rules!
Blood Bowl is good for many reasons, but not due to dumb static cage stalling. I consider it an accepted flaw, because overall the game is quite fun to play and has more positive than negative sides.
Not saying that stalling (both dynamic and static) should not be an integral part of the game, but the static one should be harder. With the right balance between stalling and sacking there would be a better game experience for both coaches. |
You are wrong. You are making a logical strawman fallacy. Because what you do not understand is the negative consequences of creating rules bloat around clock management. Your argument centres around the conclusion that someone sets up a cage next to the endzone and then nothing happens and nothing can be done. In the thousands of games I've played and thousands I've observed I'd say the occurrences in which there is nothing you can do to prevent this are very rare. Yet your argument centres around this rare occurrence being bad so it needs to be stopped in your view. Managing to score in turn 8 is the strategy that all your tactics in the preceding 7 turns are based around.
If you just want to take turns scoring and brainlessly rolling dice go play Dreadball
Also if you have no faith in the rules writers - why do you think they'd be able to write a good anti stalling rule that doesn't ruin the game? The two attempts they've made so far are terribly written rules, and they do not impact experienced coaches and only create feel bad moments for noobs |
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MattDakka
Joined: Oct 09, 2007
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Jan 23, 2026 - 11:30 |
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| Garion wrote: |
Because what you do not understand is the negative consequences of creating rules bloat around clock management. |
Maybe, but I guess you don't understand the negative consequences of allowing cage stalling without chance to stop it.
| Garion wrote: |
Your argued centers around the conclusion that someone sets up a cage next to the endzone and then nothing happens and nothing can be done. |
Something can be often done, but the central part is: can the stalling be stopped effectively by doing things?
In my experience some kinds of cage stalling can't be stopped, no matter how good you played on defence. It's a mechanical thing. If you can't block/pressure the cage you can't stop the stall. It's not hard to understand it, even for a guy who played few Blood Bowl matches.
| Garion wrote: |
In the thousands of games I've played and thousands I've observed I'd say the occurrences in which there is nothing you can do to prevent this are very rare. |
I played thosands of games as well and the occurrences are not very rare. With Cpomb was super super common, but even without CRP Cpomb, some Guards and Mighty Blows are enough to allow cage stalling.
| Garion wrote: |
being bad so it needs to be stopped in your view. |
Not automatically stopped, I repeat: having a balance between sacking chance and stalling chance so, if you choose to stall with a cage, you might pay for it, instead of being a brainless wait till turn 8, which is something happening commonly. Maybe I should start to keep track of my own Box games to show how common is.
| Garion wrote: |
Managing to score in turn 8 is the strategy that all your tactics in the preceeding 7 turns are based around. |
I agree about this, just, not all the stallings rely on the preceding 7 turns. Some don't need such careful 7-turn planning due to removals, Guard, Mighty Blow, ST 4+ players.
| Garion wrote: |
If you just want to take turns scoring and brainlessly rolling dice go play dreadball |
If it were possible to play it online I would give it a go, just for the sake of it. That said, I read the rules and I didn't like them. I would not consider it a terrible game, but not good enough either. Hard to say, without actual gameplay test.
| Garion wrote: |
Also if you have no faith in the rules writers - why do you think they'd be able to write a good anti stalling rule that doesn't ruin the game? |
I don't have blind faith in them, but, on the other hand, I liked some of the BB2025 changes (such as D6 MVP nomination, BH back to 50%, the antistalling rock, the 5k cost discount on Elves). Never said never, they could make a decent rule. I'm not a hater on principle, I only hate the bad rules I see. Even a bad game designer could invent a good rule and the other way around.
| Garion wrote: |
The two attempts they've made so far are terribly written rules, and they do not impact experienced coaches and only create feel bad moments for noobs |
The two attempts are the BB2020 Prayer to Nuffle Throw a Rock and the BB2025 5+ Throw a Rock, right?
If are those, yes, I agree they are not great rules, but you seem to trust their game design, not me.
At least, judging by your own words some posts above:
| Garion wrote: |
"Thank god the people that think stalling needs to be "fixed" are nowhere near the game design..." |
I mean, if BB2025 rules added an antistalling Throw a Rock maybe the godlike game designers wanted to discourage a little bit the stalling, didn't they? Otherwise, why should they have made it? We can say it's a bad rule, fair, I might agree about it, but at least they tried. |
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