| Poll |
| Are you looking forward to ELFing on FFB? |
| Yes! |
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87% |
[ 71 ] |
| Depends on how things change. |
|
7% |
[ 6 ] |
| No, never! LRB4 or death! |
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4% |
[ 4 ] |
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| Total Votes : 81 |
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MadTias
Joined: Jun 19, 2004
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 Posted:
Feb 16, 2011 - 21:36 |
 
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| pizzamogul wrote: | | I still want to offer x2 points for Category A match ups. I'm also seriously thinking about offering x2 points for the baseline points only in Category B to encourage playing those races after they've shed their baby teeth and to diminish the value of blowing out a bunch of unmutated mutants. |
Sounds OK.
| pizzamogul wrote: | For Baseline based on TV I'm thinking:
1,000 TV or less - 10 points
for every additional 1-200 of TV - 1 point
so,
0 - 1,000 - 10
1,001-1200 - 11
1201-1400 -12
1401-1600-13
and so on...
This is the TV of your opponent or your ELF team, whichever is less. Does that sound reasonable? Perfect, unbalancing, or somewhere in between |
This is an OK baseline solution, as it encourages higher TV matches. It does have one flaw though: I get the same baseline points for playing Coach Munchkin's TV2000 Killer Chaos with my TV2000 Pro Elves as with my TV2500 Dark Elves. One of those matchups is probably going to be significantly easier.
So I'd like some kind of bonus for playing up in TV, but once we start down that road we might end up with the convoluted scoring system that we used to have and that pizza took steps to dismantle... It's never going to be perfect and I don't have the solution, just bringing it up.
| pizzamogul wrote: | | All other scoring and bonuses to remain the same as last season. |
Great! 
I'd like an addition though: Match in Blackbox= +1 pts.
Why? Because the Ranked coaches will always have the advantage of focusing on the categories where their score is the lowest. This is only important for the competitive coaches that are going for the championship, when simply completing the cycle is not enough. In some categories you have to grind out match after match to get a higher score. That's perfectly possible in Ranked, but not in Blackbox. This is a huge advantage for R teams over B teams in the championship (worth more than +1 pts per match I'd guess). So I'd like to add another incentive to play ELF in the box and make B teams more competitive in the title race. |
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zakatan
Joined: May 17, 2008
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| Posted:
Feb 17, 2011 - 10:50 |
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maybe resurrect also the bonus for R tournaments then |
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Rijssiej
Joined: Jan 04, 2005
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| Posted:
Feb 17, 2011 - 11:53 |
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Was thinking a bit more about using 3 cats of 8 pizza suggested:
A Chaos, Chaos Dwarf, Chaos Pact, Dwarf, Necomantic, Nurgle, Orc, Undead
B Amazon, Human, Khemri, Lizardman, Norse, Skaven, Slann, Vampire
C Dark Elf, Elf, Goblin, Halfling, High Elf, Ogre, Underworld, Wood Elf
Allow 3 games against different races from each group to count.
This makes completing the cycle easier for box teams as there are less restrictions in the cats. |
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pizzamogul
Joined: Jun 13, 2005
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| Posted:
Feb 17, 2011 - 21:12 |
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I like the spread of styles and teams that 5 categories give, but I wouldn't be opposed to discussing a 9-game cycle with 3 matches in 3 categories. I didn't get much interest in that when I mentioned it before.
On the 5 Category front, my latest reshuffling stands at this:
A: Orcs (145), Dwarf (131), CD (112)
B: Chaos (113), Nurgle (92), Pact (89)
C: Necro (96),Undead (87), Khemri (59), Vamps(33)
D: Dark (98),Skaven (67), Slann (47), High Elves(52), Wood (57), Pro (38)
E: Norse (87), Human (69), Lizzies (66), Zons (43), Ogre (32), Underworld (27), 'flings (19), Goblin (18)
A: 388
B: 294
C: 275
D: 359
E: 361
I'm still a bit iffy on E. Are the big 3 in there going to be encountered enough to allow Box teams to easily finish the cycle? Those were basically the anchors in my C with the Strength Access arrangement but Khemri were also in there to offer another potential "frequent" box matchup. |
_________________
"Don't expect mercy."
-Woodstock |
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pizzamogul
Joined: Jun 13, 2005
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| Posted:
Feb 18, 2011 - 18:09 |
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| MadTias wrote: | | I'd like an addition though: Match in Blackbox= +1 pts. |
| zakatan wrote: | | maybe resurrect also the bonus for R tournaments then |
I believe something like this would require Box teams to make a notation in every match report though... right Rijssiej? |
_________________
"Don't expect mercy."
-Woodstock |
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zakatan
Joined: May 17, 2008
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| Posted:
Feb 18, 2011 - 18:13 |
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can't the script just check the division where the game is played? |
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Lakrillo
Joined: Sep 12, 2007
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| Posted:
Feb 18, 2011 - 19:17 |
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I have not played in E.L.F and don't know how to balance it, but when reading this discussion regarding bonuses to higher level teams and also to differences in sizes. What about giving you 10 points bonus for each 10k in spiralling expenses your opponent had for the game + 10 points for the difference between your spirallings.
The SE are noted on the results-page so it should be easy to check. |
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MadTias
Joined: Jun 19, 2004
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| Posted:
Feb 19, 2011 - 10:31 |
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| pizzamogul wrote: | On the 5 Category front, my latest reshuffling stands at this:
A: Orcs (145), Dwarf (131), CD (112)
B: Chaos (113), Nurgle (92), Pact (89)
C: Necro (96),Undead (87), Khemri (59), Vamps(33)
D: Dark (98),Skaven (67), Slann (47), High Elves(52), Wood (57), Pro (38)
E: Norse (87), Human (69), Lizzies (66), Zons (43), Ogre (32), Underworld (27), 'flings (19), Goblin (18)
A: 388
B: 294
C: 275
D: 359
E: 361 |
I like categories with clearly definable characteristics (tough/mutated/undead/fast/the rest), rather than general bashiness, so that's a plus. I'm not so worried about finding Box opponents in E as it has the second highest number of total teams.
Looking at competition rather than distribution, I'm not so happy with C. Khemri and Vamps are "easy" 5-0 targets, while Necro and Undead are more often 2-1 games. Winning C will thus rest on your ability to find Khemri and Vampire opponents at reasonable TV, again hurting the Box coaches. But I'll overlook this to keep the "fluff" categories. Let's give it a spin and see how it works out.
The 3-of-8 idea also has some merit to make life easier for Box coaches. But ELF has always had five categories and tradition counts for something, right? I say try pizza's new distribution and see how that works for the Box. The 3-of-8 would also be even easier for Ranked coaches to pick apart, only playing the 3 easiest races in each category and never having to face any Dorfs or Chaos, f.ex. |
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Mr_Foulscumm
Joined: Mar 05, 2005
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| Posted:
Feb 19, 2011 - 11:11 |
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| MadTias wrote: | | I'm not so happy with C. Khemri and Vamps are "easy" 5-0 targets. |
This sounds very LRB4. I totally agree with you about Khemri being a complete push over for elves (even more so now). I don't agree that Vamps are an easy 5-0 in CRP though. In fact I find them to one of the more annoying teams to face. |
_________________
Everybody's favorite coach on FUMBBL |
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MadTias
Joined: Jun 19, 2004
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| Posted:
Feb 19, 2011 - 13:00 |
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| Mr_Foulscumm wrote: | | MadTias wrote: | | I'm not so happy with C. Khemri and Vamps are "easy" 5-0 targets. |
This sounds very LRB4. I totally agree with you about Khemri being a complete push over for elves (even more so now). I don't agree that Vamps are an easy 5-0 in CRP though. In fact I find them to one of the more annoying teams to face. |
Maybe that has changed for the better then. In that case there is no great problem with the new categories, as Khemri were pushovers in the old categories as well. |
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zakatan
Joined: May 17, 2008
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| Posted:
Feb 19, 2011 - 13:12 |
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vamps properly coached are a real pain. the fact that they don't lose action in OFAB makes them much more dangerous than in lrb4. They suck less rerolls, and more thralls. And suck thralls happily knowing they won't die. |
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pizzamogul
Joined: Jun 13, 2005
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| Posted:
Feb 19, 2011 - 14:04 |
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Thanks for everyone's ideas & feedback. I think I've just about dialed in the changes I want to make for the league to move to LRB6.
Khemri are always going to elves favorite flavor of Cherrylicious. But at least we got them out of the double-points category - they never really belonged there in my humble opinion. And I think Box coaches will run into their fair share of ones that will be equally unable to handle all the blodge.
Also, I don't want to offer any bonus for Box & Tourney matches at this time. Let's see where things shake out after a season of this and then talk about whether or not that is really needed.
One last thing, what to do about stunties, Ogres and Underworlders in Category E. Someone could easily finish that category by playing Ogres and 'flings at the moment (as an example). How does that set with everyone? Should I throw Ogres into the "only one stunty" match counts? What about Underworld?
Please give me some feedback on that. I'm going to get ready to leave town later today, but 1st I'm going to give Rijssiej my requests for the new rules to put into the Java program.
Maybe we can get this thing rolling before too long! |
_________________
"Don't expect mercy."
-Woodstock |
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Astarael
Joined: Aug 14, 2005
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| Posted:
Feb 19, 2011 - 14:34 |
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Stunties is.. different now.
Ogres with 6 Ogres are probably still too dangerous to be classed as stunty, but an easy win. Goblins have completely changed, Flings are about the same. Underworld are pretty much stunties imo. |
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Oh my. |
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Arktoris
Joined: Feb 16, 2004
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| Posted:
Feb 19, 2011 - 16:53 |
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| pizzamogul wrote: | On the 5 Category front, my latest reshuffling stands at this:
A: Orcs (145), Dwarf (131), CD (112)
B: Chaos (113), Nurgle (92), Pact (89)
C: Necro (96),Undead (87), Khemri (59), Vamps(33)
D: Dark (9 ,Skaven (67), Slann (47), High Elves(52), Wood (57), Pro (3
E: Norse (87), Human (69), Lizzies (66), Zons (43), Ogre (32), Underworld (27), 'flings (19), Goblin (1
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Looks pretty good. cat A is the muscle and tackle. CatB is the chaos category Cat C is the undead category Cat D finese CatE stunties and humans.
nice theme.
ok, ready to play!!! |
_________________
Hail to Manowar! The latest charioteer to DIE for bloodbowl! - Slain, by Ghor Oggaz |
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zakatan
Joined: May 17, 2008
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| Posted:
Feb 19, 2011 - 17:02 |
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| Astarael wrote: | Stunties is.. different now.
Ogres with 6 Ogres are probably still too dangerous to be classed as stunty, but an easy win. Goblins have completely changed, Flings are about the same. Underworld are pretty much stunties imo. |
underworld can get pretty dangerous...
http://fumbbl.com/FUMBBL.php?page=team&op=view&team_id=641741
-10 cas difference after 51 games in the box, with a team of goblins and skaven is something you should consider almost as a bashy team |
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