bghandras
Joined: Feb 06, 2011
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Dec 22, 2015 - 16:35 |
 
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"After the feedback I've had another go at the Nurgle. They're now more similar to their current roster. I think they'll find bashing just as easy as they do now, but should find winning harder (and keeping ball-carriers alive). I decided against dropping the G access for the warriors in the end, but removed it from the Rotters so they're an M access only player. This should bring the mutations more into play and make them more interesting. "
I can still see only G access on rotters. |
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mister__joshua
Joined: Jun 20, 2007
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Yeah, they're the same footprint/base but it still feels weird to me. I'm not as sure about WHFB lore as I am DnD, but in the latter Pegasi are animal intelligence. Bull Centaurs are half humanoid. A pegasus feels like having rats on a Skaven team. Some people would be fine with that. Maybe you disagree but it's not my preference  |
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mister__joshua
Joined: Jun 20, 2007
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| bghandras wrote: | "After the feedback I've had another go at the Nurgle. They're now more similar to their current roster. I think they'll find bashing just as easy as they do now, but should find winning harder (and keeping ball-carriers alive). I decided against dropping the G access for the warriors in the end, but removed it from the Rotters so they're an M access only player. This should bring the mutations more into play and make them more interesting. "
I can still see only G access on rotters. |
Oops, forgot to update after I'd edited. Try now |
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NerdBird
Joined: Apr 08, 2014
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Dec 22, 2015 - 16:51 |
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| mister__joshua wrote: | | Yeah, they're the same footprint/base but it still feels weird to me. I'm not as sure about WHFB lore as I am DnD, but in the latter Pegasi are animal intelligence. Bull Centaurs are half humanoid. A pegasus feels like having rats on a Skaven team. Some people would be fine with that. Maybe you disagree but it's not my preference |
In WHFB they are intelligent, magical creatures and Elves ride them. In reality they probably wouldn't have Boner but I don't think that would fit with the game mechanics. I just think to make the game more "fun" every team should have some Biggie that fits within their fluff. I can't see Elves allowing an Ogre on their team. Maybe Pro Elves but their entire look really turns me off anyway. |
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sheepycollins
Joined: Sep 21, 2015
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Dec 22, 2015 - 16:56 |
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| mister__joshua wrote: | | Yeah, they're the same footprint/base but it still feels weird to me. I'm not as sure about WHFB lore as I am DnD, but in the latter Pegasi are animal intelligence. Bull Centaurs are half humanoid. A pegasus feels like having rats on a Skaven team. Some people would be fine with that. Maybe you disagree but it's not my preference |
That's kind of my point they're steeds not half human, intelligence has little to do with it, but on that note the dark elf roster should get the hydra
4528 wild animal, claw, two heads, foul appearance, prehensile tail, regeneration 130k (no loner as that's the running theme)
I get what you're saying about NOS but as they are the fastest of the elven foot soldiers maybe take a leaf out of our dark brethren and have a combined role? 7348 pro, NOS GAP / S 100k maybe 90k? |
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sheepycollins
Joined: Sep 21, 2015
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Dec 22, 2015 - 17:00 |
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Ooh though high elf Griffin?
5548 wild animal, claw leap no hands 110k
I know that sounds cheap but av8, no Mighty blow or frenzy just simple deadly creatures |
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Things I like and things I hate? I don't feel like telling you that. My dreams for the future? Never really thought about that. As for my hobbies... I have lots of hobbies. |
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bghandras
Joined: Feb 06, 2011
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Dec 22, 2015 - 17:07 |
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Now ok, i can see the mutation access. |
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Uedder
Joined: Aug 03, 2010
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Dec 22, 2015 - 17:18 |
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I like your changes, but I think Nurgle is now too much nerfed. Basically impossible to build a team. |
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mister__joshua
Joined: Jun 20, 2007
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| kilinrax wrote: | | mister__joshua wrote: | | One positive is that you've inspired me to give mine another visit, and I've added some rules changes that I'd previously steered away from. They're here if you wanted to take a look, and the thread is a little way down this page |
Each time I read this, it gets better. Bravo.
EDIT: Still not sure I'd play a Chaos Dwarf roster though, without M access. Though I salute the removal of tacklespam. |
Thanks for that kilinrax, it's appreciated. Sorry I've quoted this from another topic but I thought it was better to put it here than subvert a thread.
I've renamed the topic, edited Nurgle again (I just can't seem to be happy with them, though it's better now I think) and I've also added what I think are the most pressing or fun rules changes that I'd like to implement. This is outside of the original brief, but all other LRB7 topics included them so I thought I'd give it a go. It's only really initial thoughts at the moment.
I'm hoping to try the rosters out in Tabletop sometime.
Cheers! |
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kilinrax
Joined: Jan 12, 2015
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Mar 14, 2016 - 14:45 |
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| mister__joshua wrote: | | Thanks for that kilinrax, it's appreciated. Sorry I've quoted this from another topic but I thought it was better to put it here than subvert a thread. |
Didn't spot your reply until now - you're welcome. I much prefer the majority of these rosters to their originals.
| mister__joshua wrote: | | I've renamed the topic, edited Nurgle again (I just can't seem to be happy with them, though it's better now I think) |
Out of curiosity - what's the thinking behind Nurgle still having blanket normal-roll M access, when Chaos only now have it on doubles, and Cdorfs only on the Mino?
| mister__joshua wrote: | | I'm hoping to try the rosters out in Tabletop sometime. |
I'd be really curious to playtest the new High Elf roster, looks far less dull than the rulebook version. |
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bghandras
Joined: Feb 06, 2011
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Mar 14, 2016 - 15:04 |
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This is getting better and better. I would like to make 2 small suggestions though
1. Make the plaguabearer 4, 6 feels too much with ueber-zombies. The new rotters are basically quicker and more agile zombies, this is the most resilient team by far.
2. Khemri needs help. Feels to be a weak roster. Consider increasing the blitz-ra to 4 instead of 2. Or consider decreasing the agility of the skeleton, and also its price. Potentially removing thick skull if that is needed to get the price further down. |
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mister__joshua
Joined: Jun 20, 2007
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| kilinrax wrote: | | Out of curiosity - what's the thinking behind Nurgle still having blanket normal-roll M access, when Chaos only now have it on doubles, and Cdorfs only on the Mino? |
I originally removed the M access from Nurgle so that there were 2 teams with mutations as a theme, Pact and Underworld. The M access also has less of an impact on those 2 I feel. Nurgle without the M access felt a bit wrong though. I think part of what makes them so powerful is that they are better than Chaos across the board: Once developed Nurgle Warriors are better (regen plus other useful skill instead of an AG and a MA), Pestis the same (identical but with regen), the Beast is better than a Mino, and even Rotters are better than extra redundant Horns in a lot of situations (fouling for cheap TV etc). I think Nurgle are the one that has to change.
Chaos lost M access on normals because from a fluff perspective they don't mutate that much. It only gave them access to claws. Warriors and Beastmen in WHFB don't all have claws. They only had M access on doubles in previous editions so I think it works better. Pact are humans with 'gifts' so I think the M works better there (IMO, not everyones). CDorfs I don't think need M access. Their main game should be their Centaurs and Blockers (which are still nasty players). I don't think the M added a lot, and I don't remember mutant dwarves being a big thing in the old CDorf fluff.
Nurgle though I think needed the M access back. I wanted to change the way they played so my idea was to remove the Pestigors. This was based on a theory by Harad I think that the Pestis were what really made Nurgle strong at high TV. So now they can bash good but struggle to win. I gave the rotters Regen instead of Decay as without it they had no hope of building even a passable ballcarrier (as they'll be relying on rotters for this now).
Nurgle though, along with Ogres, are the rosters I've struggled with the most.
| bghandras wrote: | This is getting better and better. I would like to make 2 small suggestions though
1. Make the plaguabearer 4, 6 feels too much with ueber-zombies. The new rotters are basically quicker and more agile zombies, this is the most resilient team by far.
2. Khemri needs help. Feels to be a weak roster. Consider increasing the blitz-ra to 4 instead of 2. Or consider decreasing the agility of the skeleton, and also its price. Potentially removing thick skull if that is needed to get the price further down. |
4 Plaguebearers could work, but I weren't sure if this would be seen as an over-nerf. I'm not against the idea though.
I quite like the Khemri. Their 8 best players all regen now, and the skeletons have already lost 10k of value making them excellent (the best) foulers. I think reducing it further would make them too cheap. They only cost as much as halflings currently 
I've expanded and colour-coded the rules changes now to make them easier to read. |
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Diddyboy
Joined: Dec 29, 2007
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Mar 14, 2016 - 18:50 |
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As a humancoach i must say that to gain one strenght and lose one movement on catchers is not the way i would go. Either raise the armor to 8 or the agility to 4. The changes you propose streamline the roster abit to much |
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mister__joshua
Joined: Jun 20, 2007
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| Diddyboy wrote: | | As a humancoach i must say that to gain one strenght and lose one movement on catchers is not the way i would go. Either raise the armor to 8 or the agility to 4. The changes you propose streamline the roster abit to much |
I thought about the humans a lot as it's a hot topic but I'm happy with the change. The reason I went for this one was precedence. There are several teams containing Humans and they have a very similar profile. Their base is 6337, +1 AV for armoured players, +1 Move for faster players. There aren't any other Move 8 or Str 2 humans so this felt like the outlier. By making them 7337 they represent the fastest and lightest armoured of humanity, but are a lot more versatile that their 8237 currently.
If I was going to change the current edit at all I'd be tempted to drop them to 0-2 but I'm not sure this is necessary. |
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Reisender
Joined: Sep 29, 2007
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Mar 19, 2016 - 15:53 |
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hey, first of all i wanna say i really like your take on a LRB7. I may not agree with all, but i really like most of the changes esp. on the rosters. I was thinking about creating a LRB7 but i agree with so much id rather give feedbakc here atm.
I may put more suggestions after thinking it through a bit longer, but here is some for now
Goblins: You considered giving them all dp but i agrre with not doing it. Would you consider giving them 1 kicker from the Goblin cheater stunty roster (for 60k i guess)? I really like the desing of this player, and having kick/dp would fit with gobbos, boost them slightly (but they are still gobbos) and make up for the lack of G access a bit. Also i think the pogoer could get G access.
Skills:
- i think the mighty blow +1av and injury will turn out too strong, especially with the improved fouling - i see the need for keeping attrition coming but there must be another way, although i dont see it now - but it should involve spending another skill, otherwise dwarves will just be monsters...
- i think some skills are too weak and i would love to see them get a bit better for more skill variety
so here are 2 ideas: Pass Block and Kick-off Return merge to new skill Anticipation -> gives you both the skills (G cause khemri and dwarves still need access) (still to be considered with your new passing rules which i havent fully thought through)
Diving Catch gives +1 on catching hand-offs too -> makes it a skill worth considering (which counterintuitively will also lead to more passing play as you cant always handoff), gives ag3 passing teams a real skill to simulate ag4 partly, and is still different enough from extra arms, and it makes slann a little bit better |
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