PainState
Joined: Apr 04, 2007
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 Posted:
Sep 07, 2016 - 18:56 |
 
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| almic85 wrote: | Hi Painstate, I understand that box is the only division that hard codes who you play based on TV and that it will be heavily affected by any change to TV calculation, but do you honestly not consider TV at all when accepting a game in ranked division? If it is something you refer to, even briefly, to select an opponent then it is relevant to ranked.
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Well, you have to understand my main team the Blood Sea Buccaneers, who I play the vast majority of my matches in ranked with are sitting at #53 right now in terms of TV, sitting at 2510 TV. On that list almost 40-45 of them are old teams that are lingering from the LRB conversion. So it is very possible my team is in the top 10 highest TV teams in Ranked.
So, I do not consider TV at all, I cant. The only think I consider is do I want to play another Uber CPOMB monster or Orc team or wait around and see if I can get some other match, I will play literally any one. Most of the time i just green light the entire board and see what happens. Which usually means I sit around for 30 minutes and no one accepts my match offer.
I then kick the dirt my Humans are to tough and go activate in the box.
Now you have to understand one thing about me when discussing Ranked play. I do not care about winning or my CR. I just want to play and have fun. The vast majority of the time regardless of which of my ranked teams I have on GF I will be making match offers left and right. I do not sit around hoping some cherry offers me a match and off I go. I will take on almost any team on the GF, doubly so if they are going to give me 200,000+ inducements.
Yes, some times I have that urge and will track down a heavy hitting team locked and loaded with CPOMB or MB/PO. It makes the game more fun actually. Not for my pixels but for me.
Also my Legendary Ogre needs to collect some CPOMB scalps from time to time, keeps him in shape. Do not want him to go soft and curl up into a ball, crying to mama when we enter the next Ranked major and have to take on a nasty Chaos/Nurgle/CD team.
So, long winded way of saying, I really do not take TV into account the majority of times Iam offering games on GF. I only take into account do I feel like taking on another Orc team who seem to reproduce faster than Snotlings on the GF. |
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bigbullies
Joined: Feb 20, 2015
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Sep 07, 2016 - 20:54 |
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You should all come over to keggies rainbow topic its a far better waste of time than this one |
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PainState
Joined: Apr 04, 2007
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Sep 07, 2016 - 22:05 |
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| bigbullies wrote: | | You should all come over to keggies rainbow topic its a far better waste of time than this one |
Well, I think we have moved on to the Min/Max thread and then once that starts to slow down we will finish off in the CPOMB thread and then pass out. |
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mrt1212
Joined: Feb 26, 2013
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Sep 07, 2016 - 23:12 |
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| PainState wrote: | | almic85 wrote: | Hi Painstate, I understand that box is the only division that hard codes who you play based on TV and that it will be heavily affected by any change to TV calculation, but do you honestly not consider TV at all when accepting a game in ranked division? If it is something you refer to, even briefly, to select an opponent then it is relevant to ranked.
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Well, you have to understand my main team the Blood Sea Buccaneers, who I play the vast majority of my matches in ranked with are sitting at #53 right now in terms of TV, sitting at 2510 TV. On that list almost 40-45 of them are old teams that are lingering from the LRB conversion. So it is very possible my team is in the top 10 highest TV teams in Ranked.
So, I do not consider TV at all, I cant. The only think I consider is do I want to play another Uber CPOMB monster or Orc team or wait around and see if I can get some other match, I will play literally any one. Most of the time i just green light the entire board and see what happens. Which usually means I sit around for 30 minutes and no one accepts my match offer.
I then kick the dirt my Humans are to tough and go activate in the box.
Now you have to understand one thing about me when discussing Ranked play. I do not care about winning or my CR. I just want to play and have fun. The vast majority of the time regardless of which of my ranked teams I have on GF I will be making match offers left and right. I do not sit around hoping some cherry offers me a match and off I go. I will take on almost any team on the GF, doubly so if they are going to give me 200,000+ inducements.
Yes, some times I have that urge and will track down a heavy hitting team locked and loaded with CPOMB or MB/PO. It makes the game more fun actually. Not for my pixels but for me.
Also my Legendary Ogre needs to collect some CPOMB scalps from time to time, keeps him in shape. Do not want him to go soft and curl up into a ball, crying to mama when we enter the next Ranked major and have to take on a nasty Chaos/Nurgle/CD team.
So, long winded way of saying, I really do not take TV into account the majority of times Iam offering games on GF. I only take into account do I feel like taking on another Orc team who seem to reproduce faster than Snotlings on the GF. |
Painstate, I need to build up some of my ranked elves and humans so we can wrassle. |
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Rbthma
Joined: Jan 14, 2009
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Sep 08, 2016 - 00:05 |
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| PainState wrote: | | bigbullies wrote: | | You should all come over to keggies rainbow topic its a far better waste of time than this one |
Well, I think we have moved on to the Min/Max thread and then once that starts to slow down we will finish off in the CPOMB thread and then pass out. |
It's like a night of hard drinking at several different establishments- by the end of the night it turns into one long blur. Funny that the CPOMB thread hasn't been so active lately but we end up talking about it in many other threads. Honestly, I'm starting to get confused as to which thread is which  |
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Cavetroll
Joined: Jan 21, 2009
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Sep 08, 2016 - 00:54 |
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I wonder if this thread will hit 20 pages before being locked... |
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fidius
Joined: Jun 17, 2011
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Sep 08, 2016 - 07:15 |
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The purpose of Christer's LRB4 TS model was to improve fairness of upcoming matchups by adjusting for things TR did not.
The purpose of plasmoid's Narrow Tier Blood Bowl house rules is to make more teams and strategies competitive through the mid- and long-term.
Are these different things?
I don't know about you guys, but I'm not so interested in "fairer" matchups, I'm more interested in minimizing uninteresting games and power-gamer abuse. People appear to confuse these. I see how TS can help with the first, but it can't fix the second imo. |
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Mr_Foulscumm
Joined: Mar 05, 2005
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Sep 08, 2016 - 07:23 |
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Just activate. It's the solution to most Box issues. The more coaches that acivate, the better the odds for a good draw. |
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coombz
Joined: Oct 12, 2010
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Sep 08, 2016 - 08:20 |
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| thoralf wrote: |
I won't play both sides in a game to solve a complex of problems that is not mine, in a game where the main instigator has yet to play his very first move. |
does this mean you're going to stop posting? ;o
that would be lovely |
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They found 10 grams, seized my whip and took my knife...
That's Trailer Park Life. |
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ramchop
Joined: Oct 12, 2013
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List of problems within Forum Divisions
First page of each "Division" has 50 posts:
Black Box: 11 problems posts
Ranked: 4 problems posts
Stunty: 2 problems posts
League: Bliss 
Solution seems clear to me. |
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Wreckage
Joined: Aug 15, 2004
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Sep 08, 2016 - 09:25 |
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I just wanted to write something snarky about how League is the smallest division but look at that... Introduction of custom rosters has catapulted league on par with ranked games! |
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thoralf
Joined: Mar 06, 2008
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Sep 08, 2016 - 15:04 |
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Took some time, but Step 1 is with us. |
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Desultory
Joined: Jun 24, 2008
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Sep 08, 2016 - 15:48 |
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| Wreckage wrote: |
You can hardly say the scheduler is the problem when 90% of the time you just get scheduled into an unfavorable match because there aren't any other matchups. |
You can; if the reason there aren't many match ups is BECAUSE of the scheduler. Though the real problem is not the scheduler in itself, but because TV is a poor calculation for actual team value, and consequent matching/inducements problems arise (in all dvisions, but less so in divisions where one selects opponents [ranked]).
| PainState wrote: | My final thought on this.
There is one huge issue with TS.
Chister can change up the scheduler and re introduce a form of TS into it. The problem is inducements will always be calculated using TV because that is hard coded into the system of Fantasy Football.
So, even if you agree with me that TS should be used to calculate the inducement value for the match it can only get done by adding it into the clients code. Which all of us by now should know that is a fantasy dream world.
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Was TS used for inducement calculation in LRB4? |
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Balle2000
Joined: Sep 25, 2008
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Sep 08, 2016 - 15:54 |
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TR was used for handicap rolls (the lrb4 inducement system) and to determine winnings.
TS was used to determine tournament entries, possible match-ups and box scheduling.
I.e. TS didn't interfere with the rules of the game, only the site rules. |
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PainState
Joined: Apr 04, 2007
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Sep 08, 2016 - 16:24 |
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| Desultory wrote: | You can; if the reason there aren't many match ups is BECAUSE of the scheduler. Though the real problem is not the scheduler in itself, but because TV is a poor calculation for actual team value, and consequent matching/inducements problems arise (in all dvisions, but less so in divisions where one selects opponents [ranked]).
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Hold on for minute. Lets put the parameters that the scheduler makes match ups with on the side for a moment.
This goes back to the old computer saying of junk in then you get junk back out.
IF you only have 4 coaches activated and 2 of them have only put forth one team. That is called junk in. Then the scheduler makes the matches and you get junk out with 2 matches that are highly questionable most of the time for 2 teams.
Anybody who has played any amount of time in the Box knows exactly what Iam talking about. We all have our own Box scheduler horror stories.
Bottom line for me is that the scheduler works just fine if you have 4-10 coaches who have activated and all of them put forth at least 3 teams. Ideal scenario would be high/mid/low TV teams. That way the entire range of teams can be picked. If this happened then the discussion of mis matches in the Box would decrease big time.
As the previous pages have shown, some say force coaches to put forth more teams into the scheduler and some coaches scream that by reducing a coaches choice, that is just un fair.
What is interesting to me is that both camps will agree on the key point. If every coach put forth 3+ teams into the hopper it would make it work so much better. |
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