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Poll
Which team's roster has improved the most?
Chaos Chosen
0%
 0%  [ 0 ]
Human
28%
 28%  [ 11 ]
Tomb Kings
7%
 7%  [ 3 ]
Orc
2%
 2%  [ 1 ]
Skaven
5%
 5%  [ 2 ]
Underworld
31%
 31%  [ 12 ]
Another team
23%
 23%  [ 9 ]
Total Votes : 38


mister__joshua



Joined: Jun 20, 2007

Post   Posted: Aug 13, 2020 - 20:33
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Garion wrote:
P.s. the more I think about necromantic the more i think they have also been buffed, possibly just not in season 1.


I play Necro a lot at the minute and have a team in a current tabletop league, so I was most intrigued by their roster. I’m not sure it’s a buff, but it’s a change.

The price increases hurt your available options at 1000TV which is why you mentioned them not being great 1st season.

The main change is in how you have to use the players. The Wights losing their hands means I’ll have to do more handling with the wolves, who I currently like to hit with. Sidestep also makes the Wraiths prime for Guard, which I’d traditionally put on the Golems. Ghouls are primary ball carriers, but are fragile. You only have 4 players able to handle the ball now, so recovery could be tough. It’s an interesting change for sure.

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Diablange



Joined: Apr 27, 2020

Post   Posted: Aug 16, 2020 - 11:22 Reply with quote Back to top

Grod wrote:

I think the impact of jump rules are underestimated and they will heavily favour high agility teams, particuarly elves and vampires (if they come back).

I might think the same here.

Jumping over unconscious players isn't new, this is a special rule that was introduced in the second edition, in the death zone companion. Only at that time a jumped over tile cost 3 instead of 1, but here again, favors high mobility teams of course.

I regret some changes in skills, also, not sure it will have the desired effect (such as the already long debated break tackle...).

We'll see... Smile
Niessuh



Joined: Dec 11, 2009

Post   Posted: Aug 16, 2020 - 13:52 Reply with quote Back to top

The new break tackle is great on ST 3 players with S skill access. One 2+ dodge now. Combine with 3+ pro, you get more mobile blitzers that are also inmune to tackle.

Zons blitzers (if unchanged) becomes cheap wardancers with break tackle.

With this, without the claw + MB combo, with the same good roster as always, with fumblerooskie to run the ball faster, with longbeards just rolling cheap random ST skill ups... Dwarfs are the uncontested kings of the hill now.

In fact, when I will not be playing with them, I will design my team about playing against them
Dominik



Joined: Oct 29, 2004

Post   Posted: Aug 16, 2020 - 15:11 Reply with quote Back to top

Who are you?
Lyracian



Joined: Oct 29, 2015

Post   Posted: Nov 02, 2020 - 21:41 Reply with quote Back to top

Muff2n wrote:
Which of the existing rosters have done well out of the update?

Thank you for the rundown.

Muff2n wrote:
Orcs: Irrelevant thrower changes. Black orcs get +Mv for 10k. Amazing!

My first thought seeing Animosity was yuck! No more Orc team. On reflection however I think it is just death of the Thrower for the team. Line Orc and BoB (should that be BuB now) can both hand off, or pass [with lineman] if desperate, to a Blitzer. That means it is only the Blitzers who are going to not share. Finally Goblins are as good at passing as Linemen and Blitzers so Troll ball may be the answer for short drives.

Muff2n wrote:
Necromantic: All the positionals increased by 5k, but I think the new wraiths are great. Yes, no hands limits ball handling options (which will give this team real character), but gaining FA and SS is great. Add guard for a very annoying player.

I love the Wraith concept but three players to handle the ball kills the team for me. I always prefered Necro to Undead for a League because you could easily get Block on Golems and Wolves are just better Ghouls. Now that Str 5 Mummy can just learn Block. With shorter life expectancy that starting MB will get them to skill up faster.


Muff2n wrote:
Nurgle: Rotters are -5k but lost an agility. I think this is a slightly bad trade, but not very important. The cost changes to the positionals will balance out.

My first thought was they had got a boost with cheaper Rotters especially now Decay is just a Niggle. They are now just bad Zombies (or should that be Skeletons since they can pass). Ball Handling Rotters are no more.

Muff2n wrote:
Renegades: Lost P access on linemen, that's a big hit. And they've lost S access too.
They needed to lose Str access they were too good. Shame about Pass access at it would have opened up some options as the only team left with easy access to P skills outside of dedicated throwers. I always wanted to build the Prehensile Tail Team but now it no longer stacks there is no point. Glad I already played them in a League do not think I will be going back to them for a while...
Java



Joined: Jan 27, 2018

Post   Posted: Nov 02, 2020 - 23:01 Reply with quote Back to top

Thanks for the rundown. I agree with a lot of it.

Regarding renegades, there is something to be said for a rat ogre that always does what you want as long as he can snack on the cheap orc lino. In addition to that, we got one positional (the thrower) closer to being able to play a team with 11 fully different players, if you include two stars.
In the past, I could only do it at Titanbowl (TT tournament using the new Giant rules, giving you a free giant per team) and even then I had Bomber on, who is 60k.

Speaking of stars, anybody who can take hakflem probably will, as those teams have generally limited OTT capabilities.

For regular development tho I see Renegades suffering a lot. The cookie cutter lino was a bit too much to be fair. There will be a way to run them, just not as easily.
Niessuh



Joined: Dec 11, 2009

Post   Posted: Nov 03, 2020 - 10:00 Reply with quote Back to top

The best option with the renegades limemen is just to give them block (or wrestle) and then dump SPP into getting some cheap +AV

The big improvement for renegades is that big guys are now reliable and competitive. Could get brawler as primary and the improved Pro as secondary skill.

The new Pro is awesome for big guys. You get a 3+ RR for all the useful stuff: blocking, penalty skills, throwing team mate, breaking tackle...you could even try to pick the ball!
Muff2n



Joined: May 20, 2017

Post   Posted: Nov 13, 2020 - 11:15 Reply with quote Back to top

Updated with the other rosters. And a poll. Yay!


Last edited by Muff2n on Nov 13, 2020 - 11:43; edited 1 time in total
Java



Joined: Jan 27, 2018

Post   Posted: Nov 13, 2020 - 11:32 Reply with quote Back to top

How many teams can now sport a frenzy big guy and have a gutter runner or induce Hakflem Skuttlespike?

Chorfs, Underworld, Chosen, Renegades, Skaven... seems like we'll be having a lot more oneturning than before even with the loss of MA10 freaks

4 out of 5 of them even have Animal Savagery option, over the Unchannelled Wild Animal Fury, so not even a 1 can screw it up. Get juggs, do stuff. Yes, Animal Savagery is a good rule, and I will FIGHT you over it Very Happy Razz Laughing

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Mattius



Joined: Sep 03, 2006

Post   Posted: Nov 13, 2020 - 11:37 Reply with quote Back to top

Winners seem to be the little guys.

Dwarf teams and stunty teams!

Dwarfs it is quite obvious as to why.

Stunties is largely as they had no price increases, better inducements/stars, improved throw team mate and more predictable skill choices for key players.

Their only issue is they will end up facing more dwarfs...
Lyracian



Joined: Oct 29, 2015

Post   Posted: Nov 13, 2020 - 12:03 Reply with quote Back to top

Landing did get harder but I agree looking forward to playing more Goblins and Halflings.

From reading the rules I do not think I will play Necro or Nurgle again. Will move to Undead and standard Choas. Slap tentacles on an Ogre or Troll and have a few random mutations to build up interesting beast men.

I might also finally find myself playing Dwarves...

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Muff2n



Joined: May 20, 2017

Post   Posted: Nov 13, 2020 - 12:10 Reply with quote Back to top

Mattius wrote:
Winners seem to be the little guys.

Dwarf teams and stunty teams!

Dwarfs it is quite obvious as to why.

Stunties is largely as they had no price increases, better inducements/stars, improved throw team mate and more predictable skill choices for key players.

Their only issue is they will end up facing more dwarfs...


Yes Dwarfs might be in a good position, all rule changes considered. But this is about the rosters only. The dwarf roster got strictly worse (unless you value +2 dirty player on the roller so much that you'll now bring the thing).
Mattius



Joined: Sep 03, 2006

Post   Posted: Nov 13, 2020 - 13:37 Reply with quote Back to top

Lyracian wrote:
Landing did get harder but I agree looking forward to playing more Goblins and Halflings.

From reading the rules I do not think I will play Necro or Nurgle again. Will move to Undead and standard Choas. Slap tentacles on an Ogre or Troll and have a few random mutations to build up interesting beast men.

I might also finally find myself playing Dwarves...


Necro just from a style perspective?

I ask as I think Necro look very strong in BB2020. Blodge SS Wights combined with standfirm Flesh Golems are going to be a nightmare.
Lyracian



Joined: Oct 29, 2015

Post   Posted: Nov 13, 2020 - 14:04 Reply with quote Back to top

Mattius wrote:

Necro just from a style perspective?

I ask as I think Necro look very strong in BB2020. Blodge SS Wights combined with standfirm Flesh Golems are going to be a nightmare.

More for the ball handling. My usual set up only leaves 3 players with AG 3 ball handling. Skeletons can long bomb the ball but Zombies can not. Having stolen the ball sometimes all you need it to get it away from where your opponent is.

Also Mummy can now get easy block which had been a big plus for Golems before. I think Undead will have a better performace in a league.
gamelsetlmatch



Joined: Mar 05, 2013

Post   Posted: Nov 13, 2020 - 14:54 Reply with quote Back to top

I have a funny feeling that the Khemri coaches are just sitting back laughing at all the plotting and scheming going on with all the other races while they dont get very much mention or consideration ..They might not have had very much say in past majors but they have such a natural sweet spot at low team value

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