| Poll |
| Is BB20 really a problem? |
| Yes. |
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18% |
[ 29 ] |
| I miss CLAWPOMB. |
|
10% |
[ 16 ] |
| Dwarfs still like it. |
|
14% |
[ 22 ] |
| Game should use 1d8 instead of 1d6. |
|
9% |
[ 15 ] |
| I've left fumbbl since the update and didn't even read this. |
|
7% |
[ 12 ] |
| Throw Team Mate is bugged. |
|
3% |
[ 5 ] |
| I will always find a way to minmax! |
|
11% |
[ 18 ] |
| Pie. |
|
24% |
[ 38 ] |
|
| Total Votes : 155 |
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MattDakka
Joined: Oct 09, 2007
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 Posted:
Jun 16, 2022 - 13:52 |
 
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About multiple rr: I think that it makes the game worse, mostly. There are some borderline situations where it helps to "average out" dice and some teams start without core skills, that is its positive aspect, but when an unlikely action is made through a volley of rrs then the quality of the game is lowered (exception: tier 3 teams, they need some help when trying risky action).
A compromise could have been this: you can use more than 1 rr per turn IF the result on the dice would cause a turnover.
So, for example, if you start a turn with double skull you can rr it, then if you roll another double skull later on the same turn you can rr it (this is a positive multiple rr because it just helps to average out the dice). You can't rr any other result which would not cause a turnover. So if you try to sack the ball carrier on the turn where you already used a rr and roll double push you can't rr that (but if you try to sack the ball carrier as first action you could, and this would add a strategic layer to the order of actions, which rewards coach's skill). Currently, with multiple rr, the order you make the actions is less important than in older rulesets.
Another option could be allowing only tier 3 teams (which lack core skills and generally heavily rely on risky actions) to use multiple rr. Tier 3 teams need some boost to perform their stunts.
My only concern could be the TTM: maybe the multiple rr should be forbidden in that sequence, like this:
if you declare a TTM action and you don't have used a rr for that turn yet, you can use 1 rr. If you already used a rr BEFORE the TTM declaration you can't use it for the TTM sequence (starting with the Big Guy activation and on). |
Last edited by MattDakka on %b %16, %2022 - %20:%Jun; edited 1 time in total |
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koadah
Joined: Mar 30, 2005
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| Posted:
Jun 16, 2022 - 14:20 |
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No need to complicate it. Just a simple option. Multiple RRs per turn allowed or not.
Similarly, wildly inaccurate applied or not.
Though we prioritise complying with the official rules, the wildly inaccurate fix at least, probably has more value than the endless rounds of additions GW keeps putting out. It probably shouldn't delay them too much.  |
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O[L]C 2016 Swiss! - April ---- All Star Bowl - Teams of Stars - 2 more teams needed |
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Garion26
Joined: Nov 28, 2021
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| Posted:
Jun 16, 2022 - 19:03 |
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| JanMattys wrote: |
I can't believe you never met Bomber Driddlesnot. I met him about five times in my 13 game so far in our League. |
My last tabletop league finished in November.
I've played with him a bit on FUMBBL in C with my goblins and once I think with my ogres.
I don't think I've ever had an opponent induce him on FUMBBL and in BB16 I don't think I played against him in tournament play.
He seems minimally changed from his CRP/BB16 incarnation.
I love bombers in general but in my experience using him (and yet to play against him) I don't think he's broken or over prevalent. There aren't a lot of 50K and under inducements - sometimes a babe isn't a great choice. |
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MrCushtie
Joined: Aug 10, 2018
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| Posted:
Jun 16, 2022 - 19:08 |
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Bomber has PA 3+ whereas a regular gobbo bomma now has PA 4+ (so worse compared to 2016 when a vanilla gobbo passed on a 3+). But as Bomber has Accurate, he's doing 2+ bombs at short range. He's 5k more than a regular bomma, so much more cost efficient for goblin teams. So I think it's less that Bomber changed, as regular bommas got worse (excluding the extra lethality/turnover proofing of bombs in this edition).
Bomber also got cheaper (from 60k to 50k) so now he's more available for inducements. I'm honestly surprised you haven't seen him more on Fumbbl - I use him whenever I possibly can now |
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Nelphine
Joined: Apr 01, 2011
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| Posted:
Jun 16, 2022 - 19:13 |
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the other big change is that he's available to other teams - like orcs - which wasn't the case in 2016 |
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MattDakka
Joined: Oct 09, 2007
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| Posted:
Jun 16, 2022 - 19:47 |
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Yes, he's a sort of very cheap mini-Wizard. Bombs are more dangerous in BB2020, with the +1 modifier.
And yes, he can be hired by more races now. I played as Undead vs Skaven who induced him (I didn't expect they could hire him) and he was really annoying. A good (or even scattered) blast can disrupt a cage and Gutter Runners can easily steal the ball.
About his price: yes, he's just 10k cheaper, but consider that now Inducements don't require to hire a Star Player by fully paying him, you can just bridge the gap and if the TVs are close the opponent could not even get a Prayer roll (not that Prayers are super useful, by the way).
In old rules you had to spend 60k all from your gold, if the TV gap was lower than 60. |
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JanMattys
Joined: Feb 29, 2004
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| Posted:
Jun 16, 2022 - 20:01 |
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It is also much harder now to intercept the bombs and pass them back. |
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Java
Joined: Jan 27, 2018
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| Posted:
Jun 16, 2022 - 20:04 |
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deflecting is easier, 5+ compared to 6+
stunty throwers are deflected/intercepted more easily now
you actually hope not to catch the deflection, most of the times |
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Vlad Von Carstein's door-to-door evangelist |
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JackassRampant
Joined: Feb 26, 2011
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| Posted:
Jun 16, 2022 - 20:41 |
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| MrCushtie wrote: | | (so worse compared to 2016 when a vanilla gobbo passed on a 3+). |
That's never been the case. Stunty, at least from 3rd edition through BB2016, gave a -1 penalty on passes, and now it doesn't. If there is no interference, they are as good as passing now as they have been since the '90s.
At first, I was afraid that the new skill system would sap all the special out of the game, but then I got my hands on a Block, Stand Firm High Elf Lineman for 100k. He's getting a random Agility skill next, cuz there are so many good ones for him: Dodge, Diving Tackle, Jump Up, Defensive, Side Step, Sure Feet... all at 16 SPP and +40k TV add. And if I roll something less cool, then he's still a good value, if a little tarnished.
So much drama. Nicely replaces "can I get doubles?" |
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Lude enixe, obliviscatur timor. |
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Garion26
Joined: Nov 28, 2021
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| Posted:
Jun 17, 2022 - 20:41 |
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| MrCushtie wrote: | | I'm honestly surprised you haven't seen him more on Fumbbl - I use him whenever I possibly can now |
(As noted by Jackass Rampant other bombardiers are unchanged and deflection is now easier.)
Curious are you playing in C or in league play? For C I haven't played against him though I've used him several times.
There aren't a lot of stunties in the TV zone/timezone of C I tend to play (besides my own) and not a lot of inducements because of TV matching. While i've been experimenting with Bomma i've definitely decided Riotous rookies is better for my Ogres then either Bomma (or Akhorne.)
I tend to play less then 15 games with most teams so maybe wider TV matching isn't as common for my teams as I think the band gets wider the older the team is. |
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JackassRampant
Joined: Feb 26, 2011
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| Posted:
Jun 17, 2022 - 21:05 |
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Bommer is a must for any team that can take him. All bombardiers got better, but Bommer is the best. I see him and use him in probably one game in 8 or 10, by far the most common star in C. |
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Lude enixe, obliviscatur timor. |
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MattDakka
Joined: Oct 09, 2007
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| Posted:
Jun 17, 2022 - 21:12 |
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Bomber Bowl, not Blood Bowl  ! |
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PainState
Joined: Apr 04, 2007
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| Posted:
Jun 18, 2022 - 03:08 |
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Well Iam trying to decide if the Issue is that BB2020 sucks or Iam just mad I cant play on FUMBBL like I use to because of work/family/life/beer/whiskey/16year old twin boys and a wife.
So my default bitch will be that BB2020 SUCKS HAIRY DWARF BALLS and here is why.
The rule set IMO was written by a bunch of dudes who only play BLood Bowl at their local game store and are lucky if each season they can get in 8 games per season.
FUMBBL is not your local game store/pub/game shop.
The #1 issue I have with the new rule set beside the new skills/stupid passing rules and well, never mind, I do not want a paragraph on all that rule bull shit.
The #1 issue is seasons. Iam not against a redraft per-se. In fact on a certain level I kinda of like it. The big reason I cant stand it on FUMBBL is because it goes against everything R/C/B play is all about. I have proposed numerous ideas for a redraft in those DIVS.
Also with this idiotic idea that BB2020 is cool/new and shiny it has totally destroyed tournament play in the C/B div. The main reason I played on FUMBBL, note the pass tense used due to issues related to 1st paragraph.
SO, IMO let C/B teams play with out seasons and redraft or a redraft set at a base TV of 2200-2000 and all is good.
Good day sirs. |
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Comish of the:  |
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mekutata
Joined: May 03, 2015
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| Posted:
Jun 18, 2022 - 07:55 |
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Nothing against Bomma Bowl!
I like the multiple RRs. But played mostly Goblins and in Stunty environments. Maybe their costs are too low for bigger teams?
Could be the same issue with stars. Bomma for 50K is a sweet alternative to a bribe for Goblins, but might be too much for other teams and should be worth rather 100K? Generally stars could demand dfferent sums of gold from different teams.
Passing... showed promise, a separate PA stat and having only few gits being able to do this, feels right. It's the Quarterback. But they kinda fumbled it as already described. I'd just add that the lack of gud and intuitive PA add to that fail.
I feel like there would have been a lot of options (On the Ball-like movement in offence for the receiver) and really wonder how this was playtested.
Thank you painstate for adding C/B and layk of fumbbl tourneys to the discussion. I hope this will enrage enough coaches to add at least 4 more pages to the thread.
BUT did you realize that current C doesn't feature redraft YET. It's a gud chance to test this new bb and still try to reach your wished monster TV. Some coaches seem to think that the new skill up system doesn't work well w/o redraft.
AND you could organize already (small) tourneys in form of Instant Smacks.
But yeah, currently C is in a weird limbo state.
For some time I didn't play more than 15 games with any team. Now it's a bit like in old R but with the knowledge of an upcoming change. |
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koadah
Joined: Mar 30, 2005
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| Posted:
Jun 18, 2022 - 10:57 |
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| mekutata wrote: | ...
Thank you painstate for adding C/B and layk of fumbbl tourneys to the discussion. I hope this will enrage enough coaches to add at least 4 more pages to the thread. |
It's all been said before many times.
You could just cut/paste it. 
| mekutata wrote: |
BUT did you realize that current C doesn't feature redraft YET. It's a gud chance to test this new bb and still try to reach your wished monster TV. Some coaches seem to think that the new skill up system doesn't work well w/o redraft. |
Maybe you missed the part where he mentioned other priorities.
Doing stuff that you don't really enjoy can be bearable if it will enable you to do what you do enjoy later.
Building a team that will just be guaranteed to be cut down to 1350 or less is a deal breaker for me.
| mekutata wrote: |
AND you could organize already (small) tourneys in form of Instant Smacks. |
We can do that in the league division. That way we can do it the way that we like it.
Majors were something special that couldn't really be replicated in League.
But hey, "nature hates a vacuum" they say. If Majors and high TV is dead, I guess NAF is the new Majors.
| mekutata wrote: |
But yeah, currently C is in a weird limbo state.
For some time I didn't play more than 15 games with any team. Now it's a bit like in old R but with the knowledge of an upcoming change. |
We could have had Majors at 15 games. 30 games. 25 games. 1600TV, 1800TV. Anything.
If you let people drift away, many of them won't return.
And, to misquote the Starks...
"BB3 is coming." |
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