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Poll
Do you vote for a progression or non progession tournament for International Smackdown?
Progression
36%
 36%  [ 31 ]
Non Progression
44%
 44%  [ 38 ]
Pink Furry Crocodiles!!!!!
19%
 19%  [ 17 ]
Total Votes : 86


RobtheUncreative



Joined: Jan 12, 2004

Post 1 Posted: Jun 29, 2005 - 11:51 Reply with quote Back to top

This is a poll to test what would be more popular.

Remember progression means that teams can build up TR and aquire new skills but also run the risk of being destroyed.
Non progression means that the teams are set at 100 TR as rookie teams meaning that players would not aquire new skills and that teams would always be ready to play at an even level with other teams.
thesquig



Joined: Apr 11, 2004

Post   Posted: Jun 29, 2005 - 11:54 Reply with quote Back to top

I'm with progression all the way. Its ok for all other tourneys... should be ok for this!

Progression will make coaches play more carefully and skullfully and choose their skills carefully too.

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MadMarx



Joined: Aug 14, 2003

Post   Posted: Jun 29, 2005 - 12:20 Reply with quote Back to top

Non prog. You get some coach who does 9 cas in his first game, gets 2 dp's, 2 claws and thats it. All tr 100 teams have their strenghts and weaknesses, let everyone choose what he likes and try to outthink his opponent. Dont let the games be decied by who rolls the most mutations on his chaos team, or who gets the most dp's.
skummy



Joined: Aug 02, 2003

Post   Posted: Jun 29, 2005 - 12:49 Reply with quote Back to top

I like non-progression as well.
Mogila



Joined: Mar 01, 2005

Post   Posted: Jun 29, 2005 - 14:27 Reply with quote Back to top

PROGRESION!!!!!
BloodBawl have factor of highest fun - randomnes!! You CAN'T leave this behind. IMHO - the winner had to have not only great skil, but according luck also.

By the way - good leader starts poll only when allready knows an answer, so please select "Pink Furry Crocodiles!!!!!". For good league founder it will tell everything, for bad - also Smile
JanMattys



Joined: Feb 29, 2004

Post   Posted: Jun 29, 2005 - 14:30 Reply with quote Back to top

Non progression. BH-SI-RIP ratio can change the WHOLE course of the tournament. And, since there's nothing ANY coach can do to affect those, I say "let's all have starting rosters forever", so that all will be fair matches.

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keggiemckill



Joined: Oct 07, 2004

Post   Posted: Jun 29, 2005 - 14:46 Reply with quote Back to top

Non progression is the better way to go in this case, but Ill have to reconstruct my team.

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Woodpecker



Joined: Apr 08, 2005

Post   Posted: Jun 29, 2005 - 15:35 Reply with quote Back to top

Progression. Absolutly.
PurpleChest



Joined: Oct 25, 2003

Post 8 Posted: Jun 29, 2005 - 19:30
FUMBBL Staff
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Well it seems non progression has won out, which for me is a shame.

A tourney that looked promissing and fun will now feature fewer races, ridiculous team line ups that bear no relation to the actual game as the LRB sets it out and no rewards/penalties for good or bad play.

I had thought the fact that countries were represented by 4 players would mitigate the effects of lucky skill rolls. But clearly i'm in the minority. After all wasnt it non progression that made ladder the dynamic hotbed division that it is today?
DreadClaw



Joined: Nov 17, 2003

Post   Posted: Jun 29, 2005 - 19:33 Reply with quote Back to top

PurpleChest wrote:
Well it seems non progression has won out, which for me is a shame.

A tourney that looked promissing and fun will now feature fewer races, ridiculous team line ups that bear no relation to the actual game as the LRB sets it out and no rewards/penalties for good or bad play.

I had thought the fact that countries were represented by 4 players would mitigate the effects of lucky skill rolls. But clearly i'm in the minority. After all wasnt it non progression that made ladder the dynamic hotbed division that it is today?


I agree wholeheartedly, but am a minority as well chest.. shame eh?

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JanMattys



Joined: Feb 29, 2004

Post   Posted: Jun 29, 2005 - 19:34 Reply with quote Back to top

Purple, the point is that "bad play" (as you call it) is not the only factor deciding a match. Luck is as well. I can accept it in a single game (otherwise I wouldn't love BB), but with a progression system, luck affects not only my game, but even the following.

That's unacceptable. If it could be possible, I'd vote for NAF system (1 skill choice every game) with magic healing (all casualties are treated as BHs). This way you can show your skill as a team developer while minimizing the chances to "lose a streak because of a single bad game". I think all the italian team (which I represent) thinks so.

But if the choice is between progression and TR100, well... TR100 is the lesser evil and I am all for it.

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PurpleChest



Joined: Oct 25, 2003

Post   Posted: Jun 29, 2005 - 20:05
FUMBBL Staff
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JanMattys: Thats sort of my point too.

I thought this tourney was about playing BB with the added spice of national teams to add some fluff. Removing a major part fo the game in order to make it 'fair' seems a little wierd to me.

Why not remove the BB aspect all together and have IQ tests. Or a test on knowledge of the rules and probabilities for various play options. Surely the fact that dice are still present bothers you a great deal, there must be ways to eliminate them entirely.

i guess this entire nationalism thing is already going to far for my comfort, when people want to 'remove chance' and make it a 'genuine test of ability', whatever the hell thats supposed to mean.

i'm here to play BB and have fun. if i want a game without chance i'll go elsewhere and find one, not mutate BB into providing that.

On a more basic level non progression bores me. I doubt there will be many chaos, undead, ogre, khemri, nurgle, vampire, necro, fling, goblin, lizard or even chaos dwarves, as having armour is far less important. the winners will likely be fielding 3-4 elf teams with maybe a human/amazon/dwarf/norse/orc for variety. Lineups will be designed for single gaming. People can try -3 die blocks and 8+ dodges, because none of it matters. A key player dies due to a stupid play? no worries he's back next game. So even the gameplay, while possibly more dynamic, is irrelevant to BB, far MORE random, MORE reliant on luck. The lack of skills and possibly low reroll numbers again mean ag is King and luck factors in heavy once again. With 2 rerolls a failed pick up can ruin your whole day. Without the skills and players to compensate for poor luck it plays a bigger factor in each result.

The counter arguement that progression distorts a tourney and doesnt allow true ability to out is, frankly, piffle.

If your team wins but gets wrecked, THATS YOUR FAULT. You picked the race, the team and the tactics, all are factors in the 'skill' of BB. teams progress at different rates, have different durability and different costs, you maybe ought to have thought of that when you drew up the team, not moan about it now.

Some players get lucky and roll 'claw'. OOOOOh, scary. Some elves roll +ag, doesnt that also skew the game? And isnt the game balanced, and designed, so that these various options are factored in?

To remove some aspects of the game while leaving others, to destroy so many options in the name of fairness and yet avoid the real answer you seek just shows that the arguement is facile.

If the goal is an 'even' playing field then all should field the same race, with no progression. Possibly even the same team. That'd still leave randomness in with the dice rolls but it'd beat the empty concept of no progression, which simply penalises certain races and rewards irrelevant skills useless in LRB BB.

I also believe the poll to be biased in the way it sets the question. Progression is shown with a negative aspect (team may be destroyed) and non progression only positives (always ready to play).
PurpleChest



Joined: Oct 25, 2003

Post   Posted: Jun 29, 2005 - 20:58
FUMBBL Staff
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Appologies for the rant. For those that cant be bothered a precis:

Non progression: Bad. Not LRB, More reliance on luck, less variety.
Progression: Good. LRB, diverse, more reliance on skill.
Curro



Joined: Jun 07, 2005

Post   Posted: Jun 29, 2005 - 21:01 Reply with quote Back to top

I think JanĀ“s one is a good idea...
Macavity



Joined: Nov 23, 2004

Post   Posted: Jun 29, 2005 - 21:16 Reply with quote Back to top

I'm still largely in favour of Pink Furry Crocodiles, but Canada will win, regardless.

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