backelie
Joined: Jul 20, 2010
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 Posted:
Jun 16, 2011 - 14:25 |
 
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How much CRP BB have you played if you think Dwarf/Orc need nerfing but none of the Claw teams do? |
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clarkin
Joined: Oct 15, 2007
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| Posted:
Jun 16, 2011 - 14:54 |
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I don't quite understand your suggested tweak for PO. If it's exactly like MB except you have to go prone why would you ever take it? Does it stack with MB? |
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Geenimetsuri
Joined: Jun 08, 2004
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Jun 16, 2011 - 15:00 |
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| neophyte wrote: | yeah i think there are good thoughts behind this.
(c)pomb needs a nerf. |
Pfft.
The only thing that's required is a counter skill for Claw...and possibly some insurance-type thing to give gold for each RIP taken instead of the journeyman mechanic.
After all it's BLOOD bowl  |
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Mr_Foulscumm
Joined: Mar 05, 2005
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Jun 16, 2011 - 15:01 |
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My suggested nerf for PO sounds like this: Remove it from the game.
Not a fan of Dryads on the Flings team. Apart from that it seems fine at a first glance. Too bad we can't actually get this implemented. |
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SillySod
Joined: Oct 10, 2006
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Jun 16, 2011 - 15:23 |
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Changing the rules? Damn am I out of the loop!
Had a very very quick skim through. More detailed comments to follow at some undetermined time but here are a few gimmies:
- vampires should have av8 thralls for 50k if you want to narrow the tiers and promote multiple playstyles
- ogres need something substantial, especially if you are nerfing piling on
- slann need a kick up the arse, blitzer price is an obvious change
- lots of other stuff looks good yaaaaaaay 
| Mr_Foulscumm wrote: | | My suggested nerf for PO sounds like this: Remove it from the game.. |
Hi-five! Crazy looking bearded man is sensible.
My take on it would be this: as it stands piling on is "too bloody" for the game. Probably not overpowered but it isnt much fun either. If you nerf it successfully then it will be too weak for most people to consider (if it isnt that weak then you didnt nerf it properly) so it will only really be used by players who are looking for damage at all costs... so it wont really be contributing to the game. |
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WhatBall
Joined: Aug 21, 2008
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| Posted:
Jun 16, 2011 - 15:43 |
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Thanks for this Plasmoid. I really like the idea of tightening the tiers, and think many of the roster changes proposed are good.
Once we have custom rosters available it would be great to have a league that is created to test all these new rules.
I know the the LRBs are officially frozen for now, but as with keeping BB alive in the first place, I think the onus falls on the community to keep pushing BB forward. I think FUMBBL and the new client are the tools to do that. |
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Garion
Joined: Aug 19, 2009
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| Posted:
Jun 16, 2011 - 15:44 |
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| clarkin wrote: | | I don't quite understand your suggested tweak for PO. If it's exactly like MB except you have to go prone why would you ever take it? Does it stack with MB? |
Yes it stacks it is like the bash equivilent of accurate and Strong arm, same skill but stacks.
| Cevap wrote: | Did you deliberately give Skaven direct M access and switched the werewolf back to his LRB4 self?  |
Skaven havent got direct M access in the rules he posted, they still need doubles.
| backelie wrote: | | How much CRP BB have you played if you think Dwarf/Orc need nerfing but none of the Claw teams do? |
Orcs and Dwarves are still a top tier team, anyone that says otherwise is a fool imo. Also he has made a nerf to the CPOMB teams, by making PO a lot less powerful. Although I don't mind there being tiers of teams. I dont think this nerf to the dwarves is in the right place personally. People will just take the Troll Slayers even less. The problem with Dwarves is that they have 4 blitzers all with St access and all the linemen have St access. I say drop the blitzers all together because thats what troll slayers esentially are, no need for them to have two types of blitzer no other team does (except Norse :spit:)and give them 4 runners instead.
I have to say, I really don't like the fling and gobo changes either and this is coming from a huge fling fan, they were my most played with race in lrb4 and favourite by a long way, the dryads just arent right.
Not sure about the Right Stuff negates tackle either, but I guess we will see with that one. Also with Ogres - When using TTM on titchy players long passes should be allowed on account of their light weight and would still like to see the ogre count increase to 8 at the very least.
But on the whole they are good, I especially like giving mummies G access again, even if it does mean they go without MB to start with. |
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Wreckage
Joined: Aug 15, 2004
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Jun 16, 2011 - 15:52 |
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Balance in different abilities is an art and is probably the most difficult task of a game designer. There is no shame in not being perfect. But using tiers as an excuse for incabaility to create balance is just lame. I don't think you need to have to plan on making tiers to make teams differently strong. A couple of good changes tho.. |
Last edited by Wreckage on %b %16, %2011 - %16:%Jun; edited 1 time in total |
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mubo
Joined: Dec 30, 2008
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Jun 16, 2011 - 16:25 |
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Thanks Martin,
Generally I like these adjustments- Particularly the P.O. nerf.
Obviously there are going to be disagreements, and FWIW:
-Dislike AV7 flings, I'd rather give them a free chef. This means they are no longer so reliant on being the underdog. RS/tackle is a game changer too.
-Happy with the ogre changes. Maybe prefer cut RRs to 50k rather than ogre cost drop.
-A blodge/tackle immune goblin (at a lucky 6spps) seems to be a pretty good ball handler for orcs. Cutting thrower seems like a huge change, I'd be interested in playtesting this.
-Humans, AV8 catcher and GAS access blitzers (I saw mentioned on TFF) seem good.
I think the kill stack (and it's ease of access) is by far the biggest issue with the game currently, at least in this "perpetual environment". I'd be behind any future set that counters that. |
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WhatBall
Joined: Aug 21, 2008
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Jun 16, 2011 - 16:31 |
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I like the idea of giving the Halflings a Master Chef positional on their roster. Works just like the Master Chef skill, but he is a player on the field. If he dies, KO, etc, you lose the Master Chef roll. |
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Were_M_Eye
Joined: Sep 24, 2007
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| Posted:
Jun 16, 2011 - 16:51 |
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CK_Zweistein
Joined: Jun 13, 2009
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Jun 16, 2011 - 17:21 |
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hm ...
1.) About PO.
You need Bashing.
With all the consequences.
Because you need something to prevent all players to reach legend-status. The aging is gone after all. So PO is (part of) the answer.
But i think the AV7 Teams are hit most by the curent skilltree/ruleset for Bashing and/or the AV9 Teams are not hit hard enough!
The question invovled here is not winning today.
Sure most AV7 Teams might win even with 4-5 players left. But what is with the next game?
In the long run the "Bashteams" will play with alle there Legends and the AV7-Teams are stuck with loners ...
so in my optinon there are multiple options:
-> Change PO to something to pin down a certain Player.
So the idea of Pilling on is: you jump on top of the oponent.
Fine! Do it! But dont reroll the AV or the CAS.
Possibility 1:
the player holds down the oponent with his own body. So now there can be some "finetuning". you can say:
- the player cant stand up till the Player who used PO stands up first.
- There is a Strength roll (whatever boni or mali involved) if the Player who was pilled on whants to stand up as long as pt PO-Player dont stands up first.
Possibility 2
Cut all that AV/CAS reroll stuff away and the skill simply stuns the player it was used on. So you have one Turn when you dont have to think about the player on the ground. (From my mostly Skaven point of view thats plenty of time gained)
In my opinion that changes PO from a pure bashskill to a very taktikal skill. The way of thinking "i use one (not so usefull player) to hold a Legend down!". i like this idea.
other options might be:
-> Give a loner for every missing player in the roster (minimum 11 as now). thats a minor change with a heavy impact.
So teams that likly will have losses during a game can have some reserve, even if the last game was a disaster. heavy AV Teams normaly not getting outnumberd anyway, so if a loner is in reserve it boost the TV of the team to "allmost normal" and that affects the Inducements possible for the upcoming match.
-> Give certain teams a "Priest". someone who can resurect/heal 1 Player after the match. so they might rescue there precious star. So not just the high-AV/Bashing are playing with Legends ...
-> Give Agi Teams something to strike back (as a Claw-like skill in the Agi-Skills)
... personaly i dont like this idea but this game tends to be bloody, so let all pay the price!
-> Rewrite the CAS-list
2.) Changes to the Teamrosters
You cannot be serious!
-> Take the Thrower from the orks away is a massive change to the team. its a clear nerv and Orks "struggling" ... ok ... on top of the Basherlist.
-> Giving all skavenplayers mutation access is not a change that needs to be mentioned??? wth! its a clear buff! if it was just the Ratoger or the thrower i would be with you, because i like skaven and see some need. but most will count even that way over the top.
the rest i have not enough knowledge to make clear further points ... but maybe someone else can say something more. |
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Garion
Joined: Aug 19, 2009
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| Posted:
Jun 16, 2011 - 17:23 |
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He has not given skaven mutation access on single rolls. You are the second person to say this? |
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Ehlers
Joined: Jun 26, 2006
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| Posted:
Jun 16, 2011 - 17:41 |
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I love the team change to CD, now Hobgoblins also have M access |
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Garion
Joined: Aug 19, 2009
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| Posted:
Jun 16, 2011 - 18:18 |
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| Ehlers wrote: | | I love the team change to CD, now Hobgoblins also have M access |
No they don't. Is everyone reading a different document to me? |
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