Hayati
Joined: Nov 07, 2006
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 Posted:
Aug 18, 2007 - 20:31 |
 
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Guys,
I posted this earlier on a league thread, and it was suggested I put it here, as a more general item. It's from the GW website:
"Why do we play the game?" There are almost as many answers to that question as there are players. Some people play for fun; others to improve their skills; and some people play with the intention of grinding their opponent's army into a fine red paste and spreading it on their breakfast muffin as they cackle evilly all the while. What I have learned from having been on both sides of the meat grinder is that the goals you set for the game determine how much enjoyment you get out of the gaming experience.
For a long time, my goal in playing the game was winning – not only winning, but massacring my opponent's army. I'd read material on the internet to learn new tactics and get advice on how to build armies. I'd sit down with my army lists and ruthlessly replace units or upgrades that didn't seem to be earning their keep. I'd do my best to learn all of the game's rules as well as the special rules for each army so I would be prepared for anything that crossed my path. I treated Warhammer like chess in that I believed that there were certain opening moves and strategies that would always be useful in every circumstance.
The end result of this obsession was that, although I became a better player, I did not become a happier one. Instead, I would be disappointed when I lost, angry at my Cold Ones when they would fail a critical Stupidity test and blunder in front of a regiment of Khornegors with the Beastbanner, or frustrated at my High Sorceress when she fatally miscast and spent the next 3 turns of the game stumbling about the battlefield searching for her mommy. Even before the game was over, I would get moody if it seemed like things were going against me, or if my units failed to live up to my expectations. All it would take to ruin my mood was one bad Panic test. I wouldn't enjoy the game, and I was, regrettably, called a bad sport more than once.
Eventually, though, I came to realize that Warhammer is not chess. There are no perfect army builds, no perfect strategies, and the game can shift dramatically with the roll of a single die. However good you are, luck can desert you and ruin your plans completely. On the other hand, these bad breaks can happen as much to your opponent as they do to you, and it would hardly be fair to laugh at your opponent's Warplock Engineers frying themselves while raging at your fleeing Black Guard. Also, some army builds are more effective against other army builds, so what your opponent brings to the table is going to have a significant effect on how well your army performs, even if you play just as skillfully as you always do. Your Empire Gunline might seem pretty stout. However, when the Skaven Endless Horde of Doom with a Stormbanner shows up, you might as well turn out the lights. The party is over. Sure, there are some top players in this game, but even they don't win all of the time.
It was then that I recognized that as long as I kept coming to the table with the goal of scoring a massacre, or even of winning every game, I was going to be disappointed a lot. Plus, I was wasting some great opportunities to fulfill goals other than winning. For example, if I started a game with the goal of learning something new and becoming a better player, chances are I could fulfill that goal every time I played. I would walk away satisfied with the gaming experience even if my Elves were ruthlessly ground under the wheels of a Steam Tank. If nothing else, I could leave knowing what didn't work!
Goal #1: Love Your Army
It's clear to me now that having goals other than winning can make the game a much more enjoyable experience every time we play it. My primary goal is to "get into" my army to the utmost – which is not a bad goal when I think about the amount of time I've invested in my force. I encourage you to think of your own motivations, ones that work for you and make the game fun.
Keepin' It Real
The second thing you can do to appreciate your army more is to make it as "real" as possible. Much like a good fantasy book, a good fantasy army is one you can "believe in." The first step in this process is creating a background for your army. Where did they come from? Why do they fight now? My own Chaos army is led by a Daemon Princess with the Unliving Idol Daemonic Gift who was accidentally summoned by a Beastman tribe. She killed off the leadership of the tribe and now leads them to war in order to fulfill her own nefarious purposes. Once your background is complete, you can start thinking about the characters. What are they like? How do they interact with each other? In my Dark Elf army, the Sorceress is constantly mocking and trying to undercut the General, who is too busy trying to keep his army together to snipe back at her (most of the time). Having such well-developed characters reinforces your army's "realism," and that makes your games more fun.
Goal #2: Get into the Story
For example, we could indulge in a little role playing now and then. If we are playing Dwarfs, it might be fun to occasionally throw in a Dwarf-like line when playing the game. If we just broke a unit of Orcs in close combat, we might yell, "Ye'll nay be passin' this line o' Dwarfs, sonny-jim!" On the other hand, if we are playing the Orcs, a rousing "WAAAGH!!!" is often in order to signify a charge. Of course, don't role play to the extent that you annoy your opponent, but the occasional line will usually make the game more fun for all.
In a similar fashion, having an excuse ready when things go wrong for us, or making a new one up on the spot, will help ease tensions and keep the flow of the game going, even when things go disastrously wrong. Say, for instance, that our Chosen Knights just bounced off a regiment of Goblins and were run down and destroyed. The real reason this rout happened is that we rolled some dice really badly. However, having a game reason why this freak occurrence happened makes the bitter pill go down a lot easier. We could say that, "Those weedy Goblins threw sand in our eyes! We'll have their heads next time, by Khorne!" Odds are, our opponent will think it's funny, too. Plus, it beats stomping around and swearing at our dice in a pointless rage.
Goal #3: Make Sure the Other Guy Has Fun
Another way to keep the game light is to commiserate with your opponent when things go wrong for him. Bad luck strikes everyone, and we can acknowledge that our opponent was a victim of lady fate rather than gloat over him. Remember, we didn't do anything to make that happen, and winning because of an opponent's bad luck doesn't make us good generals.
Goal #4: Never Surrender!
Make a goal to never give up! Don't become despondent if the game slides away from you. Instead, take on the challenge of accomplishing the most you can with what you have left. My own gaming history is filled with single units that overcame the odds to slaughter 10 times their value of the enemy (or enemy units that slaughtered 10 times their value of my troops, while I could only watch, horrified and amazed). Remember that a lot of fantasy art depicts a small band of heroes surrounded by overwhelming numbers as they make the bravest last stand they can. Live the dream!
Final Thoughts
Recognize that becoming a better player is its own reward rather than a path to more and more victories. Easy victories are usually not as much fun for either side compared to a well-played game that comes right down to the wire. Even the people who wrote the books don't win all their games. If you want further evidence, go read the battle reports in the White Dwarf or Black Gobbo and see how things can go disastrously wrong, even for the experts. Do you remember the report between the Empire and the Orcs, where one mad Fanatic ripped through both armies like a buzzsaw?
As you can see, there are many other goals we can set for our games other than winning, all of which can be just as, if not more, rewarding to us as players. Finding alternative goals like these will help you enjoy every game, win or lose.
There you go guys- some useful tips I'd say! From a personal standpoint I agree that close games are best, and some of my fave games have been where I have narrowly lost. Also, having a fluffed team really does help, as game events can be framed in terms of the fluff. Rather than, "I got 6 1's in a row", I tend to think, "Wow, player X really must start turning up for training- this is not the first time they missed a session and played terribly as a result!" It's a healthier way of looking at things, and is more fun for both BB coaches.
Another way of looking at it is to say, how am I viewed by the other FUMBBL coaches? When things go well, or when they don't? How will I be remembered by them?
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_________________
"Hear me now!
All crimes should be treasured if they give thee
Pleasure somehow!" |
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Kyyberi
Joined: Nov 27, 2004
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| Posted:
Aug 18, 2007 - 20:33 |
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This post has some quality points in it. Quite many coaches open their mouth in game chat only when they complain. That can't be fun... |
_________________
Shepherd says some wise words... |
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Falesh
Joined: Aug 02, 2003
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Aug 18, 2007 - 20:42 |
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| Quote: | | Another way to keep the game light is to commiserate with your opponent when things go wrong for him. |
I agree, when nuffle is taking a bite out of my opponent I say something. If it were the other way round I know I would feel better if my opponent said "it's not your day". |
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Russo
Joined: Apr 11, 2006
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Aug 18, 2007 - 23:25 |
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Yes the spirit here is important, and the article sounds like someone who has learnt the hard way! |
_________________
BAAA means NO!
[21:35] <@Purp|away> why is it whenever I come to check the PC, Russo is lowering the tone?! 
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[22:59] <princevaliant> NBL has gotten to be such a dirty channel
[22:59] <princevaliant> ty Russo 
BiggieB is my idol |
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Pirog
Joined: Jul 13, 2006
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Aug 19, 2007 - 00:27 |
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Amen to that! I have had really enjoyable dice rapes when the opponents show proper sympathy. If one get some jokes going about some constant failures it takes the edge out of the frustration. When I come across lucky opponents who blatantly stick to that luck really isn't a factor in this dice game I become really cranky though. I guess it's a character flaw.
I play to have fun, but that doesn't mean that I always have fun. Most of all I hope for a fair match. I don't enjoy seeing my opponent get crushed by bad dice rolls either, because the fun part of playing is to have challenge someone and let the best coach win. Sadly that isn't always the case.
I know that I can come across as a big whiner at times, but it depends a lot on the circumstances. I have even played the same coaches and get dice raped badly several times, and in one match they write in the match report that I'm a good sport and in the other that I'm a bad loser.
From one perspective I can admire the people that are disconnected and never let dice rapes get to them, but that the same time I think they are lacking passion. Just like I can scream out in delight or frustration when I watch a football match I feel connected to my games. If the passion turns into whining is really just a matter of how my opponent tackles it and if I'm having a generally pissy day or not  |
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Chewie
Joined: Dec 13, 2006
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Aug 19, 2007 - 08:54 |
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Bloodbowl is a comedy game. Remember that, and you'll give into frustration less often. |
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Snappy_Dresser
Joined: Feb 11, 2005
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Aug 19, 2007 - 09:54 |
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um, why is your avatar a lady's boot? |
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<PurpleChest> the way it splooshed got me so excited
"I hear that shadow is a douchebag"
-Mr Foulscumm |
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Wreckage
Joined: Aug 15, 2004
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Aug 19, 2007 - 10:08 |
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| Kyyberi wrote: | | This post has some quality points in it. Quite many coaches open their mouth in game chat only when they complain. That can't be fun... |
agreed... still i dont share the view of the mainmessage "trying to win the game is not fun"... i would maybe agree about it for games like warhammer or warhammer 40k ....
bloodbowl is... compared to warhammer a much more technical game....
there is an inherent and complex logic inside every move that wants to be figured out, to be explored and expierenced... bloodbowl is a game of such complexity that you cannot figure out what exactly will happen in the next six turns like in chess... what means even when you are good and know the game there might still be a better option a better solution for a problem you didnt thought of... you cannot always win but you will know when you tried as hard as you could and didnt fail once in your way of thinking and still lost in the end that you played a good game...
but... bloodbowl is not a fluffgame like warhammer afterall... the options of playertype choices a rare... the amount of players is set to 11 and the partake of highelves and the existance of proelves let us ask every time... why would elves try to play such a rude game at all... we want them to we make them to..
this is a game a real game not some kinda roleplaying game about how you can use ur imagination the best possibile way....
its not a simulation of real life, its just a game...(games are about winning)
no you shouldnt try to win at all costs every time.... if that means that you are always going to play chaosdwarves or even your kind of favored race.... a win archieved with halflings is ten times worth more then a win with cd'S ... but you gotta at least try to win |
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Hayati
Joined: Nov 07, 2006
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Aug 19, 2007 - 10:16 |
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| Snappy_Dresser wrote: | | um, why is your avatar a lady's boot? |
Because I'm a Snappy_Dresser |
_________________
"Hear me now!
All crimes should be treasured if they give thee
Pleasure somehow!" |
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torsoboy
Joined: Nov 23, 2004
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Aug 19, 2007 - 11:10 |
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I thought the reasons for playing were to crush your enemies, see them driven before you and hear the lamentations of the other coach? |
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The plural of anecdote isn't data. |
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Pirrekurr
Joined: Mar 11, 2004
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Aug 19, 2007 - 11:44 |
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I agree with Prasomchai. This is the reason I play. For the fun and the fluff. Of course it is not wrong to play to win, but if I had to chose between winning and playing fluffy, I would actually play fluffy. But on the other hand, I usually say that I am a roleplayer, not a wargamer, cardplayer ocr blood bowl coach, even if I dabble a bit in them all. |
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"It's almost embarassing getting slapped around by pirr (Pirrekurr that is), no off meant" - Britnoth |
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Shrap
Joined: Sep 18, 2006
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Aug 19, 2007 - 13:37 |
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I'm totally a roleplayer over gamer.
However I play to win!
Crush, Kill, Destroy! |
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Squaq
Joined: Aug 02, 2003
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Aug 19, 2007 - 23:49 |
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Think you have to go through the competitive fase before you can rest in the "love and understanding"-viewpoint. Its evolution. |
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Don't worry leaving your troubles behind - They will still be there when you come back. |
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Russo
Joined: Apr 11, 2006
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| Posted:
Aug 19, 2007 - 23:53 |
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| Squaq wrote: | | Think you have to go through the competitive fase before you can rest in the "love and understanding"-viewpoint. Its evolution. |
Funnily enough this is often the case, though in Prasomchai and myself it was the opposite way round.
We both started off as very low foulers, very much into team development...as we got less attached to our pixcels we became more competative and bashed and fouled more....though our spirits became more cavalier about deaths (our own and our oppositions)
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_________________
BAAA means NO!
[21:35] <@Purp|away> why is it whenever I come to check the PC, Russo is lowering the tone?!
================================
[22:59] <princevaliant> NBL has gotten to be such a dirty channel
[22:59] <princevaliant> ty Russo
BiggieB is my idol |
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Zombie69
Joined: Jul 02, 2007
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Aug 20, 2007 - 10:17 |
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I think the point that applies most to Blood Bowl is :
| Quote: | Goal #3: Make Sure the Other Guy Has Fun
Another way to keep the game light is to commiserate with your opponent when things go wrong for him. Bad luck strikes everyone, and we can acknowledge that our opponent was a victim of lady fate rather than gloat over him. Remember, we didn't do anything to make that happen, and winning because of an opponent's bad luck doesn't make us good generals. |
Sadly, there are coaches here who don't seem to think this way and make the experience much less satisfying for their opponent. |
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