Pirog
Joined: Jul 13, 2006
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 Posted:
Dec 12, 2007 - 13:08 |
 
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No, I don't question why new teams are added, but why the limit of two? Seeing how there are a multitude of teams for the "grown up leagues", wouldn't it be fun to have that kind of diversity in stunty league as well?
I understand that it might be good to just include two teams for now, in terms of balance issues and time for play testing. But I hope there is room for more teams in the not too distant future, because there are a lot of good team proposals around!
Since regular goblins and halflings got cut these two are just replacements after all  |
Last edited by Pirog on %b %13, %2007 - %13:%Dec; edited 1 time in total |
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Synn
Joined: Dec 13, 2004
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Dec 12, 2007 - 13:15 |
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I think Christer mentioned how he wanted a hard limit on the number of teams.
As a personal aside... I would rather see three teams added and 1 team dropped (Eshin).
__Synn |
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Pirog
Joined: Jul 13, 2006
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Dec 12, 2007 - 13:17 |
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Aha, I see. And I do agree with dropping Eshin. Hell, they could go even if we get nothing in return.
But there are so many nice rosters out there that it's a shame to only include two of them. |
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Russo
Joined: Apr 11, 2006
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Dec 12, 2007 - 13:25 |
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Can I ask why you both want to drop Eshin? |
_________________
BAAA means NO!
[21:35] <@Purp|away> why is it whenever I come to check the PC, Russo is lowering the tone?! 
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[22:59] <princevaliant> NBL has gotten to be such a dirty channel
[22:59] <princevaliant> ty Russo 
BiggieB is my idol |
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HunterX
Joined: Aug 02, 2003
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Dec 12, 2007 - 13:48 |
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Purplegoo
Joined: Mar 23, 2006
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Dec 12, 2007 - 14:05 |
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| Russo wrote: | | Can I ask why you both want to drop Eshin? |
Can't say I'm a huge Eshin fan myself. They just bore me. I don't like the roster. I think it's more balanced than it was (although I've only played/specced them a couple of times post-change), but I just don't like them.
Personal preference though, others may love them. You can get the same (and more) carnage / win % at low TR with ease with a Cheater team if you play them properly, so I'm not as convinced by the 'broken' argument anymore. I stand to be corrected there by heavy Eshin followers.
If you fancy canning them and replacing with something interesting, thumbs up from me. |
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johan
Joined: Aug 02, 2003
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Dec 12, 2007 - 14:25 |
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| Russo wrote: | | Can I ask why you both want to drop Eshin? |
The Eshin team has a downright awful design. It focuses on Poisoned Dagger, which is broken in Stunty. It has one super-star non-stunty for scoring. It has very dubious potential for really high TR-play while being almost unbeatable at low levels. It's blatantly obvious it was never play-tested properly (if at all).
The brokenness of the design was so evident that the recent nerf had to be very ugly. From start, it was basically a Skink++ team (not so much any longer, but still.)
I honestly don't think there's any way to make this team design even semi-decent. Scrap it and replace with an interesting team instead. |
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Kalamona
Joined: Apr 21, 2005
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Dec 12, 2007 - 14:27 |
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actually i remember peikko saying there will be no more than 16 stunty team at the same time. i dont know if it was limited by peikko or christer himself. hunterx can sort it out with christer, but as far as i can see we have 13 teams now. so i would say there should be at least 3 new teams added. obviously there is somebody in charge to decide this. i just dont know who this person is. but i would say everything is in the hands of hunterx now. he is a full admin after all. |
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Russo
Joined: Apr 11, 2006
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Dec 12, 2007 - 14:42 |
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Well I find that Eshin are no better or worse than any of the other teams to be honest. I find I rarely come off best in the casualty battle (most of the dagger injuries are KO), but I find I do win as a trade off for getting beat up.
I am not going to make a strong fight for them but I dont think they are broken. They provide a team that plays with no big guys and as for the "1 superstar" thing it is no difference to the War Dancer in LRB.
You learn to play against superior starting players, and a decent coach would try to spread the SPP's by using all players to avoid the "1 bad block" and you lose type of scenario. Yes it is easy to skill the Assasin, but it is better not to let him be a hog. The same risk that all Elven and Skaven coaches have to face. |
_________________
BAAA means NO!
[21:35] <@Purp|away> why is it whenever I come to check the PC, Russo is lowering the tone?!
================================
[22:59] <princevaliant> NBL has gotten to be such a dirty channel
[22:59] <princevaliant> ty Russo
BiggieB is my idol |
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Synn
Joined: Dec 13, 2004
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Dec 12, 2007 - 14:59 |
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Why I want to drop eshin:
For me, its not about whether they are "overpowered" or such. To me, its about how they fit in with the rest of the teams. After the improvement to Skinks, you now have three teams that possess superb offenses (Fairies, Eshin, and Skinks). 25% of Stunty teams should not have MA 8 scorers.
I think Fairies are a fun team featuring a unique but balanced niche (hypnotic gaze). Skinks still have a dagger but now have the dangerous (if they ever skill up) raptors. Eshin have daggers as their niche which in hindsight mabey wasn't the best idea.
I think a goal in the HunterX era should be to balance the teams to where each team can play evenly against every other team. This may sound obvious, but in the past... teams were balanced against the rest of the league in total. So eshin got through on the argument that they may smoke snots every time, but they would be seriously weakened going up against gnomes.
Finally, about the new races being suggested.....
I would like to see more emphasis on a skill or trait. Currently, the rosters in existence are cool due to each team having their own unique feature. Whether its the guard of slaves... or the shadowing of pygs... each team should focus on something.
This brings me to the new teams.
I think there are skills that are completely vacant from Stunty that should be added. Frenzy and Stand Firm are two glaring ones. Hence why my proposed Bray Herd team had three players with frenzy and wild animal. My proposed Deadling team had the basic linos with SF (but no dodge).
With this in mind, I like the Tzeentch team that craftnburn proposes once he gets it through his head that the chef-wizard will not and should not happen.
I also like the imp team although I am not the biggest fan of having its featured skill being prehensile tail (it does stack with DT). The flying BGs are fun though.
I absolutely HATE teams like fling pirates and such not on the merits of the team... but the fact that I would like to see us stick somewhat close to BB fluff. Races and sub groups not used include:
-Bray Herd
-Forest Goblins
-Clan Pestilens
-Lahmia
-Demons of some sort
-Hobgoblins (though i hate the roster just for its complicated-ness)
Anyway, hope this helps.
__Synn |
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Pirog
Joined: Jul 13, 2006
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Dec 12, 2007 - 15:42 |
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The fling pirates were basically just to have at least one team that will hurl halflings. That's abscent since you helped ruin chaos halflings |
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Synn
Joined: Dec 13, 2004
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Dec 12, 2007 - 15:59 |
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Last I checked... Chaos Minos have TTM.
__Synn
**I just made them weaker at throwing |
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Pirog
Joined: Jul 13, 2006
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Dec 12, 2007 - 17:44 |
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Yeah, you'll see a lot of people using Wild Animal TTM's as a part of their strategy... |
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Synn
Joined: Dec 13, 2004
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Dec 12, 2007 - 17:50 |
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Only one team should have to use TTM as part of their strategy.... Gnomes. Just cos a team has TTM, doesn't mean they have to be good at it. Chaos flings are an incredibly bashy team. I have used them since the change and love them. Either way, I am pretty sure you and I have discussed this before where your suggestions were promptly ignored and mine were followed.
Besides, I am sure that when stars are figured in, Chaos Flings will lose Logan and gain a deamon engine (similar to the doomdiver catapult).
__Synn |
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Craftnburn
Joined: Jul 29, 2005
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Dec 12, 2007 - 18:02 |
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| Synn wrote: | | With this in mind, I like the Tzeentch team that craftnburn proposes once he gets it through his head that the chef-wizard will not and should not happen. |
That the Chef was too good for 'Flings doesn't automatically mean it's too good for Tzeentch. The Horrors have FAR less reliability than 'Flings and need those rerolls.
| Synn wrote: | | Either way, I am pretty sure you and I have discussed this before where your suggestions were promptly ignored and mine were followed. |
Man you sure know how to come off as an arrogant prig don't you?
Did you take classes for that?
I liked your previous (constructive) post, but you undermined it with this. |
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