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Poll
Purely objectively, what's the best overall team group ?
Can't touch me (Dark elves, Elves, High Elves, Wood elves)
40%
 40%  [ 41 ]
Hole exploiters (Lizardman, Skavens, Slanns)
5%
 5%  [ 6 ]
Strong & clumsy (Chaos, Chaos pact, Khemri, Nurgle)
15%
 15%  [ 16 ]
Watch my skills! (Amazons, Humans, Norse, Orcs)
8%
 8%  [ 9 ]
Smashed underdog (Goblins, Halflings, Ogres, Vampires)
7%
 7%  [ 8 ]
Melting pot (Necromantics, Undeads)
5%
 5%  [ 6 ]
Strong drunks (Chaos dwarves, Dwarves)
7%
 7%  [ 8 ]
23 meats coach's pie
7%
 7%  [ 8 ]
Total Votes : 102


mrbibitte3



Joined: Mar 28, 2013
Post   Posted: Jun 29, 2013 - 16:17 Reply with quote Back to top
Hi coaches from everywhere,

Just for the fun of it, I'd like to develop a team competitiveness chart relative to their Team Rating.

I know it won't be perfect as it's very subjective. Also, good coaches playing mediocre teams will generally do better then less talented coaches playing stellar teams... And I also know that a team's success will be different depending on the league's other teams (example : an elf team will have a hard time surviving a dwarf league).

But let's forget all this and try to build this chart as objectively as we can. Once I feel some kind of consensus has been reach on a team, I'll adjust the chart accordingly.

Here's the first draft... based solely on my instincts (not worth much). I'm waiting for all of your inputs.

Competitiveness
A = Stellar
B = High
C = Medium
D = Low

AMAZONS
(1000K): A
(1500K): B
(2000K): C

CHAOS
(1000K): B
(1500K): B
(2000K): A

CHAOS DWARVES
(1000K): A
(1500K): A
(2000K): A

CHAOS PACT
(1000K): B
(1500K): B
(2000K): A

DARK ELVES
(1000K): B
(1500K): A
(2000K): A

DWARVES
(1000K): A
(1500K): A
(2000K): A

ELVES
(1000K): B
(1500K): A
(2000K): A

GOBLINS
(1000K): D
(1500K): D
(2000K): D

HALFLINGS
(1000K): D
(1500K): D
(2000K): D

HIGH ELVES
(1000K): A
(1500K): A
(2000K): A

HUMANS
(1000K): A
(1500K): A
(2000K): B

KHEMRI
(1000K): C
(1500K): B
(2000K): A

LIZARDMAN
(1000K): B
(1500K): B
(2000K): A

NECROMANTICS
(1000K): B
(1500K): A
(2000K): A

NORSE
(1000K): A
(1500K): B
(2000K): C

NURGLE
(1000K): B
(1500K): B
(2000K): A

OGRES
(1000K): D
(1500K): D
(2000K): D

ORCS
(1000K): A
(1500K): A
(2000K): B

SKAVENS
(1000K): A
(1500K): A
(2000K): A

SLANNS
(1000K): B
(1500K): B
(2000K): B

UNDEADS
(1000K): A
(1500K): A
(2000K): A

VAMPIRES
(1000K): D
(1500K): D
(2000K): D

WOOD ELVES
(1000K): A
(1500K): A
(2000K): A
JimmyFantastic



Joined: Feb 06, 2007
Post   Posted: Jun 29, 2013 - 16:30 Reply with quote Back to top
You need to rethink your ratings when you only give out 3/72 ratings as medium and 35/72 as stellar!!!

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Pull down the veil - actively bad for the hobby!
mrbibitte3



Joined: Mar 28, 2013
Post   Posted: Jun 29, 2013 - 16:48 Reply with quote Back to top
Yeah, I also thought about this. I agree that from an accountant point of view, there aren't enough "medium" to create some kind of "normality"... Smile Also, I'm an eternal optimist and I see everything as stellar... but don't judge this first draft taken from my instincts (they are very poor).. I see this as a group effort and this is only a base of discussion.

Should the ratings be
A = Great
B = Standard
C = Low
D = Piss poor
?
JimmyFantastic



Joined: Feb 06, 2007
Post   Posted: Jun 29, 2013 - 16:54 Reply with quote Back to top
I think you could keep the original rating system, just be harsher how u rate stuff. At 1000 I would give A to woodies undead and amazons only for example.

_________________
Pull down the veil - actively bad for the hobby!
the_Sage



Joined: Jan 13, 2011
Post   Posted: Jun 29, 2013 - 17:12 Reply with quote Back to top
If you really want to dissociate between high and dark elves, and between goblins and flings, I'd say you need to switch from 4 point scale to 10 point scale, because there's too much nuance in there (compared to the extremes of the scale like chaos dwarf vs flings).
For instance, I think both high and dark elves are top notch. However, dark elves make better rookies than high elves do, while high elves make better 2000k teams.

Dark 9 8 8,
High elves as 7 8 9.
Wood elves 9 8 8,
pro elves 8 7 7
Slann 6 6 7,
dwarves 9, 9, 7,
goblins 6, 5, 4
halflings 5; 3; 2
chaos dwarf 9, 10, 8
chaos 7, 8, 10
nurgle 5, 7, 8
vampires 4, 5, 6
amazons 10, 8, 6
Real pact 6, 7, 8
lame pact 9. 8, 8
human 9, 8, 6
khemri 5, 5, 5
lizardman 9, 9, 8
necro 7, 8, 9
norse 9, 7, 5
ogres 3, 4, 3
orcs 10, 9, 8
skaven 9, 10, 8
undead 10, 9, 8


Last edited by the_Sage on %b %29, %2013 - %17:%Jun; edited 3 times in total
cameronhawkins



Joined: Aug 19, 2011
Post   Posted: Jun 29, 2013 - 17:15 Reply with quote Back to top
I agree with Jimmy– be harsher.

AMAZONS
(1000K): A
(1500K): B
(2000K): C

CHAOS
(1000K): C
(1500K): B
(2000K): A

CHAOS DWARVES
(1000K): A
(1500K): A
(2000K): B

CHAOS PACT
(1000K): C
(1500K): A
(2000K): B

DARK ELVES
(1000K): A
(1500K): A
(2000K): B

DWARVES
(1000K): B
(1500K): A
(2000K): B

ELVES
(1000K): B
(1500K): B
(2000K): C

GOBLINS
(1000K): C
(1500K): D
(2000K): D

HALFLINGS
(1000K): D
(1500K): D
(2000K): D

HIGH ELVES
(1000K): B
(1500K): A
(2000K): B

HUMANS
(1000K): A
(1500K): B
(2000K): C

KHEMRI
(1000K): C
(1500K): C
(2000K): C

LIZARDMAN
(1000K): B
(1500K): B
(2000K): C

NECROMANTICS
(1000K): B
(1500K): B
(2000K): C

NORSE
(1000K): B
(1500K): B
(2000K): D

NURGLE
(1000K): D
(1500K): B
(2000K): A

OGRES
(1000K): B (but only until 1100k, then they become D)
(1500K): D
(2000K): C

ORCS
(1000K): B
(1500K): A
(2000K): C

SKAVENS
(1000K): B
(1500K): A
(2000K): B

SLANNS
(1000K): D
(1500K): C
(2000K): B

UNDEADS
(1000K): A
(1500K): B
(2000K): B

UNDERWORLD (you didn't include them)
(1000K): C
(1500K): C
(2000K): D

VAMPIRES
(1000K): D
(1500K): C
(2000K): B (although, in practice, I've only seen teams at this TV with loads of stat increases, at which point they're really more of an 'A')

WOOD ELVES
(1000K): A
(1500K): A
(2000K): B
JimmyFantastic



Joined: Feb 06, 2007
Post   Posted: Jun 29, 2013 - 17:28 Reply with quote Back to top
AMAZON
(1000K): A
(1500K): B
(2000K): C

CHAOS
(1000K): C
(1500K): C
(2000K): A

CHAOS DWARF
(1000K): B
(1500K): A
(2000K): B

CHAOS PACT
(1000K): C
(1500K): C
(2000K): C

DARK ELF
(1000K): B
(1500K): B
(2000K): B

DWARF
(1000K): B
(1500K): B
(2000K): C

ELF
(1000K): C
(1500K): C
(2000K): C

GOBLIN
(1000K): D
(1500K): D
(2000K): D

HALFLING
(1000K): D
(1500K): D
(2000K): D

HIGH ELF
(1000K): C
(1500K): C
(2000K): B

HUMAN
(1000K): C
(1500K): C
(2000K): C

KHEMRI
(1000K): C
(1500K): C
(2000K): C

LIZARDMAN
(1000K): B
(1500K): B
(2000K): C

NECROMANTIC
(1000K): C
(1500K): C
(2000K): C

NORSE
(1000K): B
(1500K): C
(2000K): D

NURGLE
(1000K): D
(1500K): C
(2000K): A

OGRE
(1000K): D
(1500K): D
(2000K): D

ORC
(1000K): B
(1500K): B
(2000K): C

SKAVEN
(1000K): B
(1500K): A
(2000K): B

SLANN
(1000K): C
(1500K): C
(2000K): C

UNDEAD
(1000K): A
(1500K): B
(2000K): C

UNDERWORLD
(1000K): C
(1500K): C
(2000K): D

VAMPIRE
(1000K): D
(1500K): C
(2000K): C

WOOD ELF
(1000K): A
(1500K): A
(2000K): A

_________________
Pull down the veil - actively bad for the hobby!

Last edited by JimmyFantastic on %b %29, %2013 - %18:%Jun; edited 1 time in total
harvestmouse



Joined: May 13, 2007
Post   Posted: Jun 29, 2013 - 18:05 Reply with quote Back to top
AMAZONS
(1000K): A
(1500K): B
(2000K): B (very underated at high TV)

CHAOS
(1000K): C
(1500K): B
(2000K): A

CHAOS DWARVES
(1000K): A
(1500K): A
(2000K): B

CHAOS PACT
(1000K): C
(1500K): A
(2000K): A

DARK ELVES
(1000K): B
(1500K): A
(2000K): A

DWARVES
(1000K): B
(1500K): A
(2000K): B

ELVES
(1000K): A/B
(1500K): B
(2000K): B

GOBLINS
(1000K): C
(1500K): D
(2000K): D

HALFLINGS
(1000K): C
(1500K): D
(2000K): D

HIGH ELVES
(1000K): B
(1500K): B
(2000K): B

HUMANS
(1000K): B
(1500K): B
(2000K): C

KHEMRI
(1000K): B
(1500K): C
(2000K): D

LIZARDMAN
(1000K): B
(1500K): B
(2000K): B

NECROMANTICS
(1000K): A
(1500K): B
(2000K): C

NORSE
(1000K): A
(1500K): B
(2000K): C

NURGLE
(1000K): C
(1500K): B
(2000K): A

OGRES
(1000K): C
(1500K): D
(2000K): D

ORCS
(1000K): B
(1500K): A
(2000K): A

SKAVENS
(1000K): B
(1500K): A
(2000K): A

SLANNS
(1000K): C
(1500K): B
(2000K): B

UNDEADS
(1000K): A
(1500K): B
(2000K): B

UNDERWORLD
(1000K): C
(1500K): C
(2000K): C

VAMPIRES
(1000K): D
(1500K): C
(2000K): B

WOOD ELVES
(1000K): B
(1500K): A
(2000K): A
PaddyMick



Joined: Jan 03, 2012
Post   Posted: Jun 29, 2013 - 18:09 Reply with quote Back to top
OGRES
(1000K): A+
(1500K): A+
(2000K): A+
Overhamsteren



Joined: May 27, 2006
Post   Posted: Jun 29, 2013 - 18:25 Reply with quote Back to top
I pretty much agree with the_sage's chart.

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koadah



Joined: Mar 30, 2005
Post   Posted: Jun 29, 2013 - 21:03 Reply with quote Back to top
Black Box in case you're interested

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zakatan



Joined: May 17, 2008
Post   Posted: Jun 29, 2013 - 21:41 Reply with quote Back to top
koadah wrote:
Black Box in case you're interested


this says that at TV>1800 elves rock the box with all races around 60% wins

chaos come 7th after rats and zons in win%

Oddly enough, the highest win% at TV>2300 is held by vampires Very Happy

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koadah



Joined: Mar 30, 2005
Post   Posted: Jun 29, 2013 - 21:49 Reply with quote Back to top
zakatan wrote:
koadah wrote:
Black Box in case you're interested


this says that at TV>1800 elves rock the box with all races around 60% wins

chaos come 7th after rats and zons in win%

Oddly enough, the highest win% at TV>2300 is held by vampires Very Happy


Yeah but that is prob down to just a few top vamp teams

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Endzone



Joined: Apr 01, 2008
Post   Posted: Jun 29, 2013 - 22:35 Reply with quote Back to top
I must be missing something - what makes Undead so good at low TV - I think Orcs are better. I would have Undead as average at 1000K TV.
zakatan



Joined: May 17, 2008
Post   Posted: Jun 29, 2013 - 23:18 Reply with quote Back to top
Endzone wrote:
I must be missing something - what makes Undead so good at low TV - I think Orcs are better. I would have Undead as average at 1000K TV.


Undead rock at low tv because they have everything. Decent blitzers, st5 mighty blow, and ma7 dodge, and then a bunch of punching bags. And overall regen which keeps the numbers up while opposition is dwindling.

They used to be the favorite pick for rookie smacks not only because of the count (although the count was a big point).

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