the_Sage
Joined: Jan 13, 2011
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 Posted:
Nov 05, 2015 - 01:09 |
 
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*since blogs are very short-lived, and I intend for this to be a long-lived project, I figured I should turn it into a forum thread instead/as well.
Hi all,
Bloodbowl and teaching are two of my favorite things, so with all the noobs around these days, it's hardly surprising that I've been doing a lot of bloodbowl teaching on my stream recently. After getting the same request a couple of times already, I've decided to take on a pretty big project: record a (hopefully somewhat comprehensive) bloodbowl tutorial in parts over twitch, and (with some editing) put the whole thing on youtube as a bunch of shorter videos in a playlist.
Obviously, I'm really just one guy with one opinion. Most of what I know, I've learned from the crowdsourced wisdom that is FUMBBL. So I would greatly appreciate input from all of you guys. I've drawn up a first draft of the 'curriculum' in google docs; I've given anyone with the link permission to comment/suggest edits. If you think something important is missing, drop me a line there or here, and I'll consider putting it in. If you put your fumbbl name in the comment, I can properly attribute contributions.
Suggestions for presenting format etc. are also welcome.
The Sage |
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the_Sage
Joined: Jan 13, 2011
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| Posted:
Nov 05, 2015 - 01:10 |
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Intro & meta: What is blood bowl? (explain tabletop, FUMBBL, Cyanide, and that I do all 3). Who am I? What to expect in this series? If you’re new to the game, go to the basic tutorials. If you’ve played a bit and know what the basic rules are, and the basic skills do, you may want to skip to the intermediate section. Also, link to the rules: http://www.thenaf.net/wp-content/uploads/2013/06/CRP1.pdf
Rules differences between real BB and cyanide BB2
BloodBowl Fundamental: Etiquette! This is a multiplayer game, you play it WITH your opponent. So greeting, congratulating, banter, gg (cyanide rant), tune down the whining, laughing at both sides' failures. Concessions! (cyanide rant) fouling?
Basic level tutorials (anyone with, say 50 games or more may want to skip this)
Basic actions. Move, Block, Blitz, (mention that the handoff, pass, and foul will be discussed later). MA
Blocking mechaincs and skills. ST value, assists, number of block dice (½ , 1, 2 die; mention 3 but don’t go into it here). Block die results. Block, dodge, wrestle, tackle, guard
Turnovers: Failed gfi’s, failed dodges, failed blocks, fumbled or inaccurate passes, failed catches.
Agility & mobility (elf BS): AG dodging, gfi's, passing, tackle zones.
reroll skills: dodge (& tackle), sure hands, sure feet, pass. Modifier skills: accurate, two heads, break tackle. Anti-mobility skills: prehensile tail, tentacles, diving tackle
Races (10 in BB2, 24 in real BB), Rules (link to the pdf). Note rules differences in BB2 (is there a list?). Briefly mention the qualities of the races, but don’t go into detail (maybe later, in a follow-up series). Go more deeply into the orc and dark elf roster at least, as we’ll use them for our bash & dash learning examples.
Intermediate level tutorials (people with a few hundred games’ experience may want to skip these)
Positioning skills (frenzy, sidestep, stand firm, grab, fend)
Damage: AV, armor rolls, injury rolls, mb, claw, po, stunty, thick skull, niggles.Fouling (and when not to)
Probabilities (Rerolls, 2d6 - armor injury, shifting distributions)
Turnover 2; Risk management, turn optimization and reroll conservation. (move/standup before die rolls dodge with skill before dodge without skill, 2die with block before 2die without block, etc. Avoid loner dierolls if possible. dodge with skill instead of gfi. Also: where to risk failure, and where to place safely moved players in case of failure.
Big guys and negatraits: Loner, Bonehead, Wild Animal, Really Stupid. Risk of using big guys& the value of pro for them. Also, the value of not activating; expecially roadblock pieces. Explain 3die block here too.
kicking off: kick, kick-off return, kick-off results defending blitz, riot to score
sacking: leap, wrestle, tackle, strip ball (& sure hands). Value of the half-die sack
miscellaneous skills: stab, juggernaut (cyanide rant), jump up, pass block. More? Multiple Block (Stab ST5+block), shadowing, nerves of steel
Defensive setups (rule of 5, force center, asymmetrical). Mention OTTDs for later
positioning 1; on offense: cageing & screening (X cage (guard corners), sideline cage (sidestep), loose screen, double screen). If you’re somewhat advanced already, and really want to learn to position well, go play lizardman without break tackle or mighty blow.
positioning 2; on defense: Manmarking, guardlocking, passive defense/column defense.
Quick overview of all skills and what they do in one or two sentences.
Inducements. What are they, what options are great, what options are not. Also, what’s implemented in cyanide, and what’s not
stadium enhancements. What do they do, and which race should get which one(s)?
Advanced level tutorials (worth a look even if you’ve been playing for the better part of forever)
The Gameplan: At this point you should be able to form ‘the bigger picture’. When to push to score, when to keep players back, what will my opponent need to do next turn, what do I need to do next turn.getting a player in scoring range
clock management, stalling, pressure, (when (not) to use the wizard)
2-1 grind, stalling with orcs vs elves.
Positioning 3: chainpushes, crowdsurfs, not getting surfed, OTTD, anti-OTTD. (odds of halfdie surf, inc juggernaut)
The metagame: team management, skill selection (refer to fumbbl strategy section), reroll count (cyanide rant!), team value management. Again, too much to handle exhaustively, refer to fumbbl strategy section for more info.
Bloodbowl zen. dealing with loss and luck. Perception/confirmation bias (skill vs luck, dice rolled vs rolls succeeded. BB is a system that hinges on 10-50% rolls, which can be very fickle. As a result it will seem like the RNG is bad, but the GAME system was designed to be fickle, and any good die roller will give fickle results within that system), laughing at nuffle, bloodbowl zen.
Wrapping/ Summing up
play BB2, BB1, play fumbbl, play tabletop, whatever you do... If you want to learn great bloodbowl, it’s not possible to do so just from a tutorial. Playing against good coaches certainly helps; you can find most of those on fumbbl in my experience. Watching their games live or in replays also really helps especially with commentary from coach and/or specataors; you can do so on fumbbl too, or of course you can do so by following this YT channel or watching my stream: www.twitch.tv/the_Sage_BB |
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Last edited by the_Sage on %b %05, %2015 - %01:%Nov; edited 1 time in total |
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the_Sage
Joined: Jan 13, 2011
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| Posted:
Nov 05, 2015 - 01:29 |
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tussock
Joined: May 29, 2011
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| Posted:
Nov 05, 2015 - 06:31 |
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I guess if I was doing it, which I'm not, so good on you, Sage.
Basics.
1: Start with the goal of each game. Get more TDs than your opponent, or at least the same number.
Note some teams are better at this than others, like Undead and Zons early on are massively easier, and the Stunties start very bad and just get worse. A lot of the teams are just plain hard work, there's only 8 teams have an overall winning record at low TV (Undead, Zon, Lizard, Chorf, Dorf, Norse, Necro, Skaven, and Woodies).
Mention Players vs Coaches.
Mention SPPs, and gaining a skill at 6 SPP, because team building is awesome fun and the longer-term goal. Also mention the inevitability of player death and replacement.
I'd recommend teaching people to play with Undead as the grind/foul/run team and maybe Skaven as the dodge/screen/handoff team. Orcs are a bit rubbish these days, by comparison, and Dark Elves a are pretty advanced team strategy-wise. Gives all the main skills, the AG 4 vs AG 3 dodges, a big guy, slow vs fast, high AV vs low AV.
It's a dice game: you roll dice to succeed at stuff, lots of things don't work. Mention the block dice.
Turnovers: it's critical people start out thinking about the failures and the things to avoid, and also covering for failure as they go. Moving-team Knockdowns, failed pick ups, dropping the ball. You may move each player once, but you will usually fail something along the way before you can finish.
Good time to bring up armour rolls. Not only do you end your team's turn, you get hurt doing it.
Also a good time to bring up Team RR, and Player/Skill RR. Note that safer things work even better with a waiting RR, and they often fail on less-safe things.
2: Moving your players (move, blitz, foul), moving into contact, putting people in range of scoring, the GFI.
.. be clear that movement without rolling dice should be done before any dice rolling when possible. Safe moves first!
.. note that you must pick up the ball when moving onto it, and reiterate that failing is a turnover. Show pre-screening the pick up and it failing in a safe way.
.. note that Dodges and GFIs cause knockdowns, and reiterate that knockdowns are turnovers.
.. demonstrate bad play with a snaked 2+ dodge before the safe moves, or a foul ejection.
3: Blocking with players (block, blitz), and the importance of the 2d block.
.. the block dice, and the skills that change them.
.. note that failed blocks cause knockdowns, and reiterate that it's a turnover.
.. note that various good blocks are much safer than dodging, but that they still fail several times per game and will use up RR and cause turnovers. Please show someone rolling quad skulls.
.. assists are easier to explain with less models around, especially early.
.. Give someone 2 SPP.
.. note that players do not have to block, and are valuable TZs just standing there.
.. demonstrate bad play with a useless 1d skull that frees up an assist.
.. Blitz someone into the crowd, explain Frenzy and the increased danger zone.
4: Tansferring the ball between players (handoff, pass) probably only so as to score.
.. reiterate that dropping a catch is a turnover, so don't do it if you don't need to.
.. mention that passes go wild and fumbles are turnovers, and passing mostly ruins your game, but it also makes late TDs possible that otherwise are not.
.. give someone 1 SPP, and someone else 3 SPP.
.. demonstrate bad play with a pass that scatters into the crowd and gives the opponent an easy TD. Also demonstrate an easy interception for a Gutter and 2 SPP.
5: Position. Go over the positions you used in the move and block and handover tutorials.
.. A basic offence and defence setup, why the players are standing where they are at the kickoff.
.. Why screening the pickup and other actions with the ball is important.
.. The X-Cage, and why it works, and why some cages aren't (in a TZ is not a cage).
.. How safe assists can lead to a much better result, and the magic of Guard.
.. How you can cover against unusual failures and still help this turn.
.. How a sweeper can make a late blitz to cover a fast break.
.. How sufficiently advanced players can easily take a handoff and score, or draw a blitz away from your ball carrier.
Caging and screening has to be in the basics, coaches that don't do them get destroyed.
6: The clock. How many turns you have to score, how many turns you're giving the opposing team.
.. The 2-1 grind, why it works, what it means to not score and stay safe.
.. Having players in a position to score, the value of some pushbacks on defence.
.. How defence changes as the end of the half approaches, level of commitment.
.. Make sure you check the clock!
.. All strategic positioning is based around clock control.
7: The skills, and what they do to the game.
.. Why you need a wrackler or two, why everyone important is a blodger in the first place.
.. Why everyone takes CPOMB, why you should too, and why you always Pile On.
.. Wardancers and Frogs and why your cage should be made of Guard.
.. Dump Off and why you shouldn't (and why you maybe should anyway).
.. Elf Catchers are awesome.
.. Nurgle team stuff.
.. SS/DT, and how to push them away.
.. The magic of the SS/Blodge Guard.
Intermediate is when to try low-odds or even certain-failure dice. Mention Goblins, Flings, and Ogres, and how it's often all they've got.
.. Talk about Loner Big Guys for a whole video, and how the best thing they can often do is nothing at all.
.. Goblin teams, really, Stunty and Chainsaws and B&C and Bombadier and Trolls and Always Hungry and SS/DT.
.. How low-odds stuff can still work, and when it can be worth trying.
.. Abandoning a broken and stalled cage and running it to at least be in range, and why you probably shouldn't against most teams. How to be ready to punish that.
.. When is a 1d block worth a shot, when is a -2d blitz after dodging worth a shot, when is a 4+ Zombie dodge actually going to help, when might you reasonably risk a player's life for a couple of GFI.
.. How and when to punt. It's a vid all of it's own.
.. The magic and folly that is the TTM, and how it's perfectly safe to throw stunties at distant cages (except for the poor stunty, open field is safer for them).
.. When you should totally throw a long bomb pass, because it's all you've got and can't hurt.
.. How you can stop and change plans if you lose your RR early, how much the team RR changes the odds of various complex plays. How 2+ will fail very quickly more often than not without it.
.. How bad the odds of some things really are.
Advanced stuff is chainpushes, chain surfs, and more detail on how the odds of various complex options come together, how player/skill RR are vastly better on high stats and with the +1 skills, what AG 6 can do for you, what a ST 7 can mean for a team.
The Zen of making your opponent roll more bad dice by rolling less dice, which gives you more good dice to roll.
All that 1-turning magic that every team can technically do to beat the 2-1 grind.
Specific team strategies. Frogs and Vamps play very differently, but each team could go over which parts of the game apply to them and which skills are unusually valuable. |
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Beanchilla
Joined: Sep 20, 2015
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Nov 05, 2015 - 06:59 |
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Not as detailed a selection as above, which is definitely solid, but I think, as a newbie myself, there are many tutorials already covering the basics of tackle-zones, blitzing and things like that on Blood Bowl 2. If you were to use the fummbbl client it might make things a bit more beneficial since it would warm up players to fumbbl but if you're sticking with BB2 since it is so popular right now then I'd suggest making those basics very quick videos.
One thing that I think is where people start to enjoy this game is the weird meta and interesting team dynamics. This is the stuff I'm still learning. How do you see that bigger picture? How can you tell whether it's worth going for it or not at a certain point. When is it smart to try and score? I tend to score too quickly but I am not sure how to tell when I should go slower or not.
Things like that are super interesting so if you could fly through the basics and make a sort of "Blood Bowl Tactics" series, I'd be so in.
Either way, subbed! Looking forward to the tutorials. |
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the_Sage
Joined: Jan 13, 2011
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| Posted:
Nov 05, 2015 - 16:28 |
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Wow Tussock, that was a lot of feedback, thanks a bunch! And Beanchilla; good point about the need for intermediate/advanced tutorials being greater than the need for beginner ones; I suppose I might consider making those first. |
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licker
Joined: Jul 10, 2009
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| Posted:
Nov 05, 2015 - 16:33 |
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I think you can do a real quick and dirty 'intro to BB' tutorial which would break the rules that I was thinking of, but at least would get the super basic information out there. I'd do it more as a 'here's some pdfs you should read if you are totally new' and then cover the concepts rather than explain the details.
That would be like 10m maybe 15m, and from there at least you have a starting place for the totally new to get info from before they move into the other topics. |
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SquirrelDude
Joined: Mar 22, 2015
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Nov 05, 2015 - 17:00 |
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Have a look at cKnoor's series Blood Bowl tutorial videos on youtube (can't link, at work), and see if there is anything on them that you would cover differently or assessments that you disagree with. |
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Loew
Joined: Feb 02, 2005
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| Posted:
Nov 05, 2015 - 17:10 |
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no time for a detailed answer, but maybe include a link to this in the beginner and intermediate tutorials? The Taouch of Bloodbowl
I still think it is one of the best guides written about the game and it's a bit hidden in the help section |
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huff
Joined: Dec 19, 2009
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| Posted:
Nov 05, 2015 - 17:56 |
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First thing first if you are playing: Print/Bookmark the rule book. |
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Quinze
Joined: Apr 05, 2013
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Nov 06, 2015 - 09:55 |
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I agree with Beanchilla - there's lots of guides that cover the individual "pieces" of Blood Bowl - how to build a team, how to set up tackle zones, etc. but very little on synthesizing it all together.
Stuff like the challenge puzzles on BBTactics are some of the few examples I've found that push you to think about how to actually apply all you've learned in different scenarios. Those sorts of things I guess would fall under the category of "tactical" thinking - figuring out the best odds of accomplishing something within the span of a single turn. Spectating games and trying to second-guess helps a lot to practice, but a guide on it couldn't hurt.
The other bigger thing is "strategic" thinking - how to think a turn or even a whole half ahead. This is a bigger jump I feel than just the tactical thinking. On any given turn, you can easily evaluate the course of action with the best odds given the immediate context - but how do you get to that point? How do you steer the game in a direction where you minimize the impact of chance? I'm not sure it can even be taught but it definitely would be an interesting guide. |
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nufflehatesme
Joined: Nov 02, 2011
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Nov 06, 2015 - 10:43 |
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could wreckage's guide be incorporated as a reference point in your vids? |
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Uedder
Joined: Aug 03, 2010
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Nov 06, 2015 - 14:43 |
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Some "interactive" puzzles might be great. Like, present a situation and ask the audience "how would you do it"? Leave a pause to think then give the answer and show/motivate it. |
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the_Sage
Joined: Jan 13, 2011
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| Posted:
Nov 06, 2015 - 18:30 |
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I could certianly link to those bbtactics puzzles as 'homework', but think simply watching good coaches play will (especially if they, or other specs, explain/analyze their reasoning) helps a lot too, there.
I'll gladly incorporate a list of other useful (good) BB learning references.
Wreckage guide
cKnoor tutorials
FUMBBL strategy section |
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akaRenton
Joined: Apr 15, 2008
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Nov 06, 2015 - 19:23 |
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A few of the plasmoids playbooks are decent, though admitedly only a handful.
Best advice I can think of is dig through your cupboards for a computer game manual. They tend to stick to the same basic structure, and it's a tried and tested way of teaching how to play a game. Would transfer neatly to stategic guides. |
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