Kinks
Joined: Feb 28, 2007
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  Posted:
Nov 23, 2021 - 18:55 |
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There has been lots of changes and rebalancing in BB over the years. Many fundamentals have always worked well and never changed (block dice), whilst others seem to get tweaked every update (skills). Re-drafting is effectively a completely new rule rather than an adjustment to longstanding rules. Is it here to stay? |
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MattDakka
Joined: Oct 09, 2007
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  Posted:
Nov 23, 2021 - 19:19 |
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I hope designers will realize it sucks and remove it in the next ruleset. |
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Bellenrode
Joined: May 02, 2021
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  Posted:
Nov 23, 2021 - 19:45 |
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The whole point of re-drafting is to reset teams, while allowing you to keep some players at the same time, which is better - in my opinion - than starting completely fresh each season. It also incentivizes people to stay in the game after they developed their team somewhat instead of reseting or swapping teams for whatever reason. |
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MattDakka
Joined: Oct 09, 2007
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  Posted:
Nov 23, 2021 - 19:58 |
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The problem is that Re-draft is bad for teams starting without core skills, such as Vampires, Khorne, Nurgle, Lizardmen while doesn't affect as much teams starting with many core skills.
There were better and simpler ways to keep TV growth under control without penalizing the teams needing some development to be playable. |
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razmus
Joined: Jun 23, 2017
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  Posted:
Nov 23, 2021 - 20:10 |
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MattDakka wrote: | [...]There were better and simpler ways to keep TV growth under control without penalizing the teams needing some development to be playable. |
Asking as a coach who didn't play BB for a long time, what are the other, better and simpler ways? I've heard aging rolls for players was used for a time. BB 2016 leagues had a system of redrafting similar to the new redrafting system, which seemed to work really well for our local TT league. What else was tried? What else could/should be tried?
(I'm asking because the original poll question asks about adjustments/changes anticipated in the next version. What might those changes be? What was used before to solve 'this' problem? What are the good/bad/ugly of each?) |
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MattDakka
Joined: Oct 09, 2007
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  Posted:
Nov 23, 2021 - 20:12 |
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Not incoming changes, just an example of an alternative way to limit TV growth in leagues:
- No Season Re-draft;
- random MVP;
- Hard TV cap: that means that your League Commissioner decides the TV cap. It could be something between 1500-2000 TV (it's up to how much you want to let teams grow, if there are many tier 2 a higher TV cap is better, but it should not be higher than 2000).
If a team after a match has a TV higher than the TV cap some players must be fired in order to adjust it to the TV cap or lower;
- max +1 stat per each characteristic. Max MA 9. This should keep the stat freaks reasonably in check;
- Optionally, if you want to keep the stat freaks furthermore in check, you could decrease the level ups/skill slots to 5 or 4.
This way no matter how long the league lasts, teams and stat freaks will not become too strong.
Teams such as Vampires could be played without firing players after just 7 or 15 games. |
Last edited by MattDakka on %b %23, %2021 - %20:%Nov; edited 2 times in total |
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koadah
Joined: Mar 30, 2005
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  Posted:
Nov 23, 2021 - 20:19 |
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Bram
Joined: Jan 04, 2008
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  Posted:
Nov 23, 2021 - 20:25 |
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MattDakka wrote: | I hope designers will realize it sucks and remove it in the next ruleset. |
+1
And let them get rid of PA characteristic too as they are at it. Back to using AG for passing! |
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Kinks
Joined: Feb 28, 2007
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  Posted:
Nov 23, 2021 - 20:30 |
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razmus wrote: | Asking as a coach who didn't play BB for a long time, what are the other, better and simpler ways? I've heard aging rolls for players was used for a time. BB 2016 leagues had a system of redrafting similar to the new redrafting system, which seemed to work really well for our local TT league. What else was tried? What else could/should be tried? |
Aging and TV were introduced together if I recall. Before that there was no hard mechanism to stunt team growth. TR (Team Rating) was based on SPPs, so a legend could continued to earn SPPS, but gain no additional skills - bloating the TR (I think it was 1 TR per 5 SPPS, the base TR being 100). Also, life was much deadlier, Claws, RSC, Mighty Blow (+1/+1), DP (+2/+2), etc. The injury table 2D6 was 10 = BH, 11 = SI, 12 = Dead, which coupled with the skills mentioned made it more likely players would die. |
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Dalfort
Joined: Jun 23, 2008
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  Posted:
Nov 23, 2021 - 20:36 |
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Redrafting is far better than the old Aging rules, at least the coach has some control over limiting the team now. Personally I like the PA Stat it reminds me of 2nd Edition, it may need tweaking for some Races (I.E. Elves) as they should be far better at Passing (imo).
That said I think the rules should be given a good run before we should expect them to be updated/re-vamped again. |
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koadah
Joined: Mar 30, 2005
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  Posted:
Nov 23, 2021 - 21:04 |
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uzkulak
Joined: Mar 30, 2004
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  Posted:
Nov 23, 2021 - 21:48 |
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well, people don't really like any artificial system for restraining the growth of their team, but they also dont like playing absurdly big teams that just stomp them all the time, so there needs to be a balance. Personally I think so many of the new rules are tailored towards the redraft rules, including skill progression, creation of fluff skills just to allow the random concept to work etc - I cant see a significant change happening soon as it would require a complete overhaul of the ruleset. And that's a lot of work.
I should add some people do like having big teams that stomp everyone else - but those people probably shouldnt be in charge of designing the rules. |
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koadah
Joined: Mar 30, 2005
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  Posted:
Nov 23, 2021 - 22:44 |
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mekutata
Joined: May 03, 2015
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  Posted:
Nov 23, 2021 - 23:11 |
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The way I understand it is already adjusted by all leagues based on what they desire.
Some people won't be happy on some numbers that christer will decide on within C. But that's a slightly different topic.
But in general leagues will likely profit from a system that enables new teams to join and compete. |
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MattDakka
Joined: Oct 09, 2007
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  Posted:
Nov 23, 2021 - 23:17 |
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Well, if you want to enable new teams joining a league to compete the Commissioner can allow coaches to artificially "build" them to the desired TV from scratch (maybe without allowing to take Secondary skills and stat+).
No need to have a Season Re-Draft system. |
Last edited by MattDakka on %b %24, %2021 - %12:%Nov; edited 2 times in total |
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