koadah
Joined: Mar 30, 2005
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 Posted:
Jul 02, 2023 - 10:50 |
 
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| Joost wrote: | | koadah wrote: | | PurpleChest wrote: | | The_Murker wrote: | | a fabulous post about empathy |
I 100% support this post, excellent empathy. |
Understanding isn't necessarily the same thing as empathy.  |
I thought it was closely related, in that empathy is not necessarily sympathy. I.e. you can not condone certain behaviour while being empathic about where it stems from. English is not my first language though, I could be wrong. |
The way I see it, empathy is more about feelings that knowledge.
Though people will say "do you understand how I feel?"
e.g.
I understand that people may get upset when they get bad dice.
I understand that they may get upset because they really wanted to win.
I may sympathise with them because I understand that they may become upset.
But I wouldn't empathise with them. 
It's the old...
Person A: "How would you feel if it was you?"
Person B: *shrugs* "I wouldn't care." |
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O[L]C 2016 Swiss! - April ---- All Star Bowl - Teams of Stars - 2 more teams needed |
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RDaneel
Joined: Feb 24, 2023
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Jul 02, 2023 - 10:59 |
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Empathy for me is putting yourself in the other person's shoes.
I can be empathetic but if by putting myself in the other person's shoes I feel only hatred and sarcasm what I will send back to the other side of the field will be hatred and sarcasm. Being empathetic does not mean being a saint. And unfortunately empathy is not something you learn. It is usually part of our character.
There are some coaches who can be very rough, and let me tell you that I find it very sad when a very strong coach brags about winning a game against someone less strong than him, but it is even more regrettable to see certain comments from very strong coaches who lose maybe a very hard-fought game against a less strong opponent and not only don't give him any compliments but mock him for the bad way they judge he played!
Fumbbl is a game that generates a lot of adrenaline. Sometimes people lose their minds. |
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JanMattys
Joined: Feb 29, 2004
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Jul 02, 2023 - 11:25 |
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| RDaneel wrote: |
There are some coaches who can be very rough, and let me tell you that I find it very sad when a very strong coach brags about winning a game against someone less strong than him, but it is even more regrettable to see certain comments from very strong coaches who lose maybe a very hard-fought game against a less strong opponent and not only don't give him any compliments but mock him for the bad way they judge he played! |
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koadah
Joined: Mar 30, 2005
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Jul 02, 2023 - 12:00 |
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| RDaneel wrote: | Empathy for me is putting yourself in the other person's shoes.
I can be empathetic but if by putting myself in the other person's shoes I feel only hatred and sarcasm what I will send back to the other side of the field will be hatred and sarcasm. Being empathetic does not mean being a saint. And unfortunately empathy is not something you learn. It is usually part of our character. |
But how sure are you that you are "empathising" with their real emotions?
In text chat it very easy to misinterpret people's words, meaning, intentions. |
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O[L]C 2016 Swiss! - April ---- All Star Bowl - Teams of Stars - 2 more teams needed |
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koadah
Joined: Mar 30, 2005
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Jul 02, 2023 - 12:01 |
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| JanMattys wrote: | | RDaneel wrote: |
There are some coaches who can be very rough, and let me tell you that I find it very sad when a very strong coach brags about winning a game against someone less strong than him, but it is even more regrettable to see certain comments from very strong coaches who lose maybe a very hard-fought game against a less strong opponent and not only don't give him any compliments but mock him for the bad way they judge he played! |
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Have you seen the light?  |
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O[L]C 2016 Swiss! - April ---- All Star Bowl - Teams of Stars - 2 more teams needed |
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JanMattys
Joined: Feb 29, 2004
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Jul 02, 2023 - 12:32 |
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| koadah wrote: | | JanMattys wrote: | | RDaneel wrote: |
There are some coaches who can be very rough, and let me tell you that I find it very sad when a very strong coach brags about winning a game against someone less strong than him, but it is even more regrettable to see certain comments from very strong coaches who lose maybe a very hard-fought game against a less strong opponent and not only don't give him any compliments but mock him for the bad way they judge he played! |
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Have you seen the light? |
Even dense people learn given enough time, and a dead horse can only be beaten that much.
Also, I dislike not naming names and being passive aggressive. Either you call people out or you don’t. |
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RDaneel
Joined: Feb 24, 2023
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Jul 02, 2023 - 13:25 |
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| koadah wrote: |
In text chat it very easy to misinterpret people's words, meaning, intentions. |
well... if someone is silent during the whole game he doesn't even say "gratz" to you when you score and at the end of the game in the chat he lets loose, criticizes your game, says you're lucky, that you won undeservedly you get the suspicion that he's broken with anger.
If you start a game against a coach and you ask him (sometimes I do and I assure you I ask in a polite way) "may I ask you if you intend to use timeout all the time or are you willing to allow it to go beyond 4 minutes only once during the whole game?" and he replies (I swear it happened to me) "shut up. think about playing and don't break up," well here too you have the "very slight" suspicion that you are dealing with a person of a certain type.
But in general you are right: chat is not enough to judge a person, you have to be careful. It happened to me that I interpreted a coach's silence as a sign of meanness, and I was wrong, and I regret it. |
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The_Great_Gobbo
Joined: Aug 04, 2014
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Jul 02, 2023 - 13:37 |
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Empathy! Empathy! Dey all az it em fer me! Err ang on dat joke doan't wurk. Ignore diz post an karry on whingin. Does yew no wot iz betta den whingin? Revenge! Bottle dat ate an let it simmer fer months, speek nicely ter der person oo ronged yew but assasssinate dere character in private, wotch dere gamez ter catch em wivowt a key player den BAM! Kikk em inna nuts, steel all dere gold an rite an amazin blog abowt ow yew did it. Dat iz ow yew honor Nuffle an er arch mage Christer. |
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Mingoose
Joined: Jul 28, 2016
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Jul 02, 2023 - 16:45 |
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| Grod wrote: | Would it help if we re-introduced this to the latest version of the client?
https://fumbbl.com/help:Luck
That way we could unambiguously boil down whether someone had been diced or not to one number? |
I support this but we need to have a sophisticated algo that can accurately describe the “subtle dicingâ€. The “subtle dicing†allows you better than average dice overall but terrible dice in every move that counts. Or nothing but straight POWs against Zons but not a single armor break. My favorite is when you need 3 2+ dodges for a blitz on the ball, and you roll a 1 on every first roll burning all 3 of your rerolls before double skull on the block. |
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Ridik700
Joined: Feb 11, 2023
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Jul 03, 2023 - 11:34 |
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theres a lot of people who only talk to say how ridiculous is the luck. Just stupid comments really. Like you should buy the lottery ticket or something. I imagine they are probably like 12 years old |
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Sp00keh
Joined: Dec 06, 2011
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Jul 03, 2023 - 12:43 |
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I think most of the time commenting on luck is just whining
You've got yourself in a bad situation and now are paying for it and probably gonna lose
(I do complain more than I should though, I know...)
Sometimes luck is a genuine issue though. I've had a game where I failed all 9 pickup attempts, I never managed to get the ball in-hand. Can't win a game if you can't pick it up, no matter how good you are.
There's plenty of other examples of similar stuff where the dice just deny you
There's also other things where a single dice roll will decide the game.
Those type of things aren't good, because its so pivotal. It won't balance out in the long run (like block dice might do for example)
You're either going to make it or you don't, and that's that. And, it won't be reflected in dice stats because it's just one roll out of the 10's or 100's of others that you also do
If you do make the roll, you win and are lucky
If you don't make the roll, you lose and are unlucky
There's no point getting salty about it though, because it's just dice |
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badger89
Joined: Jun 03, 2014
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Jul 03, 2023 - 13:23 |
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| Ridik700 wrote: | | theres a lot of people who only talk to say how ridiculous is the luck. Just stupid comments really. Like you should buy the lottery ticket or something. I imagine they are probably like 12 years old |
If you have ridiculous luck you should be a lottery ticket |
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PurpleChest
Joined: Oct 25, 2003
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I refuse to live in a binary world, i think its responsible for a lot of the ills in current life.
Some people whine about dice, some people are just discussing the dice of the game. i find it kind of odd to play for an hour with someone and NOT remark about the dice if they are interesting, game changing or well outside of normal expected parameters.
And that counts for my dice, and my opponents. I (probably lie to myself) feel i am as likely to mention the opponents poor dice, or good dice as i am my own. After all those rolls were a shared experience. Does that always have to mean whining? to some the mere mention of dice triggers them and to others, like me, its perfectly normal.
So i don't think there will ever be 'an answer', and we should accept the plurality of peoples experiences and habits.
if someone types/says 'man, my dice suck and you've been really lucky', i dont think any crime has been committed. i ask myself, do i agree? and then i respond, a quick 'yeah, but thats bb' or 'yup, ive been lucky, guess its my day' usually leads to a lot less rage and hard feelings than 'STFU you ass, how dare you remind me dice exist when i am triumphing here?' if i dont agree then a 'well, i dont agree, but then maybe i wouldnt right?' is again likely to lead to a better outcome than 'no, its you, get gud'.
That said though there are times to burst the bubble, if the opposition is totally unrealistic AND you feel you can get somewhere and maybe help them see that, but if they come over closed minded and not open to feedback, what is it going to achieve? does it really matter if your opponent felt you diced them when you didnt? doers it really hurt YOU that much that some other human think you won by luck, not skill? |
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Barbarus hic ego sum, quia non intelligor illis -Ovid
I am a barbarian here because i am not understood by anyone |
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Ridik700
Joined: Feb 11, 2023
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Jul 03, 2023 - 14:40 |
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the kind of people I am talking about only talk about their own bad luck or their opponents (i.e. my) good luck. they say nothing about their own good luck. they are blind to it. It just comes across like they are either stupid or malevolent. Either way their stupid comments like "you only roll pows" detract from my enjoyment of the game. |
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JanMattys
Joined: Feb 29, 2004
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Jul 03, 2023 - 22:10 |
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| PurpleChest wrote: | | Wise stuff |
Excellet post as always. I wonder if (and if the answer is yes, how) you can really keep this cool, rational and enviable attitude when things get hot on the pitch. 
I'm not being sarcastic. I know I sometimes struggle to keep my cool and I have to periodically remind myself that I play for fun and nothing else.
Case in point, I run a private league of friends and I have decided that every time I win the league, I retire the winning team and take a light team to detox. Last time I won with undead I choose goblins next (and got happily steamrolled), and after my recent win with cds, I'm going to get either snotling or woodies. Just to get accustomed to bad casualties and general pain. Otherwise my competitive side gets the best of me and I start caring about winning a bit too much. Can't help it. |
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