FUMBBL :: Online Blood Bowl League

Joined: Dec 29, 2008

Posted: Mar 30, 2011 - 18:50

SG is fine for a guy who took DP on doubles and gets A skills normally: halflings, snotlings, goblins and skinks (to a lesser extent). If you've already committed a doubles roll to DP, a normal roll for SG isn't too bad, since there's nothing more insulting than being called off for not even a stun, on a [1][1] or a [2][2], sometimes even [3][3] or [4][4] if you're fouling something without assists (the 0-assist foul on the legend CW is still often worth the risk).

I have yet to take it on any player, for any team, except in the beta testing.

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Ruiner

Joined: Mar 25, 2010

Posted: Mar 30, 2011 - 18:53

Every skill has a purpose, Sneaky Git is just an insurance so you at least stun someone with a foul without getting the boot.

It's nice to have on a fouler but something you don't really want to spam, pretty much like most skills besides dodge and block.

shadow46x2

Joined: Nov 22, 2003

Posted: Mar 30, 2011 - 19:00

PainState wrote:

shadow46x2 wrote:

PainState wrote:

The skill is designed to fail. The whole purpose of the skill is fail at fouling so you will not get sent off.

with this same mentality, pass is designed to fail...catch is designed to fail...pro is designed to fail....

if you stop thinking that the skill is designed to fail, and start thinking that the skill is designed to help prevent failure....you'll have a better appreciation for it...

Well that is true..BUT those skills give you free rerolls, an added benefit, the odds if you need those skills are usually way better than a 1 in 6, more benefit. And the theory behind them is that they make a postional player better at what his roll is...Git does not make you better at fouling, It just saves your pixels the humilation of getting sent off. Thus it does not make you better.

Or a better way to say it...catch gives you better odds to catch the ball, a obvious benefit...Same applies to every skill with a reroll or possible reroll like pro...GIT gives you only one benefit, you dont get sent off when you fail a foul, but it also does not make you a better fouller.

pass and catch don't make you a better player....they don't modify your dice rolls in the slightest....you are right in that it gives you a reroll...a second chance which could end up being a second failure....so no, they don't make you any better...

additionally....SG actually *DOES* indirectly modify the dice roll by completely negating a potential failure(ejection below armor penetration), and by making the ejection range smaller(shortening the band from 2-12 to AV-12)....

again....stop thinking the skill is catered towards failure....and stop applying double standards to the skill...

--j

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koadah

Joined: Mar 30, 2005

Posted: Mar 30, 2011 - 19:06

shadow46x2 wrote:

PainState wrote:

shadow46x2 wrote:

PainState wrote:

The skill is designed to fail. The whole purpose of the skill is fail at fouling so you will not get sent off.

with this same mentality, pass is designed to fail...catch is designed to fail...pro is designed to fail....

if you stop thinking that the skill is designed to fail, and start thinking that the skill is designed to help prevent failure....you'll have a better appreciation for it...

Well that is true..BUT those skills give you free rerolls, an added benefit, the odds if you need those skills are usually way better than a 1 in 6, more benefit. And the theory behind them is that they make a postional player better at what his roll is...Git does not make you better at fouling, It just saves your pixels the humilation of getting sent off. Thus it does not make you better.

Or a better way to say it...catch gives you better odds to catch the ball, a obvious benefit...Same applies to every skill with a reroll or possible reroll like pro...GIT gives you only one benefit, you dont get sent off when you fail a foul, but it also does not make you a better fouller.

pass and catch don't make you a better player....they don't modify your dice rolls in the slightest....you are right in that it gives you a reroll...a second chance which could end up being a second failure....so no, they don't make you any better...

additionally....SG actually *DOES* indirectly modify the dice roll by completely negating a potential failure(ejection below armor penetration), and by making the ejection range smaller(shortening the band from 2-12 to AV-12)....

again....stop thinking the skill is catered towards failure....and stop applying double standards to the skill...

--j

Wow. Are you guys actually speaking different languages?

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Glorin

Joined: Aug 18, 2009

Posted: Mar 30, 2011 - 19:15

I'd take SG before DP most times. My fouls get sent off easily more than half the time, with a KO at best. But I doubt most foulers get sent off as much as I do >_>

nin

Joined: May 27, 2005

Posted: Mar 30, 2011 - 19:22

As far as I understand it, (Claw)pomb strategy is to blitz with the killer and then retreat, or protect him if he used PO and is prone. That way you can't foul with many assists... but it's a 3+ skills guy laying prone and you have Sneaky Git. Any stunty can foul in the middle of a cage if you cancel defensive assists and it will usually worth the try (cheap player that only gets banned if breacks armor).

So it could help Elves at times but also teams with stunty guys... like Orcs or Lizardmen, two teams that would love to get a shot at any Clawpomb.

(Not saying that it's the perfect balancing skill, or the rock to that scissor, just pointing it has some uses)

Carnis

Joined: Feb 03, 2009

Posted: Mar 30, 2011 - 19:34

Mara Jade disapproves of this thread.

It's an awesome skill, you can foul without avail, it does take a bit of the "tactics" out of fouling though.

It's a bit pointless without DP though.

Garion

Joined: Aug 19, 2009

Posted: Mar 30, 2011 - 20:08

When combined with DP though it brings a little bit more to it.

Because you are best off fouling when you reduce the opponents av to 6 (with however many assists is required for that player) that way you are roughly twice as likely to hurt someone as you are to being sent off. Then if you roll a double 6 you can opt not to use DP and you will not get sent off if you like.

But is it worth the TV increase in an environment like black box? I'm not sure.

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belshamharoth

Joined: Jan 15, 2008

Posted: Mar 30, 2011 - 20:11

skinks who dont have access to dp but do have sg make it useful enough imo. I use it as a normal skink but it during a turn i happen to fell a good enough player ill run him over for a no assist foul. Chances are it wont work but he wont be thrown out so makes it a chance at a injury roll on their star with my lamer who will go pop soon enough anyway. i liken it to pro or loner rerolling in usefulness but i talk for skinks only not in general

Wraith

Joined: Aug 02, 2003

Posted: Mar 30, 2011 - 20:12

It's definitely a TV bloat in [B] or MM, especially on a non-stunty, but in traditional play (like leagues or tournaments, where TV management is not paramount) it's a decent skill selection.

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DustBunny

Joined: Oct 14, 2008

Posted: Mar 30, 2011 - 20:23

With ogres, i'd definately put it on snots as a skill after DT. They don't have access to DP without a double, and they are pretty much good for nothing other than fouling.

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PainState

Joined: Apr 04, 2007

Posted: Mar 30, 2011 - 21:20

[quote="koadah"]

shadow46x2 wrote:

additionally....SG actually *DOES* indirectly modify the dice roll by completely negating a potential failure(ejection below armor penetration), and by making the ejection range smaller(shortening the band from 2-12 to AV-12)....

--j

Wow. Are you guys actually speaking different languages?

I think we are.

But I do love the beat down of stats that relate to ejection below armor penetration. Smile

I just assumed 3+ with reroll was better odds than 3+ with out, and that it does not modify the roll but greatly increase the odds, which IMHO is far better. But then again there is no retort to ejection below armor penetration...that sealed the deal for me. Git FTW!!

( EDIT:To many quotes on quotes....You get the point. I will not go back and correct the mess up on the follow up quote on a quote with a retort followed up by another quote.)

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the_Sage

Joined: Jan 13, 2011

Posted: Mar 30, 2011 - 21:39

I would say it should be: you don't get sent off on the armor roll if you don't break armor, and you don't get sent off on the injury roll if you don't score KO or Cas.

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JimmyFantastic

Joined: Feb 06, 2007

Posted: Mar 30, 2011 - 21:48

To some extent it is a good skill, because it encourages you to foul more, which is the best thing to do.

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WhatBall

Joined: Aug 21, 2008

Posted: Mar 30, 2011 - 22:08

JimmyFantastic wrote:

To some extent it is a good skill, because it encourages you to foul more, which is the best thing to do.

I thought piling on the mighty bro-love was the best thing to do?