Colin
Joined: Aug 02, 2003
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 Posted:
Jan 06, 2012 - 17:32 |
 
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I recall proposing a very early Chaos Pact roster back in the day - the idea was more or less a few blockers, Marauder linemen and a few runners - the idea of the runners was players that relied on Ag3, Agility skills and mutation access. Only Underworld makes use of this combination in the modern game, and are a fun team to play as a result. The idea of the roster was that a team such as the Chaos All-Stars was not, in the fluff, an ultra-violent team (at least, no more so than most), it was just a lot of weird and wonderful things happened for (and played for) them.
The modern Chaos roster is derived from the Chaos WHFB army list of the time (note that since then, Warriors and Beastmen have been split off into their own armies) - one of the worst influences on 3rd edition Bloodbowl, upon which the modern game is based, was the WHFB connection (and gave us quite a few pretty ugly miniatures we're still saddled with).
Ultimately, the problem with Chaos and their derivatives is they have Strength AND Mutation access. Either one is good, both puts them over the top (it also renders most of the mutations pointless as there are better Strength options). I believe a central tenet of roster creation is no player may have Strength and Agility access, with the notable exception of Vampires, nicely balanced with a negatrait. Why, then, Strength and Mutations?
A shining example of this problem is the player Jill Roberts of RandomOracle's FUMBBL Cup winning team. She has no stat increases, no doubles, and yet is one of the most successful players ever. That's just not right - a truly special player should be an anomaly, a rare conjunction of lucky stat bonuses and double-roll skills.
That coaches actually prefer single skill rolls over doubles and stat bonuses is a measure of how overpowered the basic options available to Chaos now are.
Marauders were given the option of passing skills to give the option of developing a thrower. Instead, this is abused as a cheap means of adding a reroll via Leader.
The rare sight of a Chaos team that can pass (my own definition of 'balling' involves passing) is actually quite terrifying - they can still hit, but can also move the ball fast when needed. I'd like to see more of them. |
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Rabe
Joined: Jun 06, 2009
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Jan 06, 2012 - 17:32 |
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| PainState wrote: | | Hey Rabe!! as our resident coach who wants a challenge, what you say...Your baller Chaos team getting formed up with this challenge in mind? |
Hehe, there are so many nice challenges I'd love to be up to... but with all that family, study and finally (hopefully) work stuff going on (not to mention BB7s), I think I'll have to postpone the majority of it to my retirement days (not from FUMBBL and family, but the rest). 
I still have an "alternative" pact team shelved though, might pick them up again some day (I know, not as close a challenge as "balling chaos", but still fun...) |
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gacska
Joined: Dec 22, 2009
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Jan 06, 2012 - 17:53 |
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| PainState wrote: | | gacska wrote: | Ok I make a baller chaos team if you make elves team where none of them take dodge, pass, sh, nos etc  |
Ok lets take this out to its logical conclusion.
Ok the challenge is on. Basically what you are saying is that the elves and chaos teams for this challenge are restricted to General skills only.
You think that is a fair match? |
NO its not fair cause elves would win easily I said only play elves like a bashing team and u would fail its just the same if you play with chaos for ball handling passing running, cuase they have ag3 and mov6 and not cheap ddoge
And yes chaos is now one of the most competetive team, cause the rules, but still darkelves, skaven can do a lot |
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PainState
Joined: Apr 04, 2007
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Jan 06, 2012 - 17:58 |
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| gacska wrote: | | I said only play elves like a bashing team and u would fail |
Dont get the coaches of Dark Elves all stired up man, because they would strongly disagree with you.
I thought the dirty little secret of Dark Elves was that they were a very good bashing elf team at high TV that could also ball with the best of them. |
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pythrr
Joined: Mar 07, 2006
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Jan 06, 2012 - 18:06 |
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| PainState wrote: | | gacska wrote: | | I said only play elves like a bashing team and u would fail |
Dont get the coaches of Dark Elves all stired up man, because they would strongly disagree with you.
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Also, I hear they carry knifes. |
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Corvidius
Joined: Feb 15, 2011
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Jan 06, 2012 - 21:28 |
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| Colin wrote: |
A shining example of this problem is the player Jill Roberts of RandomOracle's FUMBBL Cup winning team. She has no stat increases, no doubles, and yet is one of the most successful players ever. That's just not right - a truly special player should be an anomaly, a rare conjunction of lucky stat bonuses and double-roll skills.
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And yet Block and Dodge are freely available as are the counter skills to them and Piling On. |
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JimmyFantastic
Joined: Feb 06, 2007
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Jan 06, 2012 - 21:32 |
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Jill is truly special and an anomaly, incredibly rare to survive so many games when she is the number one target of the opposition. |
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PainState
Joined: Apr 04, 2007
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Jan 06, 2012 - 21:37 |
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I agree with Jimmy. The greatness of Jill is not her skill set but here dependability to inflict massive pain and yet survive and keep going on.
Sometimes survival in this brutal game is just as impressive as skill set...just ask Brett Favre. |
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MiBasse
Joined: Dec 04, 2004
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Jan 06, 2012 - 22:20 |
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| pythrr wrote: | | PainState wrote: | | gacska wrote: | | I said only play elves like a bashing team and u would fail |
Dont get the coaches of Dark Elves all stired up man, because they would strongly disagree with you.
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Also, I hear they carry knifes. |
No, that's Finns. |
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Lill-Leif
Joined: Nov 17, 2005
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Jan 08, 2012 - 01:46 |
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Jill makes Chuck versus bbowl a good team. Anna makes it a great team. |
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Catalyst32
Joined: Jul 14, 2008
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Jan 08, 2012 - 05:30 |
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| Colin wrote: | | The rare sight of a Chaos team that can pass (my own definition of 'balling' involves passing) is actually quite terrifying - they can still hit, but can also move the ball fast when needed. I'd like to see more of them. |
Then my opponents in the NWL ought to look out. Because I am developing such a team. |
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Catalyst32
Joined: Jul 14, 2008
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Jan 08, 2012 - 05:39 |
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| JimmyFantastic wrote: | | Jill is truly special and an anomaly, incredibly rare to survive so many games when she is the number one target of the opposition. |
Bull. Players like her survive longer than they should because they are always behind a meat shield of other players OR on the ground where they cannot be Blocked. With Fouling nerfed and aging a thing of the past monsters like this will roam free forever on a team with a good coach.
The only thing special about her is the number of games committed to exploiting the CRP in this way. |
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dode74
Joined: Aug 14, 2009
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Jan 08, 2012 - 07:11 |
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| Lill-Leif wrote: | | Jill makes Chuck versus bbowl a good team. Anna makes it a great team. |
This. Anna is a near-perfect chaos BC. Jill's survivability is testament to RO's coaching ability (and a potion). |
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Balle2000
Joined: Sep 25, 2008
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| Posted:
Jan 08, 2012 - 07:59 |
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fair enough painstate. there was once this lrb4 nurgle team whos motto was "chaotic without the claw" - they were baller chaos
i like how you write TEXAS in caps btw. Orc grammar
apropos |
Last edited by Balle2000 on %b %08, %2012 - %08:%Jan; edited 1 time in total |
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Nightbird
Joined: Aug 02, 2003
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Jan 08, 2012 - 08:21 |
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| Catalyst32 wrote: | | JimmyFantastic wrote: | | Jill is truly special and an anomaly, incredibly rare to survive so many games when she is the number one target of the opposition. |
Bull. Players like her survive longer than they should because they are always behind a meat shield of other players OR on the ground where they cannot be Blocked. With Fouling nerfed and aging a thing of the past monsters like this will roam free forever on a team with a good coach.
The only thing special about her is the number of games committed to exploiting the CRP in this way. |
+1 & she had a potion |
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