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clarkin



Joined: Oct 15, 2007
Location: Ireland

Post   Posted: Aug 30, 2011 - 15:13 Reply with quote Back to top

TV of Star Players article in GLN XIII

This is a thread to discuss the calculations / starting positionals etc etc.

A couple of people have brought up some good points already. Notably that Humerus Carpal might be better based off a human catcher, and that Ithaca Benoin might be better based off a khemri thro-ra.

Thoughts? Feedback? All welcome!
Garion



Joined: Aug 19, 2009

Post   Posted: Aug 30, 2011 - 15:20 Reply with quote Back to top

clarkin wrote:
TV of Star Players article in GLN XIII

This is a thread to discuss the calculations / starting positionals etc etc.

A couple of people have brought up some good points already. Notably that Humerus Carpal might be better based off a human catcher, and that Ithaca Benoin might be better based off a khemri thro-ra.

Thoughts? Feedback? All welcome!


Yup I would probably agree with those two points, because you also missed the -dumbp off skill from Ithaca

There is also a case for making Mighty Zug an Ogre since that is basically what he is even though he is clearly meant to be a blitzer. But then his pricing is crazy expensive.

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Last edited by Garion on Aug 30, 2011 - 15:23; edited 1 time in total
f_alk



Joined: Sep 30, 2005

Post   Posted: Aug 30, 2011 - 15:22 Reply with quote Back to top

Carpal as a Catcher is better, yes.
clarkin



Joined: Oct 15, 2007
Location: Ireland

Post   Posted: Aug 30, 2011 - 15:25 Reply with quote Back to top

Garion wrote:
Yup I would probably agree with those two points, because you also missed the -dumbp off skill from Ithaca

There is also a case for making Mighty Zug an Ogre since that is basically what he is even though he is clearly meant to be a blitzer. But then his pricing is crazy expensive.


If Ithaca is based on a dark elf runner then he starts with dump off. Will do calcs now for the alternatives. I'll try Zug as an ogre too, that could work.
OenarLod



Joined: Jan 26, 2011

Post   Posted: Aug 30, 2011 - 15:31 Reply with quote Back to top

clarkin wrote:

Notably that Humerus Carpal might be better based off a human catcher, and that Ithaca Benoin might be better based off a khemri thro-ra.


I don't like the two combined, I would prefer a coherent approach even if it makes more difficult to do the math.
I would base both on their "alive" counterpart, so a human catcher for Humerus and a delf runner for Ithaca. Otherwise, base both on the undead current status, a skeleton for Humerus and a throw-ra for Ithaca.
clarkin



Joined: Oct 15, 2007
Location: Ireland

Post   Posted: Aug 30, 2011 - 15:37 Reply with quote Back to top

Image
Ithaca Benoin: 220k (+16%)
Dark Elf Runner Accurate, Nerves Of Steel, Pass, Sure Hands, Regeneration*, -AGI**
80 +20 +20 +20 +20 +30 = 190k
INJURY: -AGI

Image
Ithaca Benoin: 220k (+10%)
Khemri Thro-Ra +MA, +AGI, Accurate, Dump Off, Nerves of Steel
70 +30 +40 +20 +20 +20 = 200k

OK, that's a FAR improved mapping for Ithaca. No special rule for regen, and no injury. Guess I missed this cos he looks like a dark elf runner so much with those skills, statline and icon Razz Nice find f_alk, going to amend this into the original article.
clarkin



Joined: Oct 15, 2007
Location: Ireland

Post   Posted: Aug 30, 2011 - 15:43 Reply with quote Back to top

Image
Humerus Carpal: 130k (-35%)
Khemri Skeleton +MA, +MA, +AGI, Catch, Dodge, Nerves Of Steel, -thick skull**, -STR**
40 +30 +30 +40 +30 +30 +30 -30 = 200k
INJURY: -STR

Image
Humerus Carpal: 130k (+8%)
Human Catcher Nerves Of Steel, Regeneration*, -MA**
70 +30 +30 = 120k
INJURY: -MA

I'm liking this mapping more, though it's not quite as clear cut as better like Ithaca was. For one Humerus can't play for humans; on the other hand this removes the only -STR 'injury' in the list, which unfairly made Humerus the best value star. Cheers for the suggestion Enigma179
clarkin



Joined: Oct 15, 2007
Location: Ireland

Post   Posted: Aug 30, 2011 - 15:48 Reply with quote Back to top

OenarLod wrote:
I don't like the two combined, I would prefer a coherent approach even if it makes more difficult to do the math.
I would base both on their "alive" counterpart, so a human catcher for Humerus and a delf runner for Ithaca. Otherwise, base both on the undead current status, a skeleton for Humerus and a throw-ra for Ithaca.


I'll go with whichever is the cleaner mapping for each star (less exceptions to my system), rather than picking a fluff-wise reason (pre-death vs post-death). At the moment i'm going with Ithaca -> Thro-ra, Humerus -> Human Catcher
Nelphine



Joined: Apr 01, 2011

Post   Posted: Aug 30, 2011 - 16:32 Reply with quote Back to top

So, as I'm not really sure entirely how these things are decided, would Mighty Zug then be a Black Orc Blocker (and thus no injuries), valued at 170k? Or do you aim for a race that is similar to that which gets the star player?
Enigma179



Joined: Sep 19, 2010

Post   Posted: Aug 30, 2011 - 16:46 Reply with quote Back to top

Nelphine wrote:
So, as I'm not really sure entirely how these things are decided, would Mighty Zug then be a Black Orc Blocker (and thus no injuries), valued at 170k? Or do you aim for a race that is similar to that which gets the star player?


I think aside from the dead folks, it's the same race pretty much thats the rule. So Zug is confusing as hell, and he'll stay that way unless he turns out to be a crossbreed Very Happy

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clarkin



Joined: Oct 15, 2007
Location: Ireland

Post   Posted: Aug 30, 2011 - 17:05 Reply with quote Back to top

I tried to pick the positional that best matched the star player. Almost always there was a clear positional they were based on that was one of the races they can be hired for. Zug is an anomaly because he is based on the Human Blocker positional, which was similar to the Black Orc Blocker but disappeared back in .. 2nd ed?

He might just work better going from an ogre. Still to do the addition
Lill-Leif



Joined: Nov 17, 2005
Location: Kramfors, Sweden

Post   Posted: Aug 30, 2011 - 17:08 Reply with quote Back to top

What about the loner negatrait?
Bardazur



Joined: Mar 29, 2007

Post   Posted: Aug 30, 2011 - 17:18 Reply with quote Back to top

Willow Rosebark Why did you choose an amazon linewoman instead of a human lineman ? He has AV8 and no dodge.

Image human lineman with +ST, dauntless, side step, thick skull: 180k (injury -MA)
f_alk



Joined: Sep 30, 2005

Post   Posted: Aug 30, 2011 - 18:14 Reply with quote Back to top

clarkin - if ogre is not going well for Zug, why don't you follow your approach and base him on the (2nd Ed) human Blocker position, which was 100% the same as the (still existing) orcish Blocker position (not just similar - orcs and humans were the same there, just one was "good" and the other was "evil" for mixed team purposes).

So, Zug would be a
Blocker + ST + Block + MB

I would follow your gut feeling there, I like it!
clarkin



Joined: Oct 15, 2007
Location: Ireland

Post   Posted: Aug 30, 2011 - 18:20 Reply with quote Back to top

Lill-Leif wrote:
What about the loner negatrait?

Since all stars have the loner negatrait I decided to ignore it across the board. Where this breaks down is when the base positional already has loner (big guys). Perhaps those ones should be boosted.

Bardazur wrote:
Willow Rosebark Why did you choose an amazon linewoman instead of a human lineman ? He has AV8 and no dodge.

Image human lineman with +ST, dauntless, side step, thick skull: 180k (injury -MA)

Until the recent suggestion for Humerus, every star player in the list was based on a positional for one of the races that can hire that star player. (Willow can only play for halflings, zons and woodies). A human lineman might be better alright, i'll think about it

f_alk, that's not a bad idea. I'll try both ways
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