Pirog
Joined: Jul 13, 2006
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 Posted:
Nov 22, 2008 - 01:04 |
 
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What, they can't be killed off like other players? |
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Peter_Thorpe
Joined: Oct 08, 2005
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Nov 22, 2008 - 01:23 |
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end of the day the players who win the extra players should be allowed to keep them, they earned it
im pretty sure that if most of you won the guard or the "off the roster" spectator, youd be heavily defending it staying on your team
simple fact, if your not stupid enough to let it be killed, either your a good player or you aint using it, so keep it, who cares that much anyway, whats the odds your gonna fight the player in question? |
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[url=http://www.sloganizer.net/en/style3,Peter-spc-Thorpe.png] [/url] |
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CircularLogic
Joined: Aug 22, 2003
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Nov 22, 2008 - 02:08 |
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| SillySod wrote: |
TS limited tournaments wont work. Forget it.
There are simply too many issues which would be ikky to resolve and enforce:
- cash dosent count for TS. What are you gonna do, force people to drop all their cash? Have fun checking all the teams...
- TS for some races is clearly borked, especially at low levels. In [B] teams will be protected (to an extent) by racial factors, once they are included. This isnt possible for tournaments.
- trimming teams for TS limited tournaments is much more complicated than doing so for TR limited tournaments, so its not exactly user friendly.
- big TR/TS mismatches will mean that some teams get a whole bundle of handicaps for free. |
If TS formula is so clearly borked, then maybe some people will go a different route than before as different teams are more attractive. Honestly, I`d have to think really hard before who races have an advantage at TS125. Those that might be overvalued will be bringing lower TRs and maybe a handicap or two. Those that might be undervalued will have a hard time reaching the TS cap, because the TR cap is in place, too.
From the technical point of view:
Each participant checks the team of his opponent if it`s within the restriction. If it isn`t, it`s either trimming time or a fortfeit. You can also rule that a team that has played a game with too much TS loses all the tour points from this event. If you really want to draconic, threaten ban - at least for repeated offenders. In the end it will be the responsibility of each coach to check his opponent. If he doesn`t and he loses, it`s his own fault.
I don`t really see the problem with TS limited tourneys. Maybe you missed the main point - the TS cap is enforced throughout the whole tourney. |
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funnyfingers
Joined: Nov 13, 2005
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Nov 22, 2008 - 02:24 |
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I think the random win for people who don't schedule a match is abused. Maybe weighting it with the amount of tosses would help. For example if A and B were scheduled and B won the toss then B and C scheduled and didn't play C should have a better chance to win the toss. |
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SillySod
Joined: Oct 10, 2006
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Nov 22, 2008 - 02:51 |
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| DukeTyrion wrote: | | JanMattys wrote: | I think cool special prizes should be toned down, and not bad prizes toned up.
GLT prize is fun. Lustrian and FC prizes are not lrb :/ |
I think the prizes are fine, as long as they go after 1 year.
I don't think the player should be on the team forever, as soon as the new winner is crowned, the Temple Guard should take up his new position, on the new team.
It might also make teams use the players a bit more between majors. |
I think that would be a very positive step. Maybe the Warpstone Open could stand out because the mutations remained on the players for ever?
| CircularLogic wrote: | | If TS formula is so clearly borked, then maybe some people will go a different route than before as different teams are more attractive. |
Different routes to powergamed teams but there will be just as many powergamed teams.
| Quote: | | Those that might be undervalued will have a hard time reaching the TS cap, because the TR cap is in place, too. |
Ok, having a TR cap and a TS cap makes sense in that it removes alot of the problems with stars, freebooters, wizards and cash in general. However I cant really see the point in capping both, all you really do is exclude alot of teams with great stat rolls... are they really that much of a pain?
| Quote: | From the technical point of view:
Each participant checks the team of his opponent if it`s within the restriction. If it isn`t, it`s either trimming time or a fortfeit. You can also rule that a team that has played a game with too much TS loses all the tour points from this event. If you really want to draconic, threaten ban - at least for repeated offenders. In the end it will be the responsibility of each coach to check his opponent. If he doesn`t and he loses, it`s his own fault. |
Sorry but I would hate it if that system got implemented. Getting opponents to validate teams is bound to end in tears, especially when new players enter the tournaments.
It would work but I see it as a big negative.
| Quote: | | I don`t really see the problem with TS limited tourneys. Maybe you missed the main point - the TS cap is enforced throughout the whole tourney. |
I did, otherwise I'd have criticised that too  Having a cap for every single game is bound to confuse some people. It also exagerates the problems with opponents validating teams. Even if there were no tears and everyone behaved themselves, would it really be a better kind of tournament? I'm not at all convinced tbh.
While potentially it could be quite interesting I just think there are too many issues and a very uncertain gain. Why not just use a TR cap that applies every round, I really dont see the gain or need to restrict TS too. |
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Putting the "eh?" back into Sexeh.
"There are those to whom knowledge is a shield. There are those to whom it is a weapon. Neither view is balanced." |
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koadah
Joined: Mar 30, 2005
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Nov 22, 2008 - 08:19 |
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| Circ wrote: | From the technical point of view:
Each participant checks the team of his opponent if it`s within the restriction. If it isn`t, it`s either trimming time or a fortfeit. You can also rule that a team that has played a game with too much TS loses all the tour points from this event. If you really want to draconic, threaten ban - at least for repeated offenders. In the end it will be the responsibility of each coach to check his opponent. If he doesn`t and he loses, it`s his own fault.
I don`t really see the problem with TS limited tourneys. Maybe you missed the main point - the TS cap is enforced throughout the whole tourney.
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It's a nightmare. A lot of people can't even get TR limits right!
Coach A ignores/doesn't read/doesn't understand the rules and hires Morg, The Count etc.
Coach B forgets to check and his/her team gets shredded and loses.
Even if the admin intervenes and puts B through, B now has a shredded team that is likely to get shredded even more next round and we're into concession land. It's a total pain in the rear.
Sure coach A takes the blame and the punishment but they still screw it up for everyone else.
Don't create more work for the admins. |
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[SL] + Official Stunty teams. Progression KO. Old & new teams welcome. 29th May! |
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CircularLogic
Joined: Aug 22, 2003
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Nov 22, 2008 - 10:50 |
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The point is, that TR125 SMACK finals often involve TS in the 160 range. Which is abit... uhm.. stupid? Because this TS is only reachable by a few races namely those that can save cash and have reasonable stars. If you enforce a TS cap throughout the tourney, stars can still be hired, but only by weaker teams to even the odds.
Again, all those teams with great stat-rolls can participate.. they even have a nice advantage - either they have spare cash OR they have a low TR and can get handicaps from other teams.
About the validation:
Lets make it easy: You can try to sneak over the cap. If your opponent catches you, you have to trim. If not... then you are lucky. I personally don`t see it as big a negative. How about that: Lets try it on a TS150 tourney. If it`s an administration nightmare, the other 3 are replaced. |
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Purplegoo
Joined: Mar 23, 2006
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Nov 22, 2008 - 10:51 |
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A TR/TS cap would be a good idea, imo.
To be honest, any reasonable idea that cuts back on the Count grindage might get my vote! |
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MadTias
Joined: Jun 19, 2004
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Nov 22, 2008 - 12:05 |
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| CircularLogic wrote: | OK.. wall of text.. here we go.
I first put up my ideas for the majors:
<snipped brilliant suggestions> 
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This is the way to go. More distinctive majors ftw. |
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Gordreg
Joined: Sep 14, 2007
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Nov 22, 2008 - 12:32 |
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The Temple Guard should definitely be restricted to a single year on each team... as things stand, the Lustrian Prize could probably be considered better by far the FC prize, which just isn't right.
As for the Fumbbl cup itself... I'm fine with the idea of teams being allowed to take a player from a different team permenantly, but I do think there should be some restrictions (perhaps using the old 'allies' rules as a guideline?). This way, a team would still be able to add something different to their lineup, but it wouldn't be something to against the motivation of the team in Question; Eg. a Dwarf Team might be able to take a Human Blitzer or an Ogre Ogre, but they wouldn't turn to the Chaos powers for a Beast of Nurgle; An Amazon team might bring in a Kroxigor or a Wardancer but wouldn't give a lurching Mummy the time of day; a Chaos team might ally itself with a Gutter Runner or Norseman but inviting a Troll Slayer to the party would just be asking for trouble... |
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CircularLogic
Joined: Aug 22, 2003
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Nov 22, 2008 - 12:47 |
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Gordreg you are a genius.. if I am to win the FC, I`ll be asking for an ogre-team ogre.. those that can use team rerolls! |
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Nextflux
Joined: Jan 22, 2008
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Nov 23, 2008 - 00:22 |
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I think it is a point that prizes should somehow be reflected permanently in the roster of the team.
At least potentially permanent, lets say you won the warpstone open and got your mutations, they show everyone that this team has won the WO cup.
Last winner of GLT (dandellion eaters) doesn't show any sign of winning a cup, while most other tournaments have a "roster Trophy"
at least the the other cups offer the chance to have trophies.
therefore my suggestion to a couple of chainsaws in the team (or bombers if you like) due to the theme of the GLT.
Often its not the power of the prize that is important, it is the status. (trophy)
Because of this I don't think the Temple guard should be a "wandering trophy" but adjusted or toned down, because it is too powerful to
have a player who can't age in LRB4.
my suggestion to this is it could age from 75 ssp and up it is fine (right now it has 4 skills, so naturally I assume that it is a star already..)
additionaly it could gain skills from 75ssp and up too..I still dont think it would be too powerful, chances for a "powerbeast" is there, but a
6439 block,dodge,,regenerate,stand firm is possible for a wight too, with +ST and 2 doubles (it lacks the av, and swaps standfirm with sidestep and it isnt a cup prize.. and it can have 1 extra skill!)
the power in the guardian lies in the non-aging process, I would rather have the temple guard to loose its power over time.. |
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Loew
Joined: Feb 02, 2005
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Nov 23, 2008 - 18:57 |
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I don't think the Temple Guard to be to strong. It does not age, but it does not get stronger and it can be killed like any other player. I think it is percieved as strong as it is nearly untouchable on a monster team like the Eaters - on other teams it will be much more exposed.
Now to something completly different: Keep the SFC! as seldom as I have time for them, they were always pure fun and mayhem. |
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SillySod
Joined: Oct 10, 2006
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Nov 25, 2008 - 13:36 |
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Has making the tours or minors 64 coaches each again been considered? |
_________________
Putting the "eh?" back into Sexeh.
"There are those to whom knowledge is a shield. There are those to whom it is a weapon. Neither view is balanced." |
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xcver
Joined: Mar 10, 2005
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| Posted:
Nov 25, 2008 - 14:09 |
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| Nextflux wrote: | | Last winner of GLT (dandellion eaters) doesn't show any sign of winning a cup |
Huh?!? It's mentioned twice in the team bio. OK not in a flashy sort of way, but it's there (for example under "Best Achievments thus far").
Greets,
xcver |
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"Power without perception is virtually useless and therefore of no true value!" - Ryouken - Master of the Hokuto no Ken Martial Arts |
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