Calcium
Joined: Apr 08, 2007
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 Posted:
May 22, 2009 - 18:23 |
 
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| Emeyin wrote: | | I'm all for more games and matchups in the Box but I don't think my heart can handle playing a 7 AV team in Ranked much less the Black Box. |
Give it a go. I'm relishing the challenge of playing my Skaven in the box.
My only gripe with some coaches in the box is the fact they don't play teams they like, rather they play teams they know stand the most chance of surviving in the blackbox enviroment. I had a game recently where the coach freely admitted to playing dorfs 'for the AV, but they bore me'. Anal? I think so. I say leave that kind of beardiness in [R]
There's always the VERY SLIM possibility that a given coaches favourite teams are ORC/DORF/KHEMRI mind, and in that case it's gotta be fair enough. Any coach thats been here for a while can be found out by his [R] match statistics mind...
(*Braces for inevitable coach backlash over my opinion) |
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koadah
Joined: Mar 30, 2005
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| Posted:
May 22, 2009 - 18:27 |
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| shadow46x2 wrote: |
| TheSpoonyBard wrote: | | If I have a team I like, I shouldn't be able to play that team at will, I should have to make 2 other teams and be forced to play them just as often. |
i'm sorry, but if you can't find 3 races that you enjoy playing, then maybe you should just change your coachname to 'maxblb' or 'kfoged' |
He didn't even say race but team. A TR 200 game is different to a TR100 game with the same race.
| shadow46x2 wrote: |
| Rebholz wrote: | | Box needs less restrictions, not more, in order to get more coaches activating |
uhhh....blackbox has restrictions?....since when?
people don't activate because the division was destroyed by douchebags who played only to wreck teams, or people exploiting flaws that used to be in the TS system....also due to the lack of variety(ie: only playing the same few races over....and over....and over....and over...) *hint hint* |
Not being able to choose my team is bigger than any of those reasons.
So, I'll be back next time I feel like playing my one [B] team. (compared to any of my other 30+ teams) |
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O[L]C 2016 Swiss! - April ---- All Star Bowl - Teams of Stars - 2 more teams needed |
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treborius
Joined: Apr 05, 2008
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| Posted:
May 22, 2009 - 18:40 |
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| VampyrSlayer wrote: | 5 Bloodbowl races make up around 50% of the number of teams in the BBox.
The variety ain't that good yet. |
well, it's just going to be the way, that in a very pluralistic world like BB there will be more teams of race A than B - learn to deal with that 
also, i don't understand the whining about massive overrepresentation of bashier teams in the box - i doubt it's any worse than in R...
...right now there're only 4 Box-teams playing, but if you really care wait till there's 20 Box-teams involved in games and compare
the frequencies of the races to those in R...
...in fact when you look here DE and Skaven are #6 and #7, respectively...
...i don't think that's too bad at all - actually when you add up all Elf-races they take #1 |
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treborius
Joined: Apr 05, 2008
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| Posted:
May 22, 2009 - 18:49 |
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| Synn wrote: | | Rebholz wrote: |
| Purplegoo wrote: | Just a random thought (I fully realise I play no [B], so it's not really my business), but if you come across a situation where you have 2,3,4 coaches and it doesn't throw up any matches, why don't you just get someone in main to note which two + coaches activated, go to their coach overviews and pick a fair [R] game?
Same difference, isn't it? I can't imagine a wise old head in main chat would come up with a worse matchup than the bot, actually, quite the reverse.
Just a thought... |
I've done this and there's nothing wrong with it per se, but it takes away the randomness that makes box fun. Box is basically gambling, which is what's so cool about it. |
Trust me.... nothing could be more random than two people approaching someone like Cloggy or Purplechest and saying "choose a match for us". 9 out of 10 times they will pick a better match than the box would.
Thats actually how Stable worked and the matches were fair up until some dooshes decided to try to hire stars or weasel out of a game.
__Synn
**Shadow.... you are still teh fats |
i agree with rebholz, the instant random part is the fun of it - i don't want to turn to the same coaches over and over again
and i don't want to look at the teams beforehand and count the # of guards, # of dodge vs. tackle, my CR vs. my oppos and so on...
...that just bores me to death and is a waste of time in my book.
...it's about the challenge and fun to play a completely random team / race *and* coach
i've learned to love this style of playing so much, that i've learnt to not even care about box-rounds not happening 'cause of
only 4 people since i'll just come back 30mins later for the next round - my time is just spent much better this way, i feel. |
Last edited by treborius on %b %22, %2009 - %18:%May; edited 1 time in total |
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Purplegoo
Joined: Mar 23, 2006
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| Posted:
May 22, 2009 - 18:52 |
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Well, the point is that you DONT look. That's the point.
You and I activate, there are no games scheduled. I say, 'Who was the other guy?' You say 'Me'. I hassle Synn, say, pick us a fair game, he says my X Vs. Your Y, we play, it's random, it's fairer than the Bot could provide, we get a game under all of the same reasons you want to play [B].
Savvy? It is a random coach. Iirc, it doesn't tell you who isn't scheduled when it says not enough to start. Unless things have changed since I had a go.
It's not ideal, but it's a patch when you don't get one. |
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treborius
Joined: Apr 05, 2008
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| Posted:
May 22, 2009 - 18:56 |
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| Purplegoo wrote: | Well, the point is that you DONT look. That's the point.
You and I activate, there are no games scheduled. I say, 'Who was the other guy?' You say 'Me'. I hassle Synn, say, pick us a fair game, he says my X Vs. Your Y, we play, it's random, it's fairer than the Bot could provide, we get a game under all of the same reasons you want to play [B].
Savvy? It is a random coach. Iirc, it doesn't tell you who isn't scheduled when it says not enough to start. Unless things have changed since I had a go. |
i see you point - still too cumbersome to get a 3rd guy and have him pick - also pretty unlikely that he'll find a reasonable matchup between 2 fixed coaches - i'd rather wait for next round and i just like to play vs. teams who are used to always getting random match-ups as well (as opposed to picking for 20 games and then playing some pumped up woodies ) |
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shadow46x2
Joined: Nov 22, 2003
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| Posted:
May 22, 2009 - 19:02 |
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| treborius wrote: | ...in fact when you look here DE and Skaven are #6 and #7, respectively...
...i don't think that's too bad at all - actually when you add up all Elf-races they take #1 |
nice way to try and "spin" things to make them look good....
funny how the top 4 races are orc, chaos, khemri, dorf...
but hey, #6 & #7 ain't bad!
--j |
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| origami wrote: | | There is no god but Nuffle, and Shadow is his prophet. |
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Purplegoo
Joined: Mar 23, 2006
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| Posted:
May 22, 2009 - 19:03 |
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Fairy dos, that's your call, I was just trying to offer a relative solution to the problem. 
And the thing about [R] (I'm being very careful to consider my Fun Police blog here) is that it is whatever you make of it. If you don't like 75% of what goes on there, you can still make a home for yourself in the last 25%, simply ignoring all you don't like.
I know that's slightly off topic - but the point remains - [R] is your tool to do with as you will. Simply saying 'If I can't play [B] it's not worth doing' is just denying you BB and fun, since you can create the exact same environment elsewhere with a bit of creative thinking.
Anyway, I'm out. |
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Ullakkomorko
Joined: Aug 10, 2008
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| Posted:
May 22, 2009 - 19:18 |
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| Meech wrote: |
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Don't give that to the Scots. They'd deep fry it. |
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treborius
Joined: Apr 05, 2008
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| Posted:
May 22, 2009 - 19:23 |
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| shadow46x2 wrote: | | treborius wrote: | ...in fact when you look here DE and Skaven are #6 and #7, respectively...
...i don't think that's too bad at all - actually when you add up all Elf-races they take #1 |
nice way to try and "spin" things to make them look good....
funny how the top 4 races are orc, chaos, khemri, dorf...
but hey, #6 & #7 ain't bad!
--j |
not a very nice way of somehow implying i was manipulating things...
...if i say that some softer teams like DE and Skaven make it at least to #6 #7,
of course #1..#5 are tougher teams like Orc, Khemri and what not, or what did you
think i was implying - #1: bumblebees?
...it's just another thing i've learned to stay away from 'cause it's just bad for your karma: discussions with shadow  |
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VampyrSlayer
Joined: Apr 09, 2009
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| Posted:
May 23, 2009 - 09:09 |
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Looks like my idea might be too big a change to start with to impact the box setup.
How about just 2 teams (different races) minimum per person need to be activated to go in the box. Any races can be chosen so if you do want your dwarf/khemri you can go for it, but at least then no-one is guaranteed a game with a certain team - as one team blackboxers are the only ones who are guaranteed that at the moment and the variety might also be increased a little. It would also mean that with 5 coaches activated there are at least 8 possible opponents for each of your teams - which might also allow for the coach limit to be dropped by one to find fair match-ups. |
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koadah
Joined: Mar 30, 2005
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| Posted:
May 23, 2009 - 09:28 |
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| VampyrSlayer wrote: | Looks like my idea might be too big a change to start with to impact the box setup.
How about just 2 teams (different races) minimum per person need to be activated to go in the box. Any races can be chosen so if you do want your dwarf/khemri you can go for it, but at least then no-one is guaranteed a game with a certain team - as one team blackboxers are the only ones who are guaranteed that at the moment and the variety might also be increased a little. It would also mean that with 5 coaches activated there are at least 8 possible opponents for each of your teams - which might also allow for the coach limit to be dropped by one to find fair match-ups. |
Or more coaches stay away due to not being able to choose the team they use. |
_________________
O[L]C 2016 Swiss! - April ---- All Star Bowl - Teams of Stars - 2 more teams needed |
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treborius
Joined: Apr 05, 2008
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| Posted:
May 23, 2009 - 09:49 |
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| VampyrSlayer wrote: | | Looks like my idea might be too big a change to start with to impact the box setup. |
i think your idea is not too big, it just seems to me its what most people don't want
| VampyrSlayer wrote: | | How about just 2 teams (different races) minimum per person need to be activated to go in the box. Any races can be chosen so if you do want your dwarf/khemri you can go for it, but at least then no-one is guaranteed a game with a certain team - as one team blackboxers are the only ones who are guaranteed that at the moment and the variety might also be increased a little. It would also mean that with 5 coaches activated there are at least 8 possible opponents for each of your teams - which might also allow for the coach limit to be dropped by one to find fair match-ups. |
i think this wouldn't change much, since most of the times when i look at the coaches playing in the box they already have at least 2 teams.
(there might be a few with only one, but those coaches often don't play box anymore anyhow) |
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VampyrSlayer
Joined: Apr 09, 2009
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| Posted:
May 23, 2009 - 09:59 |
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The BBox seems to go off less than 50% of the time and in my peak time - AEST - bbtime 0100-1000 it is lucky to go off once in those 19 attempts, so anything that would:
1. Increase coaches playing;
2. Increase variety of teams playing.
I am in favour of.
Maybe until we get BBox comps, that won't happen. |
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CircularLogic
Joined: Aug 22, 2003
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| Posted:
May 23, 2009 - 10:12 |
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We already had discussed that quite a while ago. I can`t remember Christer saying defenitly 'NO', but from his stance I guess he`s not in favor of such a ruling.
You might have noticed, that your idea isn`t the newest either. Many people resent things that restrict their options. It`s understandable. Many people just want to play ONLY the teams they like - fair enough, too. So you should not try to force or prohibit stuff, but set incentives.
For example:
The scheduler adds 6% to the current TS of every team. For each team of a different racial category after the first, this 'bonus' would be decreased by 3%.
Result: Everyone can still make their mono-khemri. But they play up on average more than they play down. Those that have spread out over the categories, will have an easier time.
We would get new coaches, while those who ONLY play dwarves in the box would still stay, because they can continue, don`t have to play anything else and they don`t care about winning anyways. |
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