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Death of Black Box?
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DukeTyrion



Joined: Feb 18, 2004
Post   Posted: Aug 18, 2010 - 16:49 Reply with quote Back to top
Grod wrote:
DukeTyrion wrote:
What we really need, is a testing division for FFB in Blackbox.


I think this would be great! The FFB is pretty much ready for the prime time anyway (even with remaining bugs, it is more advanced than SkiJunkies never finished client). Of course, this would simply be creating the default replacement for the existing Black Box division, and would possibly almost completely kill existing LRB4 Black Box play...


I think we are getting close to the point when we need to go live on FFB across the board anyway.

I know the new client still has a few issues, but then so does the old client. People want to be playing the latest version (and I am not just talking about the current players here, but also the two thirds of the player base we lost since Cyanide's incomplete version went live).

I hope the Blackbox issue gets sorted though (and I hopefully get to keep MIB), as I can't see myself returning to ranked (with or without a scheduler).
PainState



Joined: Apr 04, 2007
Post   Posted: Aug 18, 2010 - 16:55 Reply with quote Back to top
Box wont die.....It probally just wont be as big as the fans of the Box want it to be.

It took years to finally kill off faction, that div was the monty python black knight of divs and it took and act of god, christer, to finally put it out of its misery.

Box is no were near the level of inactivity as the old faction.

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DonTomaso



Joined: Feb 20, 2005
Post   Posted: Aug 18, 2010 - 16:56 Reply with quote Back to top
When BlackBox goes FFB, this will increase again...
Not to worry.

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Grod



Joined: Sep 30, 2003
Post   Posted: Aug 18, 2010 - 16:57 Reply with quote Back to top
Would it help in the mean time to move the scheduler back to every 30 minutes?

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maysrill



Joined: Dec 29, 2008
Post   Posted: Aug 18, 2010 - 17:11 Reply with quote Back to top
How would the 30-minute timer help? The biggest thing B has going is the convenience of scheduling a game. If I don't get a match, I might stick around to try 15 min later. Almost certainly not 30.
bennyprofane



Joined: Sep 10, 2007
Post   Posted: Aug 18, 2010 - 17:42 Reply with quote Back to top
I don't play much at the moment, but when i do it's to play the FFB client, get used to a couple of the new rosters etc. I've found it hard to go back to playing with skijunkie's client. At such time as I can play FFB with a blackbox scheduler, I won't do anything else.
There is a valid problem with blackbox opponents being boringly bash-heavy (I play lizards and elves in box, and it would be nice to play more than 1/10 of my games against similar teams) but I think, as has been suggested numerous times elsewhere, that the FFB client makes playing low-AV teams in box a much lessdoomy prospect, and so I expect that once FFB goes live in the box, the dreary 'oh, another game against orcs' sinking feeling that comes with 75% of schedules right now would not be such a problem, and a lot more people might migrate back to the box.

So it seems to me that the box is basically cryogenically frozen right now, and that once it it playable with FFB it'll have the potential to be as popular as it ever was.
PainState



Joined: Apr 04, 2007
Post   Posted: Aug 18, 2010 - 17:44 Reply with quote Back to top
Well I have read this thread as a concern about the # of games going down.

1)FFB client going live might/will help the problem.

2)15 minute or 30 minute timer is big in my mind.

15 minutes allows coaches to sit down and play, hopefully get in a game really fast. That has its appeal and I understand that. The problem I see with a 15 minute timer is there are only X amount of players active at any set amount of time that want to play box. Those coaches then all start kicking off every 15 minutes and fragments the # of coaches in the box scheduler. Thus reducing the possibilities of matches.

In North America, as I have said over and over, BOX is dead. It would be interesting if the scheduler was moved back to the top of every hour. That way it would "collect" more coaches who want to get in a box game. Thus increasing chances to find a match. Right now you need to activate multiple teams to have a reasonable shot.

Or in the extreme case to try at the top of every even hour, 2 hours, the schedulet goes off.

IMO most coaches when they get online activate the box or jump on matchfinder or try to get in one of their multiple league matches. Which ever one pops first they are off and running. You might not do all three but you are looking around waiting for something to happen in terms of games.

IF the box went off at the top of every hour it turns more into an event, something to look forward to, which would allow every coach who wanted to play in the box a better shot at finding a match and be resonably confident that they are not the only coach in the scheduler. The big negative is of course the potential down time..You play a box match and finish and want to jump right back in to get a second match before you log off. Well if you have to wait 50 minutes chances are you will just log off or move to another DIV for a game.

Just an idea.

And for the last 3 weeks every night, which is usually 3-4 days, I get online I immediatly activate my one box team...Have not found a match yet...now I only activate once and move on.

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Balle2000



Joined: Sep 25, 2008
Post   Posted: Aug 18, 2010 - 17:46 Reply with quote Back to top
if somebody just made a thread-recycling script, we could have these threads pop up without people taking the time out regurgitating old arguments

if blackbox for some reason disappears (which it wont), it would be a loss.

for my own sake, ranked is already dead anyway, because its basically just like [L]eague without the actual leagues
freak_in_a_frock



Joined: Aug 02, 2003
Post   Posted: Aug 18, 2010 - 17:51 Reply with quote Back to top
I'd quite happily second the introduction of FBB into the box to liven it up. The main reason it is dying IMHO is because when coaches don't get a box draw they go and test the new client. When FBB comes to the box i expect it to be back up there as the at least the 2nd most popular division, and once the site goes FBB we'll have to see how the popularity is spread.

The main problems with FFB being used in the box atm are the few skills not implemented and the site side work that needs to be done (i.e. reworking the box to recognize TV rather than TR/TS, an admin user interface to help with pushing matches, journeymen being hired after matches) once these are sorted and any regular game stopping bugs are ironed out I personally would implement it as soon as possible.
pythrr



Joined: Mar 07, 2006
Post   Posted: Aug 18, 2010 - 17:52 Reply with quote Back to top
yup, go FBB box. None of my B teams are old enough for me to care about losing them (much).

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freak_in_a_frock



Joined: Aug 02, 2003
Post   Posted: Aug 18, 2010 - 17:56 Reply with quote Back to top
Christer already hinted that he is working on a way to move LRB to FFB (he made a comment as to the troll for the LRB4 c.dorf teams having a minotaur for a picture), so we might even be able to keep the box teams anyway.

Quote:
The LRB4 images were set up using the reverse of a team migration system (LRB4 -> FFB) I am working on. The CD trolls in LRB4 teams will likely be changed into minotaurs, which is why the image shows as it does.
maysrill



Joined: Dec 29, 2008
Post   Posted: Aug 18, 2010 - 18:20 Reply with quote Back to top
freak_in_a_frock wrote:
I'd quite happily second the introduction of FBB into the box to liven it up. The main reason it is dying IMHO is because when coaches don't get a box draw they go and test the new client. When FBB comes to the box i expect it to be back up there as the at least the 2nd most popular division, and once the site goes FBB we'll have to see how the popularity is spread.

The main problems with FFB being used in the box atm are the few skills not implemented and the site side work that needs to be done (i.e. reworking the box to recognize TV rather than TR/TS, an admin user interface to help with pushing matches, journeymen being hired after matches) once these are sorted and any regular game stopping bugs are ironed out I personally would implement it as soon as possible.


I'm sure there is tweaking to be done in the nitty-gritty details, but one of the more endearing features of LRB6 is that a lot of mismatches get ironed out in the inducement system, probably a lot more consistently than handicaps ever could.

There will obviously be other factors to have to take into account, such as skill selection advantages, stat upgrades, and racial match-ups. I bet if you did nothing but try to keep the TV within a couple hundred though, the matches would be reasonably fair.
Arktoris



Joined: Feb 16, 2004
Post   Posted: Aug 18, 2010 - 18:22 Reply with quote Back to top
I toss a team in the box when finding a ranked game is difficult. other than that, not much reason to play there.

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koadah



Joined: Mar 30, 2005
Post   Posted: Aug 18, 2010 - 18:29 Reply with quote Back to top
DukeTyrion wrote:
What we really need, is a testing division for FFB in Blackbox.

I think you will find that alot of Blackbox players are playing the new FFB Client.

It would be interesting to see how many would play Blackbox in an FFB enviroment.

The reality is probably more 'Death of Blackbox in LRB 4', as I think it will only get stronger in FFB.


Creating yet another testing division could be a lot of work just for something that might be 'interesting'. Only Christer knows.

If the hardcore [B ] purists are happy to declare LRB4 [B ] dead then sure go for total switch over. The new client is clearly already good enough for a lot of coaches.

It is still not finished though. Are Christer/Kalimar going to have to keep clearing the database? Are people happy with that?

Grandfathering is probably not ready. How many of you are happy with a TV1000 reset?

Switching [B ] first sounds good to me but I don't think it is what Christer was planning.

It is not finished though. Are people prepared to put up wi

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Reisender



Joined: Sep 29, 2007
Post   Posted: Aug 18, 2010 - 18:35 Reply with quote Back to top
box games dropped a bit and then reached a point when lots of times 2 or 3 coaches activate i guess - at least in my case - too often no games means play a FFB or a new Ranked team instead
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