Grumbledook
Joined: Aug 02, 2003
|
 Posted:
Aug 21, 2010 - 17:07 |
 
|
I was wondering what skills currently are and what skills are planned to be optional in the client.
iirc kick isn't optional in javabowl but it is in ffb right?
what about things like opting to not use dodge when being blocked by a non tackle player, or opting to not use tackle if hitting a dodge player?
BOTOCS offers all the skills to be optional based on individual client settings offering them a popup on ones they have set to being optional, and automatically using them if not
so dodge is split up into its separate components of being optional, so you can automatically use it on dodges but have it optional when being hit
would be nice if the client offered this same level of rules compliance (the optional or not stuff I don't care about as I'm happy with popups, though I guess it would be nice for those who don't like them and would prefer to have their players forced to use skills in order to have less popups) |
|
|
Eddy
Joined: Aug 04, 2004
|
| Posted:
Aug 21, 2010 - 17:15 |
|
Seconded. It'd definitely add an extra strategic layer. |
_________________
'The generation of random numbers is too important to be left to chance.'
Robert R. Coveyou |
|
Garion
Joined: Aug 19, 2009
|
| Posted:
Aug 21, 2010 - 17:31 |
|
I think almost all the skills that are optional have been so in the new client or are planned to be. However there was a thread on this very subject a while ago discussing whether choosing not to use dodge when being blocked etc should happen in the new client and I think the general concensus at the time was that people would prefer not to have to choose just because it would slow the game down so much. But I do understand your point of view completely as it would be especially useful when defending one turn touch downs etc. Its deffo a tricky one to work out what is the best way to deal with this subject. |
_________________
 |
|
Grumbledook
Joined: Aug 02, 2003
|
| Posted:
Aug 21, 2010 - 17:42 |
|
Works fine having them optional from my experience, having them optionally off by default then those who don't mind the rather minute time difference involved in playing the full rules can turn them on for their team.
Obviously if using timed turns the clock would have to stop while the other coaches selects the popup. |
|
|
Reisender
Joined: Sep 29, 2007
|
| Posted:
Aug 21, 2010 - 18:57 |
|
there is another forum thread with a discussion about this - dunno if the exact answer is there but a lot of discussion |
|
|
pythrr
Joined: Mar 07, 2006
|
| Posted:
Aug 21, 2010 - 18:58 |
|
this would be a nightmare, imho... lots of coaches check email etc (or other "stuff"...) while it is their opp's turn (from my experience waiting ages for people to pick a SS result, etc), and this would make that aspect so much more slow... |
_________________
 |
|
RedDevilCG
Joined: Jan 09, 2010
|
| Posted:
Aug 21, 2010 - 19:52 |
|
I think only very rude coaches would ignore the game if they new they might have to do skill selections during the opponents turn. |
|
|
Eddy
Joined: Aug 04, 2004
|
| Posted:
Aug 21, 2010 - 22:53 |
|
Especially considering Grumbledook's proposal was to have everything default to "no player input", as it is now.
Options might be a bad thing, but when they help make the game stick closer to the rules, they're worth considering. Anything that makes the game more deep, rich, and strategic is a good thing. |
_________________
'The generation of random numbers is too important to be left to chance.'
Robert R. Coveyou |
|
Reisender
Joined: Sep 29, 2007
|
| Posted:
Aug 21, 2010 - 22:54 |
|
question: isnt stand firm already implemented with a small timer and when it runs off it chooses to use SF?
edit: info : deep in the forum someone compiled a list of all skills that could be optional. it might be worthwhile to find it and use it for this discussion - however i dont know where exactly it is :[ |
|
|
On1
Joined: Jul 12, 2004
|
| Posted:
Aug 21, 2010 - 23:24 |
|
| pythrr wrote: | | this would be a nightmare, imho... lots of coaches check email etc (or other "stuff"...) while it is their opp's turn (from my experience waiting ages for people to pick a SS result, etc), and this would make that aspect so much more slow... |
however the way it works now, the client-window will activate whenever a pop-up pops up while you are doing something in background. EVEN when spectating (this is a bug though imo, the spectate part that is) |
|
|
Koigokoro
Joined: Sep 29, 2005
|
| Posted:
Aug 21, 2010 - 23:45 |
|
It would be a cool implementation that there's predefined assumption that a skill will be used or not, but in game it will pop up anyway to ask it, but with a timer of something like 10 seconds after which the predefined choice is picked by the client if player doesn't pick differently.
-> falling a little asleep or being afk on opponent's turn won't make that turn unplayable. |
|
|
uuni
Joined: Mar 12, 2010
|
| Posted:
Aug 22, 2010 - 01:03 |
|
The rulebook mentions that a player's turn shall take 4 minutes maximum. Perhaps this could be interpreted that each coach has its own timer for every turn.
So in the beginning of turn A1 the clocks A and B would be set to 4 min. While making normal active moves, the clock A will be counted. When B gets to make passive moves, ie Side Step etc, the clock B will tick.
So one turns passive playing should take a maximum total of 4 minutes.
There is no specific rules in the rulebook for passive playing, if it is not interpreted along something like this.
***
BB rules are imo not very good with the timer when playing competitively. There are many switches of priority when making quite simple steps of actions, for instance when throwing a block the priority can change about 8 times. Compare that to chess where you move and then the priority changes. BB is more complex game in that angle. |
|
|
On1
Joined: Jul 12, 2004
|
| Posted:
Aug 22, 2010 - 11:29 |
|
| Koigokoro wrote: | It would be a cool implementation that there's predefined assumption that a skill will be used or not, but in game it will pop up anyway to ask it, but with a timer of something like 10 seconds after which the predefined choice is picked by the client if player doesn't pick differently.
-> falling a little asleep or being afk on opponent's turn won't make that turn unplayable. |
This would work in an ideal world 
But tbh i think it would encourage people to actually go AFK and let the game run by itself because they can, and then overall create more "downtime".
However when you play online poker, the first time you time out, you go in afk mode. Perhaps set the first timer to 30 seconds, if the coach fails to react, then auto-choose the usage of skills for the coach untill he clicks an "i am back" button.
The client would need some sort of AFK command though. Where players could agree on pausing the game. By clicking pause/afk within 10 seconds of each other or something. The same for starting the game again. |
|
|
Grumbledook
Joined: Aug 02, 2003
|
| Posted:
Aug 22, 2010 - 14:24 |
|
nice suggestions though from experience that hasn't been needed
that doesn't mean that it wouldn't be though, there will always be at least one who possibly abuse it but I'd rather the option was there without a timer than not at all
but if what you say regarding one being there for stand firm, I can't imagine it would take too much work to reuse that same code for other skills |
|
|
gandresch
Joined: Aug 02, 2003
|
| Posted:
Aug 22, 2010 - 14:39 |
|
Hi,
we had an similar discussion here in the forum in another thread. It comes out, that not all skills have to be optional, because usually everyone uses Guard if he has.
The thing is, that for sure every skill has to be optional, if it is meaningful to make it optional, but more interesting is the behaviour on how to change the settings.
In BOTOCS you can choose before the game, what skills are optional and which are not. I would like a situation, where all meaningful skills are optional, but the settings can be changed during the game. So there has to be a menu, where you can choose, if a skill is "always used" or "asked to use".
If Kalimar implements this option, then the more interesting thing to do is, find good standard settings for all skills. That is, what we duscussed in the other thread. Of course, you usually use Dodge on Block actions. But in 1 of 1000 Block actions, you perhaps won't. Then you can turn it of and be asked for the usage (of course before the block). The same with all other things.
Coaches, who cannot imagine, what need there is, to go such a way:
Accurate can mean the difference between inaccurate in enemy territory and fumbled in a safe position.
Catch can mean forced catch on a scatter with a player, that already has moved. Here i want to be asked to use catch to perhaps fail the catch.
and so on. We had a list of 40 skills i think, that all are useful in some situations when on "auto" and the other way round.
Kalimar knows about this and i think, he will implement at least most of the options in the coming clients.
Greets,
gan |
|
|
|
|
| |
Gnome Roster - how a...
Search
