Buttercup
Joined: Sep 24, 2003
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 Posted:
Feb 27, 2004 - 19:46 |
 
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Am I wrong or does pass block allow you to move your passblocker illegally? The rule is:
| Quote: | Pass Block (General Skill)
A player with this skill is allowed to move three squares
when the opposing coach announces that one of his
players is going to pass the ball. This move is made out
of sequence, after the range has been measured, but
before any interception attempts have been made.
However, the move may only be made if it allows the
player to move into a position to attempt an interception,
or to put the thrower or catcher in his tackle zone. The
opposing coach is not allowed to change his mind about
passing the ball after the player with this skill has made
his move. The special move is free, and in no way affects
the player’s ability to move in the following turn. Apart
from this, however, the move is made using all of the
normal rules, and the player does have to dodge in order
to leave opposing players’ tackle zones. |
I've done some tests, and a passblocker can move in such a way that he doesn't fulfil the "must end TZing the catcher or thrower" - the easiest example is if the pass blocker is 1 space away from the catcher or thrower. Pass blocker moves away from catcher, and then ends pass block turn.
Is this a bug or is this legal?
Buttercup |
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MixX
Joined: Aug 02, 2003
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| Posted:
Feb 27, 2004 - 20:01 |
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It doesn't say that you HAVE to put either in a TZ or get into a position to intercept, it just says you need to have the option before you can move. |
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Jarnageddon
Joined: Nov 04, 2003
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| Posted:
Feb 27, 2004 - 20:02 |
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But so long as the player moves into a position to attempt an interception thats fine according to the text you've quoted |
_________________
Never hit a man with glasses. Hit him with something bigger and heavier. |
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Goblinux
Joined: Nov 17, 2003
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| Posted:
Feb 27, 2004 - 20:04 |
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You are mistaken, passblocker can move 3 squares if he can reach the passing zone, this means he can be out in open to intercept it. |
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Buttercup
Joined: Sep 24, 2003
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| Posted:
Feb 27, 2004 - 20:13 |
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But in my example he's moved away from the catcher and isn't in the interception zone either.
The client (very nicely) shows you a bunch of green squares where the "legal" moves are. I can move a pass blocker into a non-green square and then end my turn. That's my main question - is that legal or not?
Buttercup |
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MixX
Joined: Aug 02, 2003
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| Posted:
Feb 27, 2004 - 20:17 |
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as I said, the skill doesn't say you need to move into interception range or next to thrower/catcher. It just says you need the option of doing this in order to get the move. You can do whatever you want with the move if you're within range. |
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Buttercup
Joined: Sep 24, 2003
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| Posted:
Feb 27, 2004 - 20:23 |
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Mixx:
| Quote: | the move may only be made if it allows the
player to move into a position to attempt an interception,
or to put the thrower or catcher in his tackle zone |
Doesn't seem like an option to me - I interpret it to mean "you can't make a move if the player can't move into a position to attempt an interception or to put the thrower or catcher in his tackle zone"
If your interpretation IS correct, then the client still handles it wrong. The mechanism in the client only allowes you to move within range of a legal (green) square. If you are right, you could move anywhere. My example is that you move away from a catcher but stay within range 2 (e.g. allowing you dodge away from someone, then move 2 squares into the TZ/interception range/whatever). The problem is that you can end your turn prior to moving the last two squares.
Buttercup |
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CorporateSlave3
Joined: Feb 07, 2004
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| Posted:
Feb 27, 2004 - 20:37 |
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If the client is showing legal moves but allows you to make illegal moves as well then it is a problem.
If the client is showing some legal moves but not others (although it allows you to make them anyway) then it is a problem.
So I would say you should report it as a bug since either interpretation of the rules is not adequately enforced by the client in this case.
I would tend to agree with MixX as far as the letter of the law - since you could conceivably fail a dodge and not end up in a TZ or INT position and it would still be 'legal, although I think the spirit of the rule is that you should have to try to get to a TZ or INT, not just move to give yourself a juicy block or assist that is unrelated to the pass...(the skill is Pass Block, not Ooh! A Pass! No One WIll Notice Me Sneaking In Over Here To Lend An Assist Next Turn )
I would rather see the client enforce the spirit of the rule - and I hope that they will be rewording it as soon as they realize how badly it can be taken advantage of! |
_________________
***Did you know? 42.7% of all statistics are made up on the spot? |
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Mully
Joined: Aug 02, 2003
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| Posted:
Feb 27, 2004 - 20:47 |
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Butter - I think you are correct. Those that say it is "optional" to move into a tackle zone/pass range are misinterpreting the language.
However, I'm not the how the client could currently enforce this since it doen't know you haven't fulfilled the requirement until after your turn is finished.
There would have to be some type of logic built in that said if you finished the turn standing but didnt fulfill the above prerequisites that you were returned to your starting position. But that could get hairy to program if you took into account things like stand firm. |
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Come join the CCC League |
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MixX
Joined: Aug 02, 2003
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| Posted:
Feb 27, 2004 - 21:35 |
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I agree with the spirit of the law, but I still don't think that's what the skill says. I only just thought of this as I read your question - as I've always thought of it the other way around (*have to end in TZ or interception range*). And I definetely wouldn't mind a rewording of the skill. But as the skill is now, I still maintain that that is what is says.. |
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CorporateSlave3
Joined: Feb 07, 2004
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Feb 27, 2004 - 21:44 |
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Heh, the letter of the law (and current client enforcement) makes Pass Block a more attractive skill for bashy teams eh? All those elf linemen, etc. who have spent all turn dodging out of MB/Claw/RSC block range watch their thrower go to pass the ball - and suddenly they've got opposing players next to them. And they've already moved this turn. Better pray that pass ends in a TD...
Makes a great Longbeard skill...almost double their movement!
Butter is right though - no matter which way you want to interpret the rule the client currently only does half of it... |
_________________
***Did you know? 42.7% of all statistics are made up on the spot? |
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MixX
Joined: Aug 02, 2003
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| Posted:
Feb 27, 2004 - 21:46 |
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to back up my claim, let's go over it point by point (sorry if this sounds arrogant, it's not intended that way):
| Quote: | | the move may only be made if it allows the player to move into a position to attempt an interception, or to put the thrower or catcher in his tackle zone |
.
Right, so:
1) does the move ALLOW the Pass Blocker to get into such a position, then
2) the move may be made
3) the move does not NEED to put the Pass Blocker into a TZ or interception range
Note: I don't think this is the intention of the rule, but I *DO* think it's what it says right now! |
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CorporateSlave3
Joined: Feb 07, 2004
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Feb 27, 2004 - 22:25 |
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Oh I agree with you about what it says right now - I am just shuddering at the potential for abuse as it stands...and noting that according to ButterCup, the client in fact does allow you to make such a move - but it does not highlight all allowed squares as 'legal' squares - which it should do if allowing a player to move to them, right?
The client is acting as a kindly old grandfather - showing you where you ought to go to obey the spirit of the rule, but not forcing you to go there if you really don't want to... |
_________________
***Did you know? 42.7% of all statistics are made up on the spot? |
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MixX
Joined: Aug 02, 2003
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| Posted:
Mar 01, 2004 - 15:58 |
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to be honest, I think the blue squares shown in the client are the passing path, to show the areas where you can intercept. |
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DoubleSkulls
Joined: Oct 05, 2003
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Mar 02, 2004 - 13:38 |
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As the rules currently stand the literal wording of PB is that to be eligable to move you must be able to get into a position to put a TZ on the passer/catcher or intercept. The spirit is that you shouldn't make moves otherwise. I don't see that this is a bug in the client but in the rules. |
_________________
Ian 'Double Skulls' Williams
Eucalyptus Bowl |
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