Roland
Joined: May 12, 2004
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 Posted:
Jan 21, 2014 - 14:55 |
 
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RobRoyDuncan
Joined: Apr 15, 2011
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Jan 21, 2014 - 14:55 |
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I have a Nurgle team that I play in Ranked. I enjoy having the beast - in fact, I aim for all nine positionals. Things to think about.
1) The beast is not that great early on. Too easy to gang up on. If you manage to get doubles on him for Block, or even just a couple normal skills for Guard and Stand Firm, he's quite useful... but as a roadblock, not a beater.
2) Beasts skill slowly, even compared to the glacial pace of the warriors. If you are trying to get them as many MVPs as possible, there is nothing wrong with buying those as much as you can early, and maximize the 5 SPP chunks going towards the big guys. Skilling pestigors is much easier.
3) That said, you also aren't going to win as much while running all of the big guys. It's much harder to make plays when your guys are slower and less agile, and still don't hit terribly well or hard.
Basically: the team you have right now is in it for the long haul. I don't expect you to win terribly much with it soon, but it's set up well for later development. If you wanted to win soon, you should have ignored the beast and grabbed pestigors.
Well, really, if you wanted to win soon, you shouldn't have played Nurgle at all... |
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Garion
Joined: Aug 19, 2009
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Jan 21, 2014 - 15:17 |
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For fun. The same reason I don't have any pile on. |
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DrPoods
Joined: Nov 14, 2013
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Jan 21, 2014 - 16:05 |
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Well,I had a nice result in the league to get to 3-0-3! Bought a new Pestigor and skilled up three players giving a rotter Block. A Pestigor Dodge and the Warrior Mighty Blow.
Rolled a double on the Warrior but felt that Mighty Blow was more useful than Dodge at the moment. I realise it would keep him on his feet, but I would rather the hitting power. Now, assuming all the Warriors get Block, I am thinking to start getting some Guard players in there. Is this a smart way to go?
*sigh* I don't know why I am regretting not taking Dodge on the Warrior. But I am for some reason!
Anyway, here is the team at the moment. Botfly Ballers
Any tips on future development? Pustaint (the ST5 Warrior) will take Block next, and I am thinking of having 2 Guards and 2 Mighty Blow Warriors. I think I should develop at least one of the Pestigors as a damage dealer but is there another way rather than the Claw/MB/PO route? I mean, I think that Claw/MB is OK for Nurgle as it fits the fluff, but I am really torn on PO. maybe Frenzy?
I dunno. Help me out in planning for the future! |
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RobRoyDuncan
Joined: Apr 15, 2011
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Jan 21, 2014 - 16:25 |
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| DrPoods wrote: | | I dunno. Help me out in planning for the future! |
I still haven't figured out what to do with doubles on warriors. Trying Diving Tackle at the moment with reasonable success.
Try aiming to get Tentacles on the ST5 warrior after Block, with Stand Firm following. More Tents is always fun. As you mention, you will want a mix of support and damage warriors, so giving Guard to the next one to get a second skill sounds reasonable.
I like running all four pestigors, and specializing them in different ways.
Pesti1: damage dealing. Block, Mighty Blow, Claw, Tackle.
Pesti2: ball-carrier. Block, Extra Arms, Sure Hands, Two Heads.
Pesti3: sweeper. Wrestle, Tackle, Two Heads.
Pesti4: backup. Block, Tackle, Guard.
This is only listing normal skills, of course. Stats (+ST, +AG, +MA) are always good, and also doubles. With your current pestis, I'd recommend turning the Dodge one into the ball-carrier, assuming normals from here out.
Good luck! |
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xnoelx
Joined: Jun 05, 2012
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Jan 21, 2014 - 16:27 |
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The ST5 Warrior wants Tents, either before or straight after Block. Guard on Warriors is a good idea. A Pest with Block, Tackle, Claw, MB, Frenzy and eventually 2 Heads is a nice threat. Or, you can make one with Wrestle, Tackle, Strip Ball, Two Heads. Also, consider Diving Tackle as well as Dodge as a double for Warriors, it works well with the pitch control/Tents/drag your opponent into a brawl style of the team.
Edit: ninja-ed by RRD. I'd also recommend Big Hand on a ball carrier type Pest, although that may just be because of my scrappy style, which tends to involve having to retrieve the ball from bad spots when things go wrong. |
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 Nerf Ball 2014 |
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licker
Joined: Jul 10, 2009
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Jan 21, 2014 - 16:48 |
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| Garion wrote: |
For fun. The same reason I don't have any pile on. |
I don't really believe you  Here's my point. In B (and R to a lesser extent) I think the beast probably isn't worth as much. Because (and this is largely for B) he adds a significant amount of TV, and is a liability against any other high TV claw sides, since they don't really care if he stays in contact with their line as it just means they get to hit him more easily.
In L, you don't usually care so much about TV as you are scheduled, not matched by TV. Sure, giving inducements is occasionally annoying when that wizard ruins your day, or a chef steals all your rrs, but frankly, Nurgle is only going to play well at higher TVs, and at some point there are diminishing returns on giving up more inducements.
So unless your league features a lot of other high TV claw teams, the beast is a real pain for those st3 teams who like to break contact. He's also great vs. st2 speeders (like skinks/gutters/...) when you can get him on them. 16spp is kind of all he needs for guard/stand firm (block if you are lucky) and he's pretty much perfectly built at that point for the job he's meant to do.
That's just defending the place of a beast on a Nurgle roster, not arguing for when you should start with one (though I'd start one right away just because of the typical reliance on MVPs to get to 16).
| Quote: | Well,I had a nice result in the league to get to 3-0-3! Bought a new Pestigor and skilled up three players giving a rotter Block. A Pestigor Dodge and the Warrior Mighty Blow.
Rolled a double on the Warrior but felt that Mighty Blow was more useful than Dodge at the moment. I realise it would keep him on his feet, but I would rather the hitting power. Now, assuming all the Warriors get Block, I am thinking to start getting some Guard players in there. Is this a smart way to go?
*sigh* I don't know why I am regretting not taking Dodge on the Warrior. But I am for some reason!
Anyway, here is the team at the moment. Botfly Ballers
Any tips on future development? Pustaint (the ST5 Warrior) will take Block next, and I am thinking of having 2 Guards and 2 Mighty Blow Warriors. I think I should develop at least one of the Pestigors as a damage dealer but is there another way rather than the Claw/MB/PO route? I mean, I think that Claw/MB is OK for Nurgle as it fits the fluff, but I am really torn on PO. maybe Frenzy?
I dunno. Help me out in planning for the future! |
Nice job with the record, young Nurgle are difficult to play no doubt, but they can also present issues for the opponents if your dice are slightly better than average, and your positioning is strong.
Yeah, skipping dodge was probably a mistake, but no real harm in taking MB on a warrior. I like to get block/guard on 3 of my warriors if they aren't rolling doubles/stats, and turn the 4th one into a killer (MB/PO/Claw/Block/Tacklle). MB will help this guy skill a bit faster hopefully, but with FA and regen the Warriors are stickum that gums up the line or scrum hopefully. Adding dodge to them just makes them that much harder to get out of the way. Still going block/MB on them is potent enough against a lot of teams.
ST5 warrior needs block then tents I would think. Prestis are the usual blitzers, so making one cpomber is necessary, and really having 2 of them is better. One of them should be a ball handler, unless you want a rotter to perform that task. Rotters to me are only there to take dirty player unless they get doubles or a stat.
You're right about frenzy too, get it on a presti after block and tackle and you'll have a nice surf threat. RRDs suggestions for prestis are pretty good, though I think you want 2 MB ones (how much claw/PO is up to you, I'd go for 2 cpombers myself if you really want to take advantage of it). You dream of getting +AG on one though, couple with two heads and dodge and that's a highly mobile player. Block/Dodge/+AG/Two Heads/Surehands... pretty slick ball carrier who can get around TZs pretty easily, and can scoop up loose balls at a decent clip (big hand at legend or instead of sure hands, but I prefer sure hands myself).
Again, a lot of your team development has to fit the league you are playing in. Which is why the 'kill all menz' nonsense may not really apply, unless you want to put on that black hat and be that team in your league (which can certainly be fun, so long as the rest of the league doesn't mind). If you're facing a lot of AV9 'bash' teams (lizards, orcs, dwarves) then you want more claw, if not full on cpomb. If you're facing elfs then you need more tackle (and tents ideally from the beast and your st5 warrior). AV7-8 guys and you can mix things up a bit more. |
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DrPoods
Joined: Nov 14, 2013
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Jan 21, 2014 - 17:15 |
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Thanks for the input guys! It is great to get this kind of help as it will certainly assist me in getting better!
@RobRoyDuncan - That makes me think I made another mistake! I already have extra arms on one of the other Pestigors. If I do make the Dodge Pesti the ball carrier, then how can I turn the Extra Arms one into another role? All I can think of is that I keep the Extra Arms Pestigor as the carrier and turn the Dodge one into a sweeper/sacker role. I mean, I would probably take Block next to make him a blodger (?) and then I could maybe go for Tackle/Guard? This could make him a Blodging Guard who can support the Warriors/weak points in the line.
@xnoelx - I certainly want Tents on Pustaint (ST5) then I could have him on one side and the Beast ready to pounce on the other to hang on to any players that get through my line. I am warming to the idea of the Frenzygor!! That could be a right pain for the opposition to deal with.
@licker - Thanks mate! I think I am doing pretty well to be 3-0-3! It helps that I am trying not to overcommit too early which is a problem I have had with other teams I have tried. If it helps, the team is in the 145 Rookie League and there is a large mix of teams! This is the racial breakdown... Note that better coaches need to take the "stunty" or harder teams if they reach a certain level.
4 Halfling (Played 1)
3 Lizardmen (Played 1)
3 Human (Played 1)
2 Khemri
1 Dwarf
1 Elf
1 High Elf
1 Necromantic
1 Norse
1 Nurgle (Played them)
1 Ogre (Played them)
1 Orc
1 Skaven (Played them)
So as you can see, I have a mix of teams to play against. But I reckon that with the Warriors (after they all get Block) then 1 MB/2 Guard with the Guards taking MB next and the MB taking Claw might be the way to go? Pustaint (ST5) would go Block then Tentacles for the reasons I said above.
With that mix of teams would getting more tackle be a better option than trying to load up with "hurting bombs" (cue Rocky montage)? And would the Warriors need to change their skill paths to deal with that mix of teams? |
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licker
Joined: Jul 10, 2009
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Jan 21, 2014 - 17:35 |
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So, I see no other cpomb teams in there, which is great news for you  Unless you count the skaven, but you already played them.
3 halfers and 2 lizards means plenty of little dodge dudes, though all you really need is block to smack them around. Tents is also useful against them. I'd get a block/tackle/mb presti, and a claw/mb/po one (if for no other reason than just to see what they do). Othwerwise you will have the strength advantage against everyone other than the khemri, and maybe the orcs/lizies, so guard doesn't seem super necessary on your warriors. Meaning I'd go block/MB on them then add guard 3rd.
dodge on one presti and extra arms (which is ugg... in my opinion) on another is fine. Keep the EA guy your ball carrier for now, use the dodge guy for whatever, or just have them swap up as dictated by position. EA is better for picking up/catching anyway, not really great for running. Dodge is better to be the carrier once you get into contact and may need to rely on blodge to survive a blitz, or use the dodge to get out of a TZ.
I think it's imperative that you make a hitter asap though. You want that one block/MB/tackle/PO/Claw (the latter 3 in whatever order make sense based on matchups) to blitz with every turn to try and get the numbers advantage, or to take out the oppositions most worrisome player. Eventually, at higher TVs, you want 2 or even 3 of those kinds of guys, though one of them will probably be a warrior.
https://fumbbl.com/p/team?team_id=702110
Is my R nurgle who I think are built well to handle a variety of different kinds of matchups. In particular you can look at the prestis to see how I built them. The new one is going to be another hitter, with MB next and then claw/tackle/po depending on what happens to the rest of the team along the way.
The killer warrior took jump up on his double which may have been a mistake over dodge, at AG2 the jump up to block fails enough that it's kind of annoying, but on the other hand he can blitz from prone and hit things that are not right next to him.
I had a nice blodge beast at first, but he died  The new one looks to be a boring guard/stand firm model, but he's still effective enough. |
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DrPoods
Joined: Nov 14, 2013
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Jan 21, 2014 - 18:06 |
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That's great advice mate. Thank you!
Will probably face the more developed bashy teams if I fluke my way into the finals! So developing a killer or two might be handy indeed.
And this advice would probably work wonders for In The Garden Of Nurgle too. This is the side that I am trying to make a go of in Ranked. I guess for that team, following your team link is a good template.
(Not sure if the song lyrics bio is overdoing it a bit though!  ) |
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licker
Joined: Jul 10, 2009
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Jan 21, 2014 - 18:17 |
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Aye, my way isn't the best way necessarily
Just the way I did it.
From taking a quick look at your R team I can see that you struggle on offense. 2 TDs in 7 games... no wonder your prestis are lagging so much
Hopefully the 145 club is providing some more experience with positioning and how to run a bash teams offense, but you may want to poke around for some tips on offense in general, or watch some replays of other nurgle teams (when they were young) to see how they did it.
I honestly cannot remember the creation of the Smelltics, but their record (picked, oh, my yes, picked...) indicates that I managed to outscore my opponents most of the time.
RRDs nurgle is another good one to look at, but really any nurgle with a good record should show you some tips on how to set up and run your offense. |
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RobRoyDuncan
Joined: Apr 15, 2011
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Jan 21, 2014 - 18:51 |
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For the record, your Ranked Nurgs features the Extra Arms pesti, while the Dodge one is in League. Not the same team.
I approve of Extra Arms more than licker does - I like the better pickups (when I am willing to use a reroll) more than Sure Hands, and having one of them allows you to farm SPP on your other pestigors much more easily. Other than that, I am mostly in agreement with licker, although I would still grab Guard on your next warrior to reach a second skill. |
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licker
Joined: Jul 10, 2009
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Jan 21, 2014 - 21:37 |
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EA isn't bad for what it does, but I just never quite seem to see a compelling reason to take it. Then again with most of my teams I'm not that bothered by slightly worse pick ups, and I play a lot of CD who struggle worse with it than Nurgle does in general.
Sure hands actually makes your pick ups succeed more often than EA, *if* you don't want to use a rr for the attempt. Sure hands also counters any strip ballers out there, which may or may not matter, but when it does matter it tends to matter a lot.
EA feels like more of a 4th skill or later depending on the build, and if that guy lucks into +AG EA is essentially wasted, while SH still provides the same bonus it always did. But it's not really a huge deal either way, go with what you prefer. |
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DrPoods
Joined: Nov 14, 2013
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Jan 21, 2014 - 23:03 |
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| RobRoyDuncan wrote: | For the record, your Ranked Nurgs features the Extra Arms pesti, while the Dodge one is in League. Not the same team.
I approve of Extra Arms more than licker does - I like the better pickups (when I am willing to use a reroll) more than Sure Hands, and having one of them allows you to farm SPP on your other pestigors much more easily. Other than that, I am mostly in agreement with licker, although I would still grab Guard on your next warrior to reach a second skill. |
Oh yeah. I just noticed that too. Ooops!
In my defence I was a bit preoccupied by doing some work at the same time which was confusing the hell out of me. Guess it passed over.
It DOES mean I can folllow the advice on the Pestigors after all, which is good to know!
It's always nice to have a blueprint to follow. |
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Smeat
Joined: Nov 19, 2006
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Jan 21, 2014 - 23:24 |
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| DrPoods wrote: | | It's always nice to have a blueprint to follow. |
Not so much a hard "blueprint", more an "architectural concept drawing" - there will be diffs, both due to skill rolls and lost players, and also just your own playstyle. The diff between Extra Arm vs. Sure Hands is a great example - both coaches feel comfortable and correct in their choice for how they play/enjoy the game.
GL! |
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Let's go A.P.E.!
(...and what exactly do you think they do with all those dead players?...) |
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