PainState
Joined: Apr 04, 2007
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 Posted:
Nov 15, 2014 - 19:01 |
 
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I like the idea of having some form of counter to Claw.
Claw reduces AV to 7 and +AV upgrades are added on top of that. So a 2 X +AV player would have a 9 AV against claw or 8 with one +AV.
So there you go, all our problems are solved.
PileOn is only a big guy skill
Claw now has a counter in +AV
Mighty Blow has a natural counter called HIGH AV. |
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Calcium
Joined: Apr 08, 2007
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| Posted:
Nov 15, 2014 - 19:07 |
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| PainState wrote: | I like the idea of having some form of counter to Claw.
Claw reduces AV to 7 and +AV upgrades are added on top of that. So a 2 X +AV player would have a 9 AV against claw or 8 with one +AV.
So there you go, all our problems are solved.
PileOn is only a big guy skill
Claw now has a counter in +AV
Mighty Blow has a natural counter called HIGH AV. |
I would roll with these suggestions with a few tweaks
Pile on available to ST5+ players
+AV is +1 to the claw and a natural counter to MB (which it is already)
Big guys immune to claw |
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Roland
Joined: May 12, 2004
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Nov 15, 2014 - 19:29 |
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I like the old pileOn, adding strength instead of rerolling. (And was a trait perhaps?)
Made it more useful on big guys. |
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PainState
Joined: Apr 04, 2007
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Nov 15, 2014 - 19:40 |
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| Roland wrote: | I like the old pileOn, adding strength instead of rerolling. (And was a trait perhaps?)
Made it more useful on big guys. |
PileOn was normal ST access skill. Stand Firm was a trait. in LRB4.
Old PileOn rules of adding ST to the AV check roll, well, that would seriously mess up this CRP universe.
Remember back in the day of adding your ST to your AV check the guy you were blocking usually had a AV9 or 10. Heck some guys had AV11 and do not forget the old toughness skill. Which reduced the Injury check roll.
Big guys back in the day were very, very hard to depitch due to AV 10 or 11 and they had toughness of 2-4. |
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Roland
Joined: May 12, 2004
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Nov 15, 2014 - 19:49 |
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It was still "add strength" in LRB 1.3 iirc |
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MattDakka
Joined: Oct 09, 2007
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Nov 15, 2014 - 20:19 |
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| Kam wrote: | | MattDakka wrote: | | Instead of making them immune to PO, change PO so that you require to have 1 STRENGTH point higher than victim's ST in order to PO. |
That wouldn't help much against Chaos or Nurgle, and that would completely break UW teams... |
Since most BB players have ST 3 building a Beastman clawpomber would become suddenly less useful, reducing the number of effective clawpombers to 4 (Chaos/Nurgle Warriors) but Chaos/Nurgle Warriors are worse blitzers than Beastmen due to MA 5/4.
Chaos Dwarfs would be nerfed as well, because their Blockers have ST 3. |
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uzkulak
Joined: Mar 30, 2004
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Nov 15, 2014 - 20:32 |
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Nah - unless you make all str4 players big guys and give them loner and a nega-trait...
The suggestion is about how to make big guys more effective not make them even worse versions of lower strength players. |
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Calcium
Joined: Apr 08, 2007
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Nov 15, 2014 - 20:54 |
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Forget about big guys only having PO, I think any player with ST5, either enhanced or natural should be able to access it - this to me seems like a simple clear rule adjustment and it would be a reward for chaos warriors who are blessed with a +ST. |
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Beerox
Joined: Feb 14, 2008
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Nov 15, 2014 - 21:23 |
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| koadah wrote: |
Even an 11 stone guy coming down hard on your head/arm/leg etc with his knee/elbow is gonna do you some damage.
You don't have to be Siragusa.
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A snotling Piling On Morg is dumb.
| PainState wrote: |
PileOn is only a big guy skill
Claw now has a counter in +AV
Mighty Blow has a natural counter called HIGH AV. |
That'll do. |
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koadah
Joined: Mar 30, 2005
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Nov 15, 2014 - 21:45 |
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Roland
Joined: May 12, 2004
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| Posted:
Nov 15, 2014 - 22:14 |
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| Calcium wrote: | | Forget about big guys only having PO, I think any player with ST5, either enhanced or natural should be able to access it - this to me seems like a simple clear rule adjustment and it would be a reward for chaos warriors who are blessed with a +ST. |
Welcome to GRIND
where MB requires ST4 and PO ST5 |
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PainState
Joined: Apr 04, 2007
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| Posted:
Nov 15, 2014 - 22:17 |
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| koadah wrote: | | Beerox wrote: | | koadah wrote: |
Even an 11 stone guy coming down hard on your head/arm/leg etc with his knee/elbow is gonna do you some damage.
You don't have to be Siragusa.
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A snotling Piling On Morg is dumb.
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If you took PO on a snotling and that snotling was able to bring down Morg... |
You good sir, might think it is dumb but let me reassure you those snotlings are some really sneaky and low down dudes!!!
KRIKACK THE AVATAR OF DESTRUCTION IS TAKEN BEHIND THE SNOTLING WOODSHED!!!
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PainState
Joined: Apr 04, 2007
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Nov 15, 2014 - 22:23 |
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If coaches like the idea that PileOn should not be a big guy only skill.
Then you change PileOn to this.
In order to use PileOn the blocker must throw a 2DB or 3DB in order to use it. That allows you to use guard and or assists to pump up the blocker ST. Which also would represent a PileOn dog pile of sorts from multiple players blocking one player.
OR
You stick to you have to have a 5+ or 4+ ST to access PileOn.
I will stick to my guns that it is a big guy only skill. |
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Chainsaw
Joined: Aug 31, 2005
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| Posted:
Nov 15, 2014 - 22:30 |
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| PainState wrote: | I like the idea of having some form of counter to Claw.
Claw reduces AV to 7 and +AV upgrades are added on top of that. So a 2 X +AV player would have a 9 AV against claw or 8 with one +AV.
So there you go, all our problems are solved.
PileOn is only a big guy skill
Claw now has a counter in +AV
Mighty Blow has a natural counter called HIGH AV. |
Why does everybody thing that claw/po needs to MASSIVE nerf? It's only just slightly OP. If you destroy it completely, then bash teams will be RUINED.
Piling On should not be a big guy only skill. Forget that. Yes, it has an issue that a snot could pile on a tree and kill it. So what. If it ever happens, it'll be epic.
The +AV rule would fine tune the current ruleset in the right direction. It'd give high AV teams a way to counter claw, which is currently the main issue - because clawpomb teams don't get pegged back enough and thus build into behemoths over a VERY LONG time in BB terms (especially League+TT terms).
I'm curious, how many Leagues have been ruined by Clawpomb? WIL doesn't seem to have any issues with it. That's the longest running league as far as I know?
We're trying to fix a niche problem where in an open environment over 100+ games somebody can build a team with a few clawpombers in it and thus everybody panics. |
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Chainsaw
Joined: Aug 31, 2005
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| Posted:
Nov 15, 2014 - 22:32 |
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| PainState wrote: | If coaches like the idea that PileOn should not be a big guy only skill.
Then you change PileOn to this.
In order to use PileOn the blocker must throw a 2DB or 3DB in order to use it. That allows you to use guard and or assists to pump up the blocker ST. Which also would represent a PileOn dog pile of sorts from multiple players blocking one player.
OR
You stick to you have to have a 5+ or 4+ ST to access PileOn.
I will stick to my guns that it is a big guy only skill. |
PO has a counter in the ruleset. It's called fend. Stop going overboard. |
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