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Bakunin



Joined: May 08, 2011

Post   Posted: Mar 16, 2017 - 11:19 Reply with quote Back to top

From the front page:

I've pushed through some changes that should fix the issues we had with petty cash and inducements earlier today. With this fix, I've also re-enabled the BB2016 settings for petty cash (meaning all treasury is moved to petty cash automatically, and it doesn't affect your TV). Note that using gold beyond the "underdog" free inducement gold you get will affect your team treasury.

Beyond this, the previous announcement regarding Piling On has been revised. The absolute storm of responses on it made it very clear that a majority of you are unhappy with the decision that was made. I have taken a few of the points brought up to heart and have chosen to change the way it's going to be dealt with:

Players in R and B who have the Piling On skill will have that skill replaced with Juggernaut.

Why the change? The key problem with switching it to Mighty Blow is that it hurts big guys (who inherently have mighty blow). The lookups I did on skill picks did not take these inherent positional skills into account, and taking that into account made it abundantly clear that switching to Mighty Blow would more or less be equivalent to simply leaving it as-is.

With Juggernaut as the skill to replace Piling On, there are far fewer players with duplicates (6% of PI players, who will still be left as-is with a skill that simply bloats the player).

This skill change will take place at some point soon(tm), e.g. within a few hours unless some other more pressing thing crops up (for example more problems with results).

Edit
Players in Ranked and Blackbox now have Juggernaut instead of Piling On.


Last edited by Bakunin on Mar 19, 2017 - 23:18; edited 4 times in total
YOUsayWHAT



Joined: Feb 02, 2017

Post   Posted: Mar 16, 2017 - 11:20 Reply with quote Back to top

http://www.sjgames.com/illuminati/img/illogo.jpg
Garion



Joined: Aug 19, 2009

Post   Posted: Mar 16, 2017 - 11:23 Reply with quote Back to top

Changed to MB when it gets removed I believe

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Bakunin



Joined: May 08, 2011

Post   Posted: Mar 16, 2017 - 11:23 Reply with quote Back to top

From the front page: "A number of things still remain to be implemented at the moment:
Piling On
This skill will be disabled on the site. Existing players with Piling On will have that skill directly replaced with Mighty Blow. Players who already have Mighty Blow will end up with two copies of the skill, which will let as-is. This way of dealing with the skill is a compromise between complexity of implementing a migration system and trying to not ruin teams completely. This is similar to the transition from LRB4 to LRB5 (e.g. removal of Razor Sharp Claws, which was transitioned to Claw). This will take effect in the near future; I'm hoping to be able to get this done before this week is".
licker



Joined: Jul 10, 2009

Post   Posted: Mar 16, 2017 - 16:18 Reply with quote Back to top

Doing something is better than doing nothing, but seriously? How many players have PO who don't already have MB?

At least change it to strong arm, that way it's a skill I would imagine will never be duplicated.
thoralf



Joined: Mar 06, 2008

Post   Posted: Mar 16, 2017 - 16:32 Reply with quote Back to top

Some suggested Juggernaut instead. Others Guard.

Expensive Mistakes will make this concern moot in a few months.

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zakatan



Joined: May 17, 2008

Post   Posted: Mar 16, 2017 - 16:38 Reply with quote Back to top

thoralf wrote:
Some suggested Juggernaut instead. Others Guard.


It'd be nice to have a choice for another S skill. Specially considering that PO is a skill that follows MB in most killer combos.

To add insult to injury, if it's like the transmutation from LRB4 to CRP, both MB will count towards TV (looking at you 40TV side step, side step snotling).

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ArrestedDevelopment



Joined: Sep 14, 2015

Post   Posted: Mar 16, 2017 - 17:03 Reply with quote Back to top

Here's some basic problems that Christer will be facing on this:

Treemen start with: stand firm, strong arm, mighty blow
Deathrollers start with: stand firm, juggernaut, break tackle
Dwarves/Cdorks, Ogres, Minos etc etc start with: thick skull
All big guys: Mighty blow (and also increasingly likely to have juggernaut etc too)

Nobody starts with guard or grab, but a pretty significant percentage of that pomber player-base is going to be Norse or other frenzy players, so grab isn't really an option.

Nobody really wants multiple block since for a large percentage of the players with PO it'll be just as useless.

[edit] Basically, there is *no* "nice way" to do this short of deleting the skill from everyone and having them reroll the pick next game played. If that's not an option for Christer, I'm sure he has his reasons for it (something as simple as breaking replays may well be one).

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PeteW



Joined: Aug 05, 2005

Post   Posted: Mar 16, 2017 - 17:12 Reply with quote Back to top

As the alternative is moving all [R] team to an [X] division and starting from scratch.... I think this is a good solution!

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licker



Joined: Jul 10, 2009

Post   Posted: Mar 16, 2017 - 17:15 Reply with quote Back to top

It's not about 'no nice way', it's about picking something that isn't going to be completely useless on 99% of the players who have PO.
licker



Joined: Jul 10, 2009

Post   Posted: Mar 16, 2017 - 17:16 Reply with quote Back to top

PeteW wrote:
As the alternative is moving all [R] team to an [X] division and starting from scratch.... I think this is a good solution!


If by [X] you mean [B] and then closing [R] I think you're on to something Wink
PainState



Joined: Apr 04, 2007

Post   Posted: Mar 16, 2017 - 17:16 Reply with quote Back to top

My one vote is nothing happens...it is just a skill on some players that no longer has any effect and over time it will eventually fade away as those players are retired or killed.

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thoralf



Joined: Mar 06, 2008

Post   Posted: Mar 16, 2017 - 17:17 Reply with quote Back to top

zakatan wrote:
To add insult to injury


PO always felt that way to me.

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PainState



Joined: Apr 04, 2007

Post   Posted: Mar 16, 2017 - 17:20 Reply with quote Back to top

Now if Christer decides to replace it...this is my vote.

Players with pile On are so enraged, pissed off at the heavens, Calling out to NUFFLE and cursing his name that they have become unhinged!!!!

Pile On converts to DIRTY PLAYER.

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garyt1



Joined: Mar 12, 2011

Post   Posted: Mar 16, 2017 - 17:41 Reply with quote Back to top

Christer posted the stats on comment on the news regarding what other skills piling on players have. As 69% have mighty blow already that is very obviously a poor replacement choice. Strong Arm is clearly a terrible option for most and thick skull would be a weird choice.
Of the others Grab and multiple block are not working on blitzes, and Juggernaut doesn't work on blocks. Quite a lot of piling on players have block too. Break tackle is poor for the many s3 Piling on players.

Guard is arguably the best strength skill other than mighty blow so certainly is a better choice due to less skill duplication. But still 37% have it already.

Stand firm would be my main other option over Guard as it is useful, doesn't have restrictions in its use clashing with other skills, and has a small ownership on piling on players.

From Christer-
33516 players have Piling On
23285 of these have Mighty Blow (69%)

12277 have guard (37%)
3341 have break tackle (10%)
2004 have juggernaut (6%)
1829 have stand firm (5%)
1362 have grab (4%)
1359 have multiple block (4%)
1232 have thick skull (4%)
254 have strong arm (1%)

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