DM
Joined: Aug 13, 2004
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 Posted:
May 31, 2005 - 06:58 |
 
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I've played Warhammer 40k for nearly 10 years - since just after the release of 2nd edition - so I might be able to add a few cents to the subject.
- It IS expensive. GW's revised rules from 2nd ed to 3rd and now 4th put a lot of emphasis on actually fielding a lot of models physically and those models are expensive! You will need a fair investment financially if you wish to participate and then a lot more time painting your figures. If you do not like painting, I'd think twice about playing 40k. I stopped playing 40k with the introduction of 4th edition - the game is poorly priced I feel in today's competitive market.
- The rules for 40k are still too 'dumbed down' and full of 'grey areas'. It's a complicated game compounded by things like vehicles, Line of Sight, Movement and Ranges for weaponry. In BB, it's all as clear as the number of squares you count - not so in 40k where it's measurements by tape measure. Seems straight forward I know, but trust me, it can cause arguements adnauseum - especially in a tournament environment.
- GW WANT you to KEEP buying models! They will phase out old races (Squats anyone?) and not allow them for play under future revisions of the rules. They also have 'power creep' whereby the latest army release will often have aspects of it that are more powerful than the releases before it. The classic comparison of the Space Marines codex at the start of 3rd edition and the Chaos codex at the end of 3rd edition shows this stark contrast clearly.
- You cannot play either 40k or Fantasy online, although they have attempted to create PC games for these two - they are not really a transition of the table top to PC, but rather games 'flavoured' by the various Warhammer worlds.
If you're willing to take a look, just make sure you do it with your eyes open is all I suggest. I think you'll find Warhammer Fantasy the better game to get into anyway (since it's closely related to BB fluff wise) and the spare models you get from that game will be useful for making new BB teams if you're so inclined  But if you want a 'guns n ammo' kind of game, I would suggest different games in all truth - Either Flames of War (if you're into WW2) or as Oz suggested, WARMACHINE by Privateer Press (Which I played for the last 8 months).
If you have any specific questions you would like to ask just drop me a PM, otherwise best of luck with your choices.
Oh and as for me? Hell, I don't play any of those games anymore - I came back to the best party in town for my table top needs... Bloodbowl!!! |
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Rumplestiltskin
Joined: Nov 05, 2004
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May 31, 2005 - 08:22 |
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As a tabletop wargame, I'm not so sure the current incarnation of 40K is really so great - mostly because of the grey areas and power-creep mentioned above. However, the 40K universe is really really cool. I can't stress that enough. REALLY REALLY COOL. It's cool ok? |
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Kommando
Joined: Dec 08, 2003
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May 31, 2005 - 15:09 |
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even better than cool. but where the tau really necessary? and squats, my poor poor squats...  |
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Wotfudboy
Joined: Feb 17, 2004
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May 31, 2005 - 15:30 |
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W40K... ah the memories... Most of my figures are boxed up now, but I do have a small display cabinet with some of my choice models in. I never played Warhammer Fantasy either as a kid or adult, looked far too regimented, pushing blocks of mass miniatures around. But W40K did have a certain appeal.
I got very much tied up with the W40K universe, the diversity and the history... enjoying the Ian Watson Inquisitor and Space Marine books... but I grew tired of the constant revisions and additions... even making some space marines more powerful than other chapters.
Anyway, for anyone looking to get into W40K, there's really no reason why you can't pick up the box set, play a few games with the plastic space marines and orks, and if you don't like it, sell it on Ebay, or to someone here as nearly new. If you do like it, you should get an idea of whether you want a mass minitature race like orks or genestealers, or a high point/low quantity setup like eldar. You will only be able to afford one or two races... and have the patience to paint them!
If you do play a game, make sure you have a nice flat space free that you can leave undisturbed over a day or two... sometimes being a new player, all the set up and rule checks and stuff can be very time consuming.
I was "lucky" in that I bought a tonne of old lead made figures back when they were "cheaper"... I still have a good deal that I put away to paint at some later stage... but I don't think I'll play again... They will just be a work of art for later!
Edit - Also what annoyed me about GW was that they got rid of that great model kit of 30 odd Mk6 armour plastic space marines. Anyone remember them? If only I had the forethought to buy a few boxes! I suppose they have to make some profit some how though!... but let's face it, it gives parents something to buy their kids for birthdays! |
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ultwe
Joined: Dec 25, 2004
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May 31, 2005 - 15:55 |
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| Shepherd wrote: | | BB-type Java services that I could mess about with just to try to get a feel for the game? |
Well, Warmaster has one....
It is not as polished as the BB one, and the developper hasn't touched it for a while (+ you need to code your moves)andt its a PBEM (or IM) client, no "live" feature.
Still, it gives a good representation of the game.
you can find it there:
http://games.groups.yahoo.com/group/BattleSpeak/.
The group has been dormant for a while, so not sure if you can get a game (would offer you one, but unfortunately lack in time).
You can find the rules of the game in the GW vaults
D.
PS: Oh, and the players tend to be older type, for whom playing is at least as important as wining, and there isn't too much "codex creep". |
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Penix
Joined: May 25, 2005
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May 31, 2005 - 16:09 |
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Does anybody play necromunda?
Am I mad if I play? |
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'cause I can |
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Shepherd
Joined: Oct 28, 2004
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May 31, 2005 - 18:30 |
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After looking into all of this (thanks for all the info!) I am actually more intrigued by Necromunda as a "gateway" game than 40k, which seems like a massive commitment of time & energy. Seeing as our regular BB league is on hiatus for the summer, I'm wondering about maybe getting a Necromunda set and seeing if the regular TT BBers around here would like to give it a shot with me. |
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asperon
Joined: Aug 02, 2003
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May 31, 2005 - 18:53 |
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| Wotfudboy wrote: |
Anyway, for anyone looking to get into W40K, there's really no reason why you can't pick up the box set, play a few games with the plastic space marines and orks, and if you don't like it, sell it on Ebay, or to someone here as nearly new. If you do like it, you should get an idea of whether you want a mass minitature race like orks or genestealers, or a high point/low quantity setup like eldar. You will only be able to afford one or two races... and have the patience to paint them!
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The latest version comes with SM and tyranids.
| Wotfudboy wrote: |
Edit - Also what annoyed me about GW was that they got rid of that great model kit of 30 odd Mk6 armour plastic space marines. Anyone remember them? If only I had the forethought to buy a few boxes! I suppose they have to make some profit some how though!... but let's face it, it gives parents something to buy their kids for birthdays! |
And what wrong with the current plastic SM? They are way better looking then the old set, and a great way to build a army. The only bad thing is probably the price, on the other hand the models are just that much better.
But i agree, WFB is the better game of the two, by far. |
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mymLaban
Joined: Apr 20, 2004
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May 31, 2005 - 19:11 |
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| thesquig wrote: | | In my experience 40k is a game for really young kids and powergamers. However if you play it within a group of friends it can be like any other game. Although I'd say its slightly more competative in nature than BB. |
hmm not so sure about that tbh, but maybe now with all the rules its better suited for kids was that not the reason for them to change it? i dont know, i got some friends that still plays 40k and none of them are under 30 |
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mymLaban
Joined: Apr 20, 2004
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May 31, 2005 - 19:13 |
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ohh while we are in the warhammer world. did anyone try the new WFRP 2nd edition thing? i play the good old WFRP but one of my friends bought the new edition but we havent tried it out yet, seems kinda strange to make a new edition imo but that cause i like it as it is  |
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Natakutoo
Joined: Dec 14, 2004
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May 31, 2005 - 19:28 |
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WFRP2...
It's... umm... interesting. Not all that keen on the new magic, however they seem to have fixed the careers for the most part.
And you can gain insanity points at an INSANE rate. End of our first adventure every character in the party had 1-3 insanities, excpet for the guy who had mutated. So, y'know, I'm a fine of that.
At any rate, worth looking at, give it a game or two. |
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Keyoke
Joined: Apr 26, 2005
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May 31, 2005 - 20:33 |
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I think looking into necromunda is a great idea, as its roughly equivalent in size to blood bowl in the number of minatures required. Also the development of a gang occurs in much the same way as for a blood bowl team. As such i think it would be a brilliant intro to the 40k universe that wont cost you the earth.
Although i would suggest buying the original rules set off ebay as opposed to the revised rules, as they managed to mess up so many things through lack of effort. Example, restricting weapon access not based on fluff but rather based on the models they had released up to that point.
I personally prefer necromunda to blood bowl and as such would highly recommend it. |
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mymLaban
Joined: Apr 20, 2004
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May 31, 2005 - 21:47 |
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| Natakutoo wrote: | WFRP2...
It's... umm... interesting. Not all that keen on the new magic, however they seem to have fixed the careers for the most part.
And you can gain insanity points at an INSANE rate. End of our first adventure every character in the party had 1-3 insanities, excpet for the guy who had mutated. So, y'know, I'm a fine of that.
At any rate, worth looking at, give it a game or two. |
aha i see, i think the rate insanity points was coming in as it was, was fast enough hehe
what do you mean fixed the careers?
sry for snatching the topic. |
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Natakutoo
Joined: Dec 14, 2004
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May 31, 2005 - 22:02 |
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Fixing careers... Well, the progression is somewhat slower now, +5 to stats where we had +10 before for example. And they made a bunch of careers we should have had the first time round, barman for example.
Ah, and combat has changed, now you can take half-actions and full actions, like in *shudder* D20.
Hurrah for thread hijacks |
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mymLaban
Joined: Apr 20, 2004
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May 31, 2005 - 22:12 |
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hmm i see sounds pretty good tbh |
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