SnakeSanders
Joined: Aug 02, 2003
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 Posted:
Jul 28, 2005 - 20:46 |
 
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Hey folks!
Vault 1.9 has recently been released and any play testing comments would be welcome. Inducements seem to be getting closer to the finished article and the Ogre team looks like a blast to play compared to the broken nonsense we have now 
Some of you might gasp when you see that Skaven, Chaos and Nurgle can get mutations on a normal skill roll (!) but the mutations have been balanced and Razor Sharp Claws has gone and Claw treats all AV = 7. Good news for Wood Elves then, bad news for trees 
If you are too lazy and want to know what the Nurgle and Ogre rosters look like then here they are!
| Code: |
Qty Title Cost MA ST AG AV Skills Norm Double
0-16 Rotter 40k 5 3 3 8 Decay, Nurgle’s Rot GM ASP
0-4 Pestigor 80k 6 3 3 8 Horns, Nurgle’s Rot, GSM AP
Regenerate
0-4 Nurgle 110k 4 4 2 9 Disturbing Presence, GSM AP
Warrior Foul Appearance, Nurgle’s Rot,
Regenerate
0-1 Beast of 140k 4 5 1 9 Loner, Disturbing Presence, S GAPM
Nurgle Foul Appearance, Mighty Blow,
Nurgle’s Rot, Really Stupid,
Regenerate, Tentacles
Nurgle’s Rot (Extraordinary)
If a player with this horrible disease kills an opposing player of starting
Strength 4 or less that does not have Regenerate or Stunty during a
blocking or fouling action that is not healed by an Apothecary, then he is
crossed off the opposing team roster as normal at the end of game, but
the Nurgle team may add a new Rotter for free during the Post Match.
The new Rotter is added during step 6 of Updating Your Team Roster
(see page 37). He may only be taken if you have less than 16 players. A
free Rotter still counts at full value towards the total value of the team.
0-8 Re-roll counters: 70k gold pieces each
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| Code: |
Qty Title Cost MA ST AG AV Skills Norm Double
0-16 Snotlings 20k 5 1 3 5 Dodge, Right Stuff, Side Step, A GSP
Stunty, Titchy
0-6 Ogres 140k 5 5 2 9 Loner, Bone-head, Mighty Blow, S GAP
Thick Skull, Throw Team Mate
Titchy (Extraordinary)
Titchy players tend to be even smaller and more nimble than other
Stunty players. To represent this, the player may add 1 to any Dodge roll
he attempts. On the other hand, while opponents have to dodge to leave
a Titchy player’s tackle zone, Titchy players are so small that they do not
exert a -1 modifier when opponents dodge into their tackle zone.
0-8 Re-roll counters: 70k gold pieces each
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Inducements still form the main replacement for the handicap table, but if you don’t like this, a separate cards table has been drawn up, with mad events like fans lobbing souvenir footballs, random goblin fanatics being thrown on to the field, and the good old custard pie
Secret weapons will be a lot more common in leagues, as Dark Elves get an assassin positional player, Dwarves can get a permanent Deathroller (who can take strength skills), Goblins get 4 secret weapon positionals and there is a new Skaven Star player assassin!
If you want to see the Vault 1.9 LRB then you can find it here
Also, check out the official Vault feedback forum if you want to follow the ongoing discussions and if you want to contribute. If you do play bloodbowl in real life, give these rules a whirl and see what you think. Even better say what you found good and bad and why |
Last edited by SnakeSanders on %b %28, %2005 - %21:%Jul; edited 3 times in total |
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Topper28
Joined: Nov 02, 2003
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| Posted:
Jul 28, 2005 - 20:53 |
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Am I the only one who can´t get the PDF file to open? |
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SubSonic
Joined: Aug 22, 2003
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| Posted:
Jul 28, 2005 - 20:57 |
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Topper28
Joined: Nov 02, 2003
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| Posted:
Jul 28, 2005 - 20:57 |
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origami
Joined: Oct 14, 2003
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| Posted:
Jul 28, 2005 - 20:58 |
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I suspect that rotters are not quite that agile.
These look like some interesting changes that will help to keep the game fresh. The change to Claw was especially clever, making it the bane of high AV players without being deadly to those with low AV. |
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Synn
Joined: Dec 13, 2004
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| Posted:
Jul 28, 2005 - 21:32 |
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Love the vault here.
One thing though..... Multiple Block + Stab = Multiple Stab?
Reason i ask is that Horkon has multiple block! 
Can we please get a division for these new rules?
Peace,
__Synn |
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Jinxed
Joined: Jul 04, 2004
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| Posted:
Jul 28, 2005 - 21:42 |
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Hmm, I like the removal of rsf but I am not so sure about claws making all armour 7. It basically means claw does not change vs AV9 but loses vs the rest. That's a BIG hit. Necromantic teams will drop a notch I think. No point left to play these really. Or will they be compensated in some way you have not mentioned? |
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Nuffle sucks |
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CorporateSlave3
Joined: Feb 07, 2004
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| Posted:
Jul 28, 2005 - 21:58 |
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| Jinxed wrote: | | Hmm, I like the removal of rsf but I am not so sure about claws making all armour 7. It basically means claw does not change vs AV9 but loses vs the rest. That's a BIG hit. Necromantic teams will drop a notch I think. No point left to play these really. Or will they be compensated in some way you have not mentioned? |
Well...he did mention it, but I would say being able to take it on a normal roll is a bit of compensation, yes? |
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vanGorn
Joined: Feb 24, 2004
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| Posted:
Jul 28, 2005 - 22:13 |
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Good news that ogres couldn't field more than 6 big guys anymore and that their little fellows are weaker (and cheaper) than goblins. |
_________________
Gimme a pint of fungus beer!
Then we will climb the ladder.
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Jinxed
Joined: Jul 04, 2004
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 Posted:
Jul 28, 2005 - 22:19 |
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| CorporateSlave3 wrote: | | Well...he did mention it, but I would say being able to take it on a normal roll is a bit of compensation, yes? |
 And what has the ease with which mutations can be taken to do with Necromantic teams in general and Werewolves in specific? |
_________________
Nuffle sucks
Last edited by Jinxed on %b %28, %2005 - %22:%Jul; edited 2 times in total |
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harald
Joined: Dec 04, 2003
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| Posted:
Jul 28, 2005 - 22:32 |
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Too bad the vault rules will make it more dice than ever before. Booo! |
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SnakeSanders
Joined: Aug 02, 2003
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| Posted:
Jul 28, 2005 - 23:34 |
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Claw is still good. Depending on who you play that is. You wont play wood elves and gobs every game Av8 is still the most comon AV in the game. AV 7 still breaks easily and you might not have noticed, but a roll of 10 on the kill table means +MA or +AV, so can see a few Norsemen taking the +AV as is better value AV7->8 compared to Ma6 ->7. Claws will still be good and useful, if they get a double, Mighty Blow can still stack, so your tree suddenly has AV6 |
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SnakeSanders
Joined: Aug 02, 2003
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| Posted:
Jul 28, 2005 - 23:47 |
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Plus, your werewolf will take a different role on your team, adapting your playstyle. after 3 skills, with Claw/Frenzy/Mighty Blow/Dauntless/Block requiring ony one doubles roll, he will cut khemri mummies/Ogres/ BOB's down like butter, as there are no more traits
As a Necro coach, you also get access to Hack Enslash, the chainsaw skeleton star player! |
Last edited by SnakeSanders on %b %28, %2005 - %23:%Jul; edited 1 time in total |
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chunky04
Joined: Aug 11, 2003
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| Posted:
Jul 28, 2005 - 23:50 |
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Claw is crap now - you're much better off taking MB if you have access to it, which the majority of players with mutations access do.
Vault 1.8 is much better than 1.9 IMO.
The whole change to mutations came about because a) Claw + MB + Piling On was too good when they were all stacking, and they didn't want to make exceptions and b) They wanted more different mutations being taken.
So now we have this utter crap where the nerfed mutations now have to compete with Block, Tackle, Guard, Mighty Blow, Sure Hands, and will generally be taken after some or all of these skills depending on a players specialisation. The mutations apart from Big Hand, Claw, FA (not that these are the same anymore) still have the big problem in that to make decent use of them you have to take a bunch of them, but if you're lucky enough to get +AG you just got the lot in one fell swoop. This makes it inefficient to grab those mutations, and the current solution will not get around that at all. Oh, and of coursse they then introduced another exception anyway so that Big Guys still only got mutations on doubles - what a joke.
Then, just to make sure that the folks against these changes won't really have a chance to make enough arguments against them, 1.9 is pushed through extremely quickly. This will mean that these changes WILL be in the new version. Though they are boring, will not achieve their intended purpose, they are not broken. Given that the solution of the change to Claw on its own was never given sufficient time to be playtested to see if it was an appropriate solution, there will be no reason at all to go back that way.
I'm just finishing our first season of league play (I'm up to 19 games) testing out the Vault rules, as I am a fan of many parts of them. I won't be doing so anymore though, as the tactics used to quash any dissenting voices and push through various agendas disgust me. I now strongly believe BB is headed for something far worse than the 4th Edition debacle - instead of a ruleset no-one uses, we'll end up with half the community using each, which will be much more destructive for the game as a whole. |
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chunky - you are eloquence on legs |
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SnakeSanders
Joined: Aug 02, 2003
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| Posted:
Jul 29, 2005 - 00:11 |
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I dont know, they seem pretty extreme/strong views (forgive me, im not the best with words ) I know you had a great league running, but is it just the past few weeks that have turned you against it?
I agree with you 100% regarding the less common mutations (Two Heads/Extra Arms). i would like to see them toned up to make them a tougher decision to take vs the other skills. Im also wondering why they dont allow Rat Ogres to take Mutations on a normal roll. They were treated badly in the last RR when they were reduced to Ag2 with no price change. The only reason being that Tentacles would be a very tempting pick and give them an edge over other big guys, but then again, they arent the best big guys.
My hope is that if any changes were rushed and not given much thought, the long period of playrtesting will show it up. I guess all we need is Ski to come up with the goods so we can have our own vault league here, but i know how hard it is to find time/difficulty of programming involved |
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