BigMac
Joined: Dec 19, 2004
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 Posted:
Aug 24, 2005 - 18:55 |
 
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Ok it took me 15 minutes to write this so i'm gonna post it!
(Mojo with all respect this locking business is not necessary)
Anyway, this stuff is important to me so i wanna add this, after all some people may have found the debate itself interesting.
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(in response to xen7ric)
I never even mentioned the leaders of my country. This is about the constitution of my country, to witch the Leaders vowed on.
Some of the people who forged this constitution merle escaped those gas chambers. Those were the great minds i refered to.
Hollow One's "Oppinion" is that it is ok to violate some of the most fundamental multiple ethical principles of this country, principles that anchor unchangably in this society.
"Oppinion" is because he oviously lacks the education on the subject, so basically he is just babbling and using doctrines as arguments.(It's a right! It's democracy!) - without questioning the doctrines as such.
He thinks he is in a position to judge what censorship is and what a violation of the freedom of speech is and what is not.
Well he is not, but the people who are have judged it and layed out the reasons for their judgement in a perfectly reasonable way were.
If you think it's not necessary to enforce laws agains holocaust denial, you are entitled of that oppinion. But to call that enforcement "censorship" and a violation of basic human rights while not even beeing informed about the reasoning is ignorance.
This debate started with me explaining the sensitivity of this issue in central, central europe. Thats where mr. "i wanna say something too" jumped in and tries to show of ever since.
So i hope some of the postings were interesting to read for some of you, maybe you learned something about germany and about why people massively oppose any improper use of nazi related language and symbolism and are rather thin skinned on the issue.
For those of you that can read german, i just noticed this is missing in the English version:
http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holocaust-Leugnung#Strafverfolgung
| Quote: | Laut Beschluss vom 13. April 1994 (Az. 1 BvR 23/94, veröffentlicht in BVerfGE 90, 241) hat das Bundesverfassungsgericht entschieden, dass das Leugnen des Holocausts nicht unter das Grundrecht der Meinungsäußerungsfreiheit nach Artikel 5, Absatz 1 Grundgesetz falle. Bei der Behauptung, es habe im Dritten Reich keine Judenverfolgung gegeben, handele es sich vielmehr – so die Richter des Ersten Senats –
„um eine Tatsachenbehauptung, die nach ungezählten Augenzeugenberichten und Dokumenten, den Feststellungen der Gerichte in zahlreichen Strafverfahren und den Erkenntnissen der Geschichtswissenschaft erwiesen unwahr ist. Für sich genommen genießt eine Behauptung dieses Inhalts daher nicht den Schutz der Meinungsfreiheit.“ |
English: The federal court of the constitution has ruled that the denial of the holocaust is not covered by the right of the freedom of speech. instead it is:
"a claim of facts, that is proven by uncountable reports of eye-witnesses, the rulings of courts in numerous sessions, and the conclusions of sience on history un-true. A claim of this content therefore is not protected by the right of the freedom of oppinion".
OK i made my point. This is not censorsip, but wisdom. |
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JanMattys
Joined: Feb 29, 2004
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| Posted:
Aug 24, 2005 - 19:03 |
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The locking business was related to flaming, and I think both you and HollowPoint contributed to the locking of the previous thread. Keeping a nice and understanding profile would surely help the threads you post in not to be locked.
On a side note, HollowPoint is entitled to have an opinion just as you are.
Both of you have points, and both of you just refuse to be only 50% right. |
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freak_in_a_frock
Joined: Aug 02, 2003
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| Posted:
Aug 24, 2005 - 19:12 |
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Now i am a lazy person, i like to click on the links at the top of the page to take me to the latest topics under discussion in the fumbbl world. Recently all i get is people bickering about stuff that, not only had nothing to do with blood bowl, but to be frankly honest i really couldn't give a flying rat's arse about.
Please can't we all just get along and talk about something even vaguely related to the site
Now everybody let's have a group hug |
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Mezir
Joined: Aug 02, 2003
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| Posted:
Aug 24, 2005 - 19:16 |
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Locked because the original post fails to be civil to the target party.
Learn to argue without resorting to fallacies. |
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Build a man a fire and he's warm for a day; set a man on fire and he's warm for the rest of his life. |
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