pac
Joined: Oct 03, 2005
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 Posted:
Dec 16, 2005 - 22:41 |
 
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| Macavity wrote: | | See? Just like me. I've often said if you rate ideas on a scale of one to ten, I'll get you a seven in the time it takes to blink, but it'll take me all day to improve it to a 9 or 10. |
I couldn't agree more. 
[Edit: Wait - that was a one-line post: I <i>am</i> just like Macavity!  ] |
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JanMattys
Joined: Feb 29, 2004
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| Posted:
Dec 17, 2005 - 02:08 |
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Human blitzers will get Stand Firm on doubles (boo for those who take dodge).
Human catchers will get Dauntless on doubles (I guess that's THE choice).
Now... if orcs cage, I usually put a standfirmer right in front of the cage (I even try to dodge in contact with the ballcarrier, which works 1/6 of the times) and one guarder in front of each corner like this:
O-O
-O-
O-O
XYX
O = Orcs
X = guard blitzer
Y = SF guard blitzer
Now... time to blitz withthe Dauntless catcher. Either on the rear of the cage (best option) or on the side. After that (in theory) I have a sidestep blodger in contact with the ballcarrier, and the cage can't move onwards. With a single blitz, the basher has a single chance: get a pow on my catcher with a side of the cage, and double block + blitz on the front.
IF he fails just one of these four blocks I'll have a player standing near/inside the cage, and that's all I need to open the cage up.
I couple this tactic with the side-tactic of putting tackle zones everywhere on the pitch. My linos tie up all BoBs and blitzers they can. I get a lot of blocks in return, but my opponent has little to none mobility.
Now... this can have two endings:
1- At some point the blocks just won't be perfect for orcs. That's the moment when I try and go for the ball. If you can put some pressure on a orc ballcarrier, he's screwed. Additionally, if I have my catchers on the rear side of the cage, they are ready to counterattack should I pick up the ball (and go too far to be reached with their speed).
2- I suffer a lot of blocks, all end in a pow, and I lose 5 players during my defence phase.
I have a winning record with Humans against Orcs after 51 games: 24/11/16... most of them are at TR above 200.
That's not a big winning record I know, but still... |
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pac
Joined: Oct 03, 2005
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| Posted:
Dec 17, 2005 - 02:24 |
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Despite my earlier comments, in my last game (Humans vs Orcs) - since my last post and this - I actually did decide to try to break the Orc cage, and did it successfully in a similar manner to the one Jan describes. Lower TR teams than in Jan's example though: no SF Blitzers, only one Catcher who didn't have Dauntless (got it after the game, though!).
[Edit: I did say I'd likely soon be arguing the opposite point of view!]
... However, I should note that we had a two or three man advantage over the Orcs from the start of their offensive half. If we hadn't, I definitely would have been tempted to retreat and foul instead (although we lack a DP too).
Also, neither team was that heavily skilled up either. If more of the Black Orcs had had Block (none did), if more of the Orc Blitzers had had Mighty Blow (none did), I would have been far more hesitant about trying it on. |
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Diabl0658
Joined: Oct 05, 2004
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| Posted:
Dec 17, 2005 - 05:07 |
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What if the ball carrier has dumb off, and there is a nearby NOS catcher with high ag and leap? |
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Arktoris
Joined: Feb 16, 2004
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| Posted:
Dec 17, 2005 - 05:19 |
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then I would use shadowing to lock down the catchers |
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JanMattys
Joined: Feb 29, 2004
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| Posted:
Dec 17, 2005 - 11:52 |
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| diabl0658 wrote: | | What if the ball carrier has dumb off, and there is a nearby NOS catcher with high ag and leap? |
Then it's likely you're not playing Orcs |
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Diabl0658
Joined: Oct 05, 2004
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| Posted:
Dec 17, 2005 - 16:19 |
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| arktoris wrote: | | then I would use shadowing to lock down the catchers |
i said what if he had LEAP, as in you cant shadow him |
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Optihut
Joined: Dec 16, 2004
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| Posted:
Dec 17, 2005 - 16:41 |
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| diabl0658 wrote: | | arktoris wrote: | | then I would use shadowing to lock down the catchers |
i said what if he had LEAP, as in you cant shadow him |
You can shadow him (at least according to the LRB), but odds are he's going to be out of range for another shadowing.
The LRB says "The player may use this skill when the active player of the opposing team moves out of his tackle zone for any reason" bolding mine. That would mean that he could shadow not only on a leap, but also after the opponent blocks yet a different player and takes the follow up move after the block. I am not sure whether either instance is correctly implemented in the client, though.
EDIT: Clarification |
Last edited by Optihut on %b %17, %2005 - %16:%Dec; edited 1 time in total |
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Macavity
Joined: Nov 23, 2004
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| Posted:
Dec 17, 2005 - 16:42 |
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Diablo, put a tackle zone or two on the thrower, and Blitz the catcher into next friday! (since he sounds like a silly, no armour elf) 
Another advantage of humans is that your linemen are actual linemen. With elves, or Chaos, or Skaven, on double or stat increase makes you think they should into something else. With humans, you give them block, then tackle, and guard on doubles. You'd be surprised how many games against agile teams have players all spread out and you realize you need to try and smack a catcher (or GR, or whatever) and a lino has to do it. Well, gee, your lino has block and tackle, go catch that fish!!!
Maybe I should start a new thread talking about how wonderful humans are, whadda ya think? |
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pac
Joined: Oct 03, 2005
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| Posted:
Dec 17, 2005 - 17:21 |
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| Macavity wrote: | | Maybe I should start a new thread talking about how wonderful humans are, whadda ya think? |
Definitely: it can't be said enough.
My proud but drunk Norse just dropped into [U] - can anyone suggest a good Unranked home for an ale-swigging TR 184 Norse team? - so I can now found my long-delayed Ranked Humans! 'Mad' Mark MacManmarker shall be born! |
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zimsg
Joined: Apr 25, 2004
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| Posted:
Dec 23, 2005 - 04:44 |
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Yeah, thanks for the analysis. I'd been looking for something to help me decide how good this skills is! Definitely will consider for my orcs. But maybe not for the softer teams, since it means I'd have to leave one of my players next to one of his.. Minimize blocks!! |
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MiBasse
Joined: Dec 04, 2004
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| Posted:
Dec 23, 2005 - 22:02 |
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| zimsg wrote: | | Yeah, thanks for the analysis. I'd been looking for something to help me decide how good this skills is! Definitely will consider for my orcs. But maybe not for the softer teams, since it means I'd have to leave one of my players next to one of his.. Minimize blocks!! |
I'd seriously disadvice Shadowing for orcs... The only players who have at least a decent MA are the Blitzers but the MA still isn't good enough to forego skills such as Guard/MB/Tackle. After this one could start considering but pro would possibly still be a better choice.
Human blitzers are an entirely different story... |
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Macavity
Joined: Nov 23, 2004
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| Posted:
Dec 23, 2005 - 22:33 |
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My last two games with my human Blitzer (Vs Dark Elvs and Chaos), shadowing was used wonderfully! fun times! |
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pac
Joined: Oct 03, 2005
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| Posted:
Dec 24, 2005 - 13:50 |
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| Macavity wrote: | | My last two games with my human Blitzer (Vs Dark Elvs and Chaos), shadowing was used wonderfully! fun times! |
Thanks, Mac: I'll check out the games. Shadowing is so rare that you don't tend to trip over games where it was used successfully just by accident while speccing ... |
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SergeiBautin
Joined: Jul 15, 2004
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| Posted:
Jan 05, 2006 - 15:25 |
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| JanMattys wrote: | | diabl0658 wrote: | | What if the ball carrier has dumb off, and there is a nearby NOS catcher with high ag and leap? |
Then it's likely you're not playing Orcs |
LOL! |
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